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Yellow/amber rear turn indicators?

Discussion in 'Model 3' started by TEG, Jun 1, 2017.

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  1. TEG

    TEG TMC Moderator

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    We recently got this picture of the front of a Model 3 RC with the turn signals going and it looks there is a nice big LED yellow/amber front turn indicator:
    model3-signal1.png

    But what about the back?
    model3-rear-sig.png
    It looks to me like the signal is just the red brake light flashing on and off?
    Why not do yellow/amber like they do on Model X?
    On the Model X, I see that the same red brake light segment can switch to showing as yellow/amber when the turn signal is engaged.
    xsig-amber.png
    For comparison, here is the same car with the brake lights on, and turn signal off:
    xsig-stop.png

    Here is the video with the model 3 RC rear turns signals (and alternating with braking) going:

    (Starting around the 1 minute mark)
     
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  2. strider

    strider Active Member

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    In the US there are rules about the minimum physical size (area) of the brake lights, not just brightness. That is why many OEMs use the turn signals as brake lights - it allows them to have smaller light clusters. The X cluster is larger than S so they could use a separate element for the turn signals. I assume that M3 has a much smaller cluster (than X, and maybe even than S) and so they had no choice but to re-use the turn signals as brake lights (as they did in MS).
     
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  3. TEG

    TEG TMC Moderator

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    With the X I saw yesterday it looked like the brake light LEDs just changed color to yellow/amber when the signal was turned on.
    So, no extra space needed... Just dual mode LEDs.
     
  4. ikjadoon

    ikjadoon Member

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    So when you're braked and turning left (for example), the left side of the Model X has no brake light. Because the brake light is being used as the turn-signal.

    Eh. I think side-marker turn signals have been a good thing: either on the side mirrors or the front quarter-panel. If not side-markers, at least the turn signal light is on the far edge. When you're lining up a light, it's nice to know up ahead which cars will be turning.

    But, maybe it's not Tesla's style. On my car, I've four rearward-facing turn signal lights: rear taillight, side mirror embedded LED arrow, side mirror edge, and front quarter-panel marker. And they're all glorious amber yellow.

    I feel extra safe.
     
  5. TEG

    TEG TMC Moderator

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    Yeah, I agree... I don't like they way they are trying to simplify / dual purpose the lights.
    I wish there was just a dedicated amber flasher on each rear side separate from the brake lights.
    But they seem inclined to do otherwise for unknown reasons.
     
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  6. Winston

    Winston Member

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    European Model X's seem to have separate brake and indicator lights.

    Watch from 1:07
     
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  7. Uncle Paul

    Uncle Paul Member

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    LED lights tend to photograph strangely, especially in video mode.

    WIll need to see these lights on the road before jumping to conclusions.

    Believe Model 3 will have good looking and effective lighting.
     
  8. TEG

    TEG TMC Moderator

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    #8 TEG, Jun 2, 2017
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2017
    Hmm... Yeah, the X I saw recently was using the lower (what would be turn indicators in Europe) as red for braking.

    euro-x-lights1.png
    What I saw during braking on USA X:
    usa-x.png

    I wonder if this is a USA vs Europe difference, or maybe something they changed with newer X's ?
     
  9. insaneoctane

    insaneoctane Member

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    Hopefully this explains it.... The photos and videos of the brightness are unimpressive, but they might appear bright in person. Anyone who had an actual RC encounter care to weigh in?
     
  10. TEG

    TEG TMC Moderator

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    #10 TEG, Jun 3, 2017
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2017
    Here is a video of a US spec Model X doing brake lights, then hazard lights.
    You can see that the (red) brake LEDs get re-purposed to become yellow/amber for hazard or turn signal duty.


    The middle light segment above that that says is for braking on European X model is just a backup/reverse light only,

    In other words, these brake light segments next to the reverse/backup lights seem to only be active on European model X's:
    euro-sig1.png
    On the US spec Model X they just seem dead / never light up... Instead they make the turn indicators turn red instead.

    (The outer C shaped segments are the running / night lights )
     
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  11. Akikiki

    Akikiki A'-Lo-HA ! y'all

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    I particularly like that Tesla has the confidence with federal guidelines and engineering processes to just go ahead and design and install equipment without checking with TM and TMC forum members to insure what they are doing is okay.
     
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  12. TEG

    TEG TMC Moderator

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    Are you being flippant and suggesting that as long as they meet US federal guidelines, everyone should be happy/thrilled/satisfied with them and not question if they could be better?

    Do we know that the Model X "European mode" would not meet US guidelines?

    I am sure we could find examples of US legal turn signals that people find disappointing.
     
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  13. Akikiki

    Akikiki A'-Lo-HA ! y'all

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    Yes, and no. I doubt that anything said here and questioned by non-Tesla folks is going to make a difference.
    I think if someone does not like what or how Tesla is implementing or adding or installing on the cars they build, then don't buy them. Build their own so it "perfect". ;)
     
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  14. TEG

    TEG TMC Moderator

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    I saw this new Honda CRV where they got creative and did an LED vertical "light pipe" for the turn indicators.
    I found that they became hard to see when sunlight hits the side of the car.
    crv-lp.png
     
  15. TEG

    TEG TMC Moderator

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    Well, when I started dumping opinions and suggestions on the internet in the early days of Tesla, I think some may have actually been noticed and considered... But yeah, these days, I suspect I am just "talking to the wind" for the most part.

    But still worth musing just in case someone somewhere happens to notice and has some say in the design choices.

    If we never say anything then we only will ever get what someone else guesses we might want.
     
  16. Akikiki

    Akikiki A'-Lo-HA ! y'all

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    :) agree
     
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  17. TEG

    TEG TMC Moderator

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    #17 TEG, Jun 3, 2017
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2017
    bmw-4-led.png
     

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  18. alseTrick

    alseTrick Active Member

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    This is dumb and Tesla should feel dumb.
     
  19. alseTrick

    alseTrick Active Member

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    Why should I trust Tesla when their current headlights are below adequate on the S?

    Tesla doesn't always make the right choice. Often times they make the wrong one, based on history.
     
  20. TEG

    TEG TMC Moderator

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    So I bet they have a person, or even a team that have dedicated their life to automotive lighting design. They pour through all the regulations, costs, safety studies, and they keep revising designs. Then some amateur arm-chair internet weenie like me comes along and questions all that work. Yeah, I can see why some people would respond with "the nerve of some people to question the experts!"
     
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