You're suddenly well off, your lifelong friends are not. Now what?

[Ameliorate]

Just curious how some of you may have navigated this. I'm doing quite alright but suspect that gap will widen significantly in the coming years with $TSLA.

I skirted the subject with a best friend, wondering how one with a financial advantage could help another get ahead. Or at the very least keep your friends and enjoy what you've earned a little bit without showing off too much.

Like wondering at what point...hypothetically if one bought a house could it be okay to subsidize rent or let friends live there for free. His answer being along the lines of - If he's not paying his way fairly or something in return there would be a feeling of ownership like he's been bought, like he would never be able to complain about anything in the house. Yet collecting the rent would be like a tear in the ocean for the owner. That is just such a minor advantage too, I'm talking like 1200 a month for somebody making around 100k.

He suggested the wealthy person could use their influence to accelerate their career. Yet I feel that's just as bad because then you have no idea if you deserved a promotion at work etc.

It seems frustrating to have the ability to do most anything and yet you can't share it.

Is stealth rich really the way to go? Wouldn't you want a decent vehicle like a Tesla and a moderately nice house you can't ever invite anyone to?

Even without my Tesla investments I'm noticing widening socioeconomic gaps in my friends circle and not sure how to deal with it.

While they'd be dead set against being given money, and I agree handouts are probably kinda crappy I wanted to pose a question:
You would accept the money if it was Willed to you upon death, why not accept something from the living and enjoy it with them?

Being rich all alone doesn't sound like fun. How does one change their mindset about money if they've lived with scarcity all their lives.

Maybe I should just sell everything before this becomes a problem


All I got so far is: A. don't tell anyone, pretend you have nothing.
B. Get friends in on a lottery ticket and buy the winning ticket from someone.

 

[bballshinobi]

Long time lurker in the forum, this post hit home for me so I actually registered lol.

Long story:
My best friend and I started investing together around June 2019, which coincided with Tesla's big dip. Neither of us invested in stocks before so we obviously were very careful and played safe and mostly invested in ETFs. At the time I didn't even know Tesla was a public company until overhearing some friends talking about it. I was always in love with Tesla's story but in 2012 I was still a college kid so the price point for the Model S was way out of my ball park. I remember thinking at the time "I love this car, too bad by the time I make enough money to afford this car they would be bankrupt" because, well, almost all new car companies go out of business. Anyways, seeing TSLA was so low I started buying shares. Nothing big, just 10 shares to start. Then I started doing more research. The more research I did the more shares I bought, and the more shares I bought the more research I did. This whole time I was telling my best friend to buy, but he gave me the "I'll wait when it crashes again". In a year, I 10x my portfolio through shares and options. He finally bought 2 shares during the covid crash at around $450, and kept wanting to sell it during this recent climb. I had to talk him out of it every time. Now he's more of a believer too, but can't afford the stock price. I guess at least he's doing better than my others friends whom I told to buy TSLA, because the ones that listened still sold as soon as they make a small profit (most sold around $800). I can't even tell them how much money I've made with Tesla because it would be like 10-15 years of their annual salary. When I do talk to them about Tesla, I just tell them that they should invest and in the long term it'll keep going up just like Amazon, but they all look at me like I am crazy.

Short story:
Don't tell your friends you have a big position on TSLA because it's not productive. Don't bring up the topic of TSLA because I'm sure they already know you are a TSLA investor. Only talk about TSLA when they bring it up. Only give them general advice, or they think you are in a cult

 

[Ameliorate]

Love it, thanks for registering just for that.

So five years from now lets say you've got 4 mil in Tesla and your friends are still renting maybe just paid off their schooling. You want the car and so do all your friends, now you can easily buy the car. You know what I mean? It gets weird right?

Ideally I would like them to be at a point where they are closer to financial freedom. So that the expectation is not that you're the one buying anytime you go anywhere do anything. You still need confirmation that they like you for more than just your wallet.

Dating maybe easier to navigate, you can screw up and try again.

 

[bballshinobi]

Love it, thanks for registering just for that.

So five years from now lets say you've got 4 mil in Tesla and your friends are still renting maybe just paid off their schooling. You want the car and so do all your friends, now you can easily buy the car. You know what I mean? It gets weird right?

Ideally I would like them to be at a point where they are closer to financial freedom. So that the expectation is not that you're the one buying anytime you go anywhere do anything. You still need confirmation that they like you for more than just your wallet.

Dating maybe easier to navigate, you can screw up and try again.

Yea, I know exactly what you are talking about! It already feels kinda weird right now. I am 35 and I've always made good money compared to my friends, but as long as you are working for money you don't ever feel free. With the money I've made and hopefully continue to make in Tesla, I am actually beginning to feel freedom is possible.

However, it's exactly what you said... you can't talk to people about this except random strangers on the internet who also invest in Tesla lol. I can't talk to my friends about Tesla because I get so passionate I am afraid they think I am in a MLM or a cult. They all think it's a bubble because they all sold at $600-800, so imagine the eye roll when I tell them I believe this stock will be $6,000-$8,000 in 5-10 years. My wife thinks unrealized gains is not real money, but then I show her our realized gains she just worries about how much taxes we are paying lol

I can only talk about this in Tesla forum and subreddit. It almost feels like I have a secret life lol

 

[Ameliorate]

I can only talk about this in Tesla forum and subreddit. It almost feels like I have a secret life lol

Exactly. And that is one perfectly acceptable way to go about it. Hoping others may provide some clues for other options.
Feels like there could be better options than keeping this from everyone we know, like being able to share it with them .... but how?

I think that's a legitimate point that you're kinda bought by a company until/if you achieve financial freedom.

Is a person who was in the right place right time that now has 7-8 figures in their account worth more than the person stuck on 6? I don't think so. I'm certain there are many brilliant individuals who could have changed the world that just did not have the financial freedom to pursue their dreams. Why would humans take offense to being offered a gift of this nature because they didn't "earn it" ??? I look at Tesla with a potential to hit 40,000 SP decades down the road and my current holdings. I could never "earn" that kind of money. It would take me many lifetimes working my profession. Not unlike a professional sports contract or winning the lottery.

 

[bballshinobi]

Exactly. And that is one perfectly acceptable way to go about it. Hoping others may provide some clues for other options.
Feels like there could be better options than keeping this from everyone we know, like being able to share it with them .... but how?

I think that's a legitimate point that you're kinda bought by a company until/if you achieve financial freedom.

I think I hijacked your original post a little, sorry, because you were asking how to deal with the wealth disparity. Unfortunately, I think this is why men lose friends as we age. We naturally find it more convenient to spend time with people on the same level. If you are traveling with your friends it would be a little awkward if they can only afford economy while you want to fly business class, or if they budget for Motel 6 while you prefer better accommodation. If you rocket out of your income group then you will eventually disconnect with the people you used to socialize with, because the things they talk and do just don't interest you as much.

Isn't there a saying: "never be the smartest person in the room"? If you want to improve then you will have to find better company

 

[paydirt76]

Interesting topic. As of yesterday's close, up 11,600,000 in Tesla in 13 months.

Was hanging with some friends on 7/3 who are better off and have family who is CFO of a Fortune 500. Was like, "Sorry if a little spacey tonight. Made a lot of money on Tesla this week." They know about the Tesla investment but not the dollar amount. Was up 2.9 that week. This past week was up 4.2. It's shocking. It will sink in over time. What's crazy is 10.5 of the gain is in a Roth IRA. Tax free. It's like 18 was made and tax paid on it.

It's OK to have a heart felt conversation with your friend but be OK with them ending the friendship. Meet them in private. Be truthful with them but don't give the big dollar amount out (or even hint at it). Say it's more money than you will ever need. You worked hard to get this money (it wasn't easy, really, it was VERY hard) and you wouldn't have gone through the ups and downs if you couldn't use the money in a cool way. Without their friendship, this could never have happened. (Have a check ready and already filled out.)

Tell them you are giving them some money to make their life easier. Hand them the check. Tell them that it is VERY important to you that they take this money. At this point you might cry, they might cry, and they will take the money. Tell them this money is for them and for them not to give away to charity (the only expectation). Even if they doubted the Tesla investment--use this against them if true--their doubt fueled your investment. Let them know this is a one time gift and you want them to use this money while it can make their life better or easier. Do Not Cave. Listen to them and address every objection. Your love is stronger than their fear.

The main emotion you should be feeling is love. Don't be afraid they turn away the money. Don't have expectation for how they use the money. This is a gift.

Thanks to the OP @Ameliorate and @bballshinobi . There are a several friends who were great friends growing up that could use a large gift. This is a great reminder.

 

[bballshinobi]

Interesting topic. As of yesterday's close, up 11,600,000 in Tesla in 13 months.

Was hanging with some friends on 7/3 who are better off and have family who is CFO of a Fortune 500. Was like, "Sorry if a little spacey tonight. Made a lot of money on Tesla this week." They know about the Tesla investment but not the dollar amount. Was up 2.9 that week. This past week was up 4.2. It's shocking. It will sink in over time. What's crazy is 10.5 of the gain is in a Roth IRA. Tax free. It's like 18 was made and tax paid on it.

It's OK to have a heart felt conversation with your friend but be OK with them ending the friendship. Meet them in private. Be truthful with them but don't give the big dollar amount out (or even hint at it). Say it's more money than you will ever need. You worked hard to get this money (it wasn't easy, really, it was VERY hard) and you wouldn't have gone through the ups and downs if you couldn't use the money in a cool way. Without their friendship, this could never have happened. (Have a check ready and already filled out.)

Tell them you are giving them some money to make their life easier. Hand them the check. Tell them that it is VERY important to you that they take this money. At this point you might cry, they might cry, and they will take the money. Tell them this money is for them and for them not to give away to charity (the only expectation). Even if they doubted the Tesla investment--use this against them if true--their doubt fueled your investment. Let them know this is a one time gift and you want them to use this money while it can make their life better or easier. Do Not Cave. Listen to them and address every objection. Your love is stronger than their fear.

The main emotion you should be feeling is love. Don't be afraid they turn away the money. Don't have expectation for how they use the money. This is a gift.

Thanks to the OP @Ameliorate and @bballshinobi . There are a several friends who were great friends growing up that could use a large gift. This is a great reminder.

can I be your friend too? Lol

 

[MABMAB]

Talking to friends about how much money one has is a bit like unzipping your pants and showing them your member, not things to do.

 

[heltok]

My own story. Was a student living frugally. Started to play online poker and had some good years. Never told irl friends about numbers, just said I was doing well. My friends probably thought I was living month to month. When I was no longer allowed to stay in the student apartment I had been living in, I bought an apartment, decent one in a good area. One friend wanted to know how much loans I took. I dodged the question but he insisted, so I said I didn’t take any loans, I paid in cash. I guess that’s when the ball dropped that I was a bit more successful than he thought I was. Then the word started getting around I and could notice people looking at me differently and giving funny comments about what car I should buy etc. But I was mostly the same person to my friends. Then we grew apart, I guess that can happen no matter what, but I could afford a different lifestyle and choosing to do so accelerated the process...

I have met a quite a few people who went from normal to rich very quickly. Most go through different phases. First phase is about trying to do rich people stuff just to prove that you can, then realizing that it just awkward because it is not you, at least not yet. Then some time of slowly changing your image of yourself, getting more comfortable in different clothing, different contexts etc. Then realizing that most things people throw money at just takes time and energy and give very little in return, I am talking about boats, art etc. The last phase is the enlightenment where you realize that you can be happy living in a tent in the forest, happiness comes from within. Then the priority becomes health, family, friends, traveling and spiritual growth.

I recommend to spend some of that new wealth on regular health checkups, getting any problems fixed as soon as possible, getting a personal trainer at a decent gym where you live, get a therapist/coach if you need one and to find ways to do more of the things you like to do! Don’t add to much stuff in your life, live as minimally as you can and don’t be afraid to give away stuff you no longer need. Have few possessions but have quality ones.



*Advice for checkups, if you live in a country where they are prohibitively expensive or government wants to decide everything for you do them abroad. Once every 1 or 2 years depending on your age. Learn to interpret the numbers yourself, always factcheck your doctor by finding the latest meta analysis for any recommendation they give you.
** For therapists/coaches, there are many online ones, find one you vibe with but stay away from the ones who are too much feel-good or all about quick easy money(for them).
*** Learn about health, longevity, biohacking, nutrition, hypertrophy etc. Tons of audible books. Get a good practice of strength training, mobility and movement that suits your hobbies but also is good for your long term health.

 

[paydirt76]

@heltok Funny you mention health and family and making life easier more simple. It's been the exact focus. Health. Communication. Being Present. Getting Help. Reducing Overwhelm. All to make more Impact. Yup.

 

[Ameliorate]

Interesting topic. As of yesterday's close, up 11,600,000 in Tesla in 13 months.

Was hanging with some friends on 7/3 who are better off and have family who is CFO of a Fortune 500. Was like, "Sorry if a little spacey tonight. Made a lot of money on Tesla this week." They know about the Tesla investment but not the dollar amount. Was up 2.9 that week. This past week was up 4.2. It's shocking. It will sink in over time. What's crazy is 10.5 of the gain is in a Roth IRA. Tax free. It's like 18 was made and tax paid on it.

It's OK to have a heart felt conversation with your friend but be OK with them ending the friendship. Meet them in private. Be truthful with them but don't give the big dollar amount out (or even hint at it). Say it's more money than you will ever need. You worked hard to get this money (it wasn't easy, really, it was VERY hard) and you wouldn't have gone through the ups and downs if you couldn't use the money in a cool way. Without their friendship, this could never have happened. (Have a check ready and already filled out.)

Tell them you are giving them some money to make their life easier. Hand them the check. Tell them that it is VERY important to you that they take this money. At this point you might cry, they might cry, and they will take the money. Tell them this money is for them and for them not to give away to charity (the only expectation). Even if they doubted the Tesla investment--use this against them if true--their doubt fueled your investment. Let them know this is a one time gift and you want them to use this money while it can make their life better or easier. Do Not Cave. Listen to them and address every objection. Your love is stronger than their fear.

The main emotion you should be feeling is love. Don't be afraid they turn away the money. Don't have expectation for how they use the money. This is a gift.

Thanks to the OP @Ameliorate and @bballshinobi . There are a several friends who were great friends growing up that could use a large gift. This is a great reminder.

A little risky in that they decline or feel indebted but thank you for the reply!

 

[CyberGus]

Money doesn't buy happiness, but it sure is nice to cry in my Model X

 

[wws]

Keep your day job. Live below your means. Treat your investment accounts as "f- you" money - in case something bad happens.

 

[Davidzhao365]

My friend and I started investing last year at the same time. I got hooked into Tesla because I leased a model 3. I got all in Tsla step by step and tried everything to talk him to invest in Tsla too but he wouldn’t listen.

eventually he felt so bad about the fact that I made a lot and he even lost some. He told me watching me making more really hurts. And he does not want to discuss stock with me.

 

[Davidzhao365]

Also if feels lonely that I can’t talk about the money that I made with friends and most of the families.

 

[CaptainKirk]

I haven’t met up with a lot of my friends due to COVID, so they actually don’t know I have a model 3. For years I’ve been following Tesla and excitedly told them all about the exciting developments happening, told them about my first day pre-reveal reservation, and things I found amazing just by following SpaceX as well.

Over the years I got a bit of ridicule, some advice to sell and cut my losses when the price of TSLA fell due to funding secured, pot smoking on Joe Rogan and whatever FUD was tossed out there. Most recently this past summer, I was asked my advice regarding what to invest in, and whether marijuana stocks are a good idea. I advised that the weed ship has long sailed, but that Tesla was a better opportunity at a price around $200 for a number of reasons, explaining why I think the auto majors are in trouble. So much so that I dipped into margin towards the bottom of the dip.

I am pretty sure he didn’t take my advice, but I’m sure he will know things have changed financially for me once he sees the Tesla because I’ve always been frugal. I just hope the way we interact won’t change.

 

[Ameliorate]

My own story. Was a student living frugally. Started to play online poker and had some good years. Never told irl friends about numbers, just said I was doing well. My friends probably thought I was living month to month. When I was no longer allowed to stay in the student apartment I had been living in, I bought an apartment, decent one in a good area. One friend wanted to know how much loans I took. I dodged the question but he insisted, so I said I didn’t take any loans, I paid in cash. I guess that’s when the ball dropped that I was a bit more successful than he thought I was. Then the word started getting around I and could notice people looking at me differently and giving funny comments about what car I should buy etc. But I was mostly the same person to my friends. Then we grew apart, I guess that can happen no matter what, but I could afford a different lifestyle and choosing to do so accelerated the process...

I have met a quite a few people who went from normal to rich very quickly. Most go through different phases. First phase is about trying to do rich people stuff just to prove that you can, then realizing that it just awkward because it is not you, at least not yet. Then some time of slowly changing your image of yourself, getting more comfortable in different clothing, different contexts etc. Then realizing that most things people throw money at just takes time and energy and give very little in return, I am talking about boats, art etc. The last phase is the enlightenment where you realize that you can be happy living in a tent in the forest, happiness comes from within. Then the priority becomes health, family, friends, traveling and spiritual growth.

I recommend to spend some of that new wealth on regular health checkups, getting any problems fixed as soon as possible, getting a personal trainer at a decent gym where you live, get a therapist/coach if you need one and to find ways to do more of the things you like to do! Don’t add to much stuff in your life, live as minimally as you can and don’t be afraid to give away stuff you no longer need. Have few possessions but have quality ones.



*Advice for checkups, if you live in a country where they are prohibitively expensive or government wants to decide everything for you do them abroad. Once every 1 or 2 years depending on your age. Learn to interpret the numbers yourself, always factcheck your doctor by finding the latest meta analysis for any recommendation they give you.
** For therapists/coaches, there are many online ones, find one you vibe with but stay away from the ones who are too much feel-good or all about quick easy money(for them).
*** Learn about health, longevity, biohacking, nutrition, hypertrophy etc. Tons of audible books. Get a good practice of strength training, mobility and movement that suits your hobbies but also is good for your long term health.

I feel like I've already chosen friends/family over wealth in not revealing/spending it with concerns of jealousy etc.
I would rather keep these people in my life than have the shiny new thing. Ideally I'd like to help them make the jump towards better finances so we can all live more freely and not be concerned with the other person having more wealth. My friends circle (30 years old) varies from most successful - has house half paid off. On the other spectrum still paying off school loans and renting, more or less living paycheque to paycheque. Even without a Tesla windfall there's getting to be a large socioeconomic gap.

I live in a relatively expensive place, housing is 850k on average in town, maybe 500k an hour out of town. We're not talking new or nice either. I guess if they all were given 500k, that would put everyone on a much more even level and more interestingly, on par with their parents back when they were 30 potentially. I believe they all bought houses when they were 30 on a wage provided by a very mediocre job which is not remotely possibly today. My previous and I thought very good job of 10X,XXX would only qualify me for around 300k of a mortgage, supposed to save up 550,000? yeah okay. Anyways I feel a lot of this kinda stuff has created undue stress on my generation as expectations are, buy a house, raise a family, your parents did it why can't you blah blah. I guess that's another topic.

Though I agree health is most important and I was struggling with mine to the point where I had to stop going to the gym/working, both of which used to consume the vast majority of my time. Am finally getting back into the gym slowly but having to make massive financial decisions and keep secrets from everybody just sucks and is stress I don't need. I need a new space to live in where I can work on some projects and keep my mind busy/get my health back but if I buy a place with cash and am never working, it's not that hard for friends to figure out I came into some money. Maybe I'm overthinking things but every action has a reaction and I'm just trying to find a good outcome here. I kinda need a new place to live, I definitely need friends, I'd like to support them somehow to accelerate their growth to financial freedom.
That's kinda where I'm at. Again thanks for all the replies.

 

[ZOE5IVE]

Invest in your friends/family mindset. I personally will only take care of my parents. With my friends I would only come in play financially if they are about to lose their housing or if they suffer from a health crisis. With everyone else including my siblings I will build their mindset to break out of the lower and middle class that they are trapped in. With my siblings I have and will continue to pay for their schooling costs(books or whatever incidentals related to school) but not much more.

I've read a lot last year and that is the easiest way to get friends on the right mindset... recommend books or motivational YouTube channels. Doesn't have to be about investing could start a business etc.

I learned about stocks last year, and while sitting in a employee seminar talking about investing in a 401k until I am 65 I came to the realization that plan isn't for me. That it is ridiculous to not take risk. Did probably hundreds of hours of research into Tesla last year and invested heavily(drained bank accounts + closed accounts that just had money sitting) at last years bottom and DCAd. It made sense to me esp when you compare interest rates to return rates.

Best of luck!

 

[ammulder]

Though I agree health is most important and I was struggling with mine to the point where I had to stop going to the gym/working, both of which used to consume the vast majority of my time. Am finally getting back into the gym slowly but having to make massive financial decisions and keep secrets from everybody just sucks and is stress I don't need. I need a new space to live in where I can work on some projects and keep my mind busy/get my health back but if I buy a place with cash and am never working, it's not that hard for friends to figure out I came into some money. Maybe I'm overthinking things but every action has a reaction and I'm just trying to find a good outcome here. I kinda need a new place to live, I definitely need friends, I'd like to support them somehow to accelerate their growth to financial freedom.
That's kinda where I'm at. Again thanks for all the replies.

If you want to keep your cards close to the vest, I would think you could. How would anyone know whether you bought a house with cash or took on heinous monthly payments? How would anyone know whether you're not working or (especially these days) working remotely on some relatively cushy gig? If you say you're grappling with some financial decisions, how will anyone know that means what to do with this huge excess of money instead of how to get out from under the massive mortgage on your great new place? How will anybody know all your wealth came from investments you recommended to them and they didn't take you up on? Some people just get lucky, you know?

I will say that I have a circle of friends with modest income, except for two. One is the CFO for a faraway company and travels like crazy but has a monster house and income. We poke fun at him for committing to things he can never follow through on because when the time comes he's either actually traveling for work or way too tired from traveling for work. The other is just somehow independently wealthy, doesn't work and can do anything at any time of day, enjoys flying his private plane, etc., etc., etc. We poke fun at him for never working and whining about how his kid requires so many tutors to get into an elite fencing program at college. They're good guys and we like hanging with them and nobody resents them. So, maybe some self-deprecating humor can smooth over wealth discrepancies to a greater degree than you might expect.

Most importantly, money doesn't make you a good person and lack of it doesn't make you a bad person. People's circumstances are just different. If you're not in-your-face about wealth, and people resent you for it anyway, who's the one with the problem?

In closing... I have no idea how to actually put others on the road to financial independence. That seems tricker. The best I can come up with is to offer to loan someone $X of TSLA, on the assumption they can pay back X in a few years when the shares hit X*5. But that assumes they have the discipline to hold it. If not, things could go south quickly, and take the friendship right along.