YouYou Xue crashed while on autopilot (aka Model 3 Road Trip)

[Garlan Garner]

This should be a non-story based on that video.

 

[svp6]

Wow and stupid is an understatement.!!! Thank you for this post.
That post he did right there should make him the poster child of what you should not do and ruin it for others.

Why someone in his right mind would drive with the lights off at night is hard to understand.

 

[Garlan Garner]

Why someone in his right mind would drive with the lights off at night is hard to understand.

Why someone with his experience would do so is alarming. He's traveled the globe with his model 3 and with a video like that - blames autopilot?

What a shame.

What does he want? Tesla to replace his car? Insurance payment? I hope his insurance company sees that video. Our high insurance rates are because of videos and actions such as these.

I absolutely loved it when he went around giving people rides and promoting Tesla, however this changes everything in my opinion.

 

[Cosmacelf]

If my hand is on the wheel and AP makes a sudden move, it is easy to counteract it. It doesn’t take much force. If you have a local road with lots of tight curves that AP can’t handle (like near my house),it is easy to test. There is one curve in particular, at a road junction, that AP wants to drive me into a tree. But with a hand on the wheel and paying attention, it is easy to detect that AP is messing up and override.

At any rate, it sounds to me like it could also have been a mechanical problem.

 

[Runarbt]

..so most likely there was a loss of traction when steering right.

Could you please explain, how would a loss of traction in a right turn act?

The car moves forward and right.. loss of traction would change trajectory?

 

[voip-ninja]

Why someone with his experience would do so is alarming. He's traveled the globe with his model 3 and with a video like that - blames autopilot?

What a shame.

What does he want? Tesla to replace his car? Insurance payment? I hope his insurance company sees that video. Our high insurance rates are because of videos and actions such as these.

I absolutely loved it when he went around giving people rides and promoting Tesla, however this changes everything in my opinion.

He already said he is uninsured for anything but liability...

 

[Runarbt]

@ Runarbt

Not quite sure why you are so vehement and what the dude did is not that important anyway. What we care about is what AP did and why. He was on the phone and almost avoided the impact despite the delayed reaction so he has plenty of blame no matter what.
You are assuming that his statement is accurate and means what you believe it means but that's far from certain as his previous statements have shown that precision is not his thing and edits are often required.

I am simply trying to explore all viable possibilities while you seem hungry for verdicts.
Here's another one, he could have corrected for the loss of traction and that can explain it too.
You also seem to think that a dry surface means infinite grip but that's not how friction works.
Maybe chill a tiny bit and do remember that what really matters is what AP did and why.
You have a theory, I have agreed with it multiple times and you somehow felt the need for hostility and aggression just because I am exploring all options.

I just reacted on your claim I based my ideas on assumptions - when I felt it all was well documented by Youyou in his reddit explanation and pictures. Sorry I it came out agressive.. I have calmed down.

 

[nvx1977]

It's a bit hard for me to accept that given Youyou's experience with EAP, that he's never experienced the car doing funky things when lanes fork or merge. I've only used EAP for 2 months and I already know that if you're traveling on the right lane in a highway, and an onramp merges, the lane suddenly widens, and EAP will swerve to the right to stay in the center of the widened area instead of just maintaining a straight path along the left lane line.

The other thing I'll point out is that in a few attempts at auto lane change where I just hold the turn stalk before the detent, the car will start to change lanes, and if I let go, it inexplicably moves back to the original lane at the same rate it was moving out of the original lane. I've trained myself to use the 2nd detent in the turn stalk, and the problem doesn't occur. But the point here is that the car isn't suddenly swerving; it feels that way because it's unexpected.

I think in Youyou's situation, right before the road forked, the car detected what felt like a widened lane, and since he was in the left side, the car adjusted to move center. At that point, AP had to pick a lane (or crash right into the barrier, and it chose the right lane by default). All this happened in an instant, which to a driver that expected the car to maintain the left lane (and wasn't paying attention), can feel like a sudden swerve.

 

[Az_Rael]

If my hand is on the wheel and AP makes a sudden move, it is easy to counteract it. It doesn’t take much force

I have had AP move faster than me once before when I had both hands on the wheel in my 3. I was approaching a lane merge on my right and a car lining up in that lane to merge behind me. Had both hands on the wheel and as soon as the dotted line disappeared and the lane merge started, the car jerked to the right to recenter. It happened before I could react, and luckily the fellow merging behind me didn’t get his bumper clipped. If the car behind had been a hair too close, I would have hit him with no time to correct. I stoppped using AP where lanes were merging after that.

Since that episode there have been several updates that seem to reduce the speed to which AP makes steering corrections. I wonder what version of software YouYou’s car is on since he has been out of the network for so long.

 

[RedMS]

Glad he’s ok but happy his tour is most likely over. Karma finally caught up!

 

[jlv1]

I was taking a glance at the navigation on my phone, and was not paying full attention to the road.

 

[Cosmacelf]

I have had AP move faster than me once before when I had both hands on the wheel in my 3. I was approaching a lane merge on my right and a car lining up in that lane to merge behind me. Had both hands on the wheel and as soon as the dotted line disappeared and the lane merge started, the car jerked to the right to recenter. It happened before I could react, and luckily the fellow merging behind me didn’t get his bumper clipped. If the car behind had been a hair too close, I would have hit him with no time to correct. I stoppped using AP where lanes were merging after that.

Since that episode there have been several updates that seem to reduce the speed to which AP makes steering corrections. I wonder what version of software YouYou’s car is on since he has been out of the network for so long.

Yeah, I should have mentioned, I’m on AP1 in a Model X, so probably not at all applicable to what a Model 3 does.

But I’ll second the caution about lane merges. I always disable AP for lane merges, it just doesn’t work right and can cause an accident.

 

[Garlan Garner]

He already said he is uninsured for anything but liability...

Really? Are you kidding?

It's getting worse.

 

[Az_Rael]

Yeah, I should have mentioned, I’m on AP1 in a Model X, so probably not at all applicable to what a Model 3 does.

We have an AP 1 S as well. Initially the 3 would make very abrupt moves when it decided to move. Way faster than I have ever experienced on AP 1. However, Tesla seems to have corrected most of that in updates, so I can pretty comfortably drive in the right hand lane now. I have started testing it on merges again, and it seems to be handling those better.

 

[Kant.Ing]

Google Maps

This gore area looks very well marked (with chevron), where one lane thru and the other lane exit which seems typical in that area. Trying to defend AP here, it must be something else or unwitting human error, right at that location.

Note the chevron is painted on the right side of the thru lane to the next highway entrance.

 

[sundaymorning]

‘I take full responsibility but...here’s a 12 page essay why it wasn’t my fault.’

I’ve tried autopilot on long trips, it reduces fatigue and I’m able to notice more hazards in my surrounding. Youyou was on his phone, even having 4 hands on the wheel wouldn’t help as his eyes were elsewhere.

 

[sundaymorning]

If my hand is on the wheel and AP makes a sudden move, it is easy to counteract it. It doesn’t take much force. If you have a local road with lots of tight curves that AP can’t handle (like near my house),it is easy to test. There is one curve in particular, at a road junction, that AP wants to drive me into a tree. But with a hand on the wheel and paying attention, it is easy to detect that AP is messing up and override.

At any rate, it sounds to me like it could also have been a mechanical problem.

Exactly, having one or two hands on the wheel really doesn’t matter. What matters most is that you have to have both eyes on the road so your brain can process what’s ahead. Youyou’s brains and eyes were on his phone traveling at high speed.

 

[Cosmacelf]

Exactly, having one or two hands on the wheel really doesn’t matter. What matters most is that you have to have both eyes on the road so your brain can process what’s ahead. Youyou’s brains and eyes were on his phone traveling at high speed.

Yes, people don’t realize that it takes a couple of seconds for the human brain to comprehend what it is looking at when you switch from one scene to a completely different scene. People don’t notice this, because most of the time you are looking at something continuously, and when you do switch, it is typically to a visual scene that you already know and have expectations of, so the lag time goes unnoticed. In an emergency, you may notice that you freeze, but what’s really happening is that your brain simply needs time to comprehend the completely unexpected visual scene.

That’s the main reason why not paying attention to the road is so dangerous, it takes much longer to comprehend what is going on in an unexpected situation that you think it does.

 

[polymathic]

I think the broader implications here are that many sacrifice reason and intelligent on the altar of social media fame. What people will do for a few likes and followers is both puzzling and demoralizing.

 

[hacer]

My Autopilot maximum speed was set at approximately 120 km/h, the speed limit for this highway. The highway was well-marked, well-maintained, and well-lit. The conditions were dry, and there was no traffic around me. The highway was two lanes in each direction, separated by a concrete median. The highway in my direction of travel divided at a fork, with the #2 right lane changing into the exit lane, and the #1 left lane remaining the lane for thru traffic. I was travelling in the #1 lane.

My left hand was grasping the bottom of the steering wheel during the drive, my right hand was resting on my lap. The vehicle showed no signs of difficulty following the road up until this fork. As the gore point began, approximately 8m before the crash barrier and end of the fork, my Model 3 veered suddenly and with great force to the right. I was taking a glance at the navigation on my phone, and was not paying full attention to the road. I was startled by the sudden change in direction of the car, and I attempted to apply additional grip onto the steering wheel in an attempt to correct the steering. This input was too late and although I was only a few inches from clearing the crash barrier, the front left of the vehicle near the wheel well crashed into the right edge of the barrier, resulting in severe damage.

So he was in the far left lane just 8 meters before this barrier and most of the car passed to the right of this barrier. The lanes look to be about 2.5 meters wide, with a similar distance in the hatch region. If the vehicle was centered, that puts the left side of his car about 4.7 meters from the left side of the barrier which looks to be about 0.6 m wide, so the car shifted about 5.2 m to the right in 8 m of travel at 120 km/h (33.3 m/s). That works out to a turning radius of 8.75 m! At 33.3 m/s that requires > 12.9 Gs of lateral acceleration.

So I don't think the story is correct.