YouYou Xue crashed while on autopilot (aka Model 3 Road Trip)

[J X 3]

So he claims that the car changed lanes to take the exit and that would be a problem but can his account be trusted?

Tesla or any other car maker can't really solve this anyway, any system bellow Level 5 won't handle everything.The system can get better but can never be sufficient.
The hard part is the perception software, interpreting the sensor data to understand the environment. If you do that right, you have Level 5, if you don't, there will be situations where the system fails to perform well.
Not that Level 5 is well defined and that needs fixing. For commercial viability, the system should perform better than the best human driver in any and all situations.
If Tesla or anyone else aims lower, they will get into trouble. It's not enough to be many times safer than the average driver overall. The world will look at this on a case by case basis as every person has human rights and the right to live is rather important. Being better than the best human driver is maybe not that difficult though as humans have very poor perception-reaction time , less capable sensors, not as precise as the robot and the robot will be able to always choose the best solution (once the perception software is sorted).

 

[Yggdrasill]

I'll give him credit for admitting he was distracted, looking at his phone. I hope he'll be more careful in the future.

 

[Yggdrasill]

So he claims that the car changed lanes to take the exit and that would be a problem but can his account be trusted?

May be that the line markings ahead of the exit have been worn away, because people constantly swap lanes to take the exit. Then the car might interpret it as one giant lane.

 

[tpatana]

It's new construction, google maps even don't have that part of the road yet on the street view: Google Maps

I assume nothing on AP relies on google maps information? Or could the new construction be part of the failure?

 

[J X 3]

May be that the line markings ahead of the exit have been worn away, because people constantly swap lanes to take the exit. Then the car might interpret it as one giant lane.

Only seen these 2 pics , can't be certain but the lanes seem well maintained.
https://electrek.files.wordpress.com/2018/05/img_1289.jpg
https://electrek.files.wordpress.com/2018/05/img_1290.jpg

He claims he was on the left so not the lane that goes right and that's the part I got to doubt. As a weird alternative, maybe the right lane was wider or AP read the gore zone markings as some kind of construction zone markings. W/e went on, there is a cause and ofc there could be some bug/fault/defect too but its usually simpler than that.

 

[tpatana]

Only seen these 2 pics , can't be certain but the lanes seem well maintained.
https://electrek.files.wordpress.com/2018/05/img_1289.jpg
https://electrek.files.wordpress.com/2018/05/img_1290.jpg

He claims he was on the left so not the lane that goes right and that's the part I got to doubt. As a weird alternative, maybe the right lane was wider or AP read the gore zone markings as some kind of construction zone markings. W/e went on, there is a cause and ofc there could be some bug/fault/defect too but its usually simpler than that.

I'd assume such new roads, the lane markings should be still good.

 

[Runarbt]

May be that the line markings ahead of the exit have been worn away, because people constantly swap lanes to take the exit. Then the car might interpret it as one giant lane.

He says the car turned right.. (to take the exit) He corrected, but too late and hit the the left side of the car in the right side of the median.


Doesnt this sound lik he actually turned the car left himself, and hence he did it - not AP which wanted to take the exit?

For the car to hit its left side in the median, it has to move left - not right like AP did.

 

[J X 3]

He says the car turned right.. (to take the exit) He corrected, but too late and hit the the left side of the car in the right side of the median.


Doesnt this sound lik he actually turned the car left himself, and hence he did it - not AP which wanted to take the exit?

For the car to hit its left side in the median, it has to move left - not right like AP did.

Interesting observation, you might be right unless the car was on that lane all along and simply failed to make the turn due to speed.

 

[WarpedOne]

Sooo... AP steered right following the exit lane.
You You you realized he did not want to do that and turned the steering wheel LEFT, but he was too late and hit that center divider.

And all the internet will blame the AP for YouYou wrong reaction for the next half a year.

 

[Runarbt]

Interesting observation, you might be right unless the car was on that lane all along and simply failed to make the turn due to speed.

If you see his reddit statment:

"my Model 3 veered suddenly and with great force to the right. I was taking a glance at the navigation on my phone, and was not paying full attention to the road. I was startled by the sudden change in direction of the car, and I attempted to apply additional grip onto the steering wheel in an attempt to correct the steering. "

Car turn right, he is startled, tries to correct. Car hits left side into right side of median. = Car turns right - he correct car . ie. turn left and crash.

It seem rather obivous imo.

 

[J X 3]

Might be that he turned left but it's hard to be certain of much with little data and assumptions.
The car loosing traction might also be a possibility but hard to be certain on this one. If the car did a hard right and he made it worse by steering right, loosing grip wouldn't be out of the question and might result in the damage we are seeing.

 

[Runarbt]

Might be that he turned left but it's hard to be certain of much with little data and assumptions.

Really?

I just use facts from YouYous reddit statement, and try to deduct what happened.

"..my Model 3 veered suddenly and with great force to the right... I attempted to apply additional grip onto the steering wheel in an attempt to correct the steering. "

How do you correct a thing turning right - which way do you turn? Only logical is straight or left - both will prevent car from going right - which is away from the barrier. - hence he admit he worked against AP which turned car away from barrier - he did it himself actually.

The car loosing traction might also be a possibility but hard to be certain on this one. If the car did a hard right and he made it worse by steering right, loosing grip wouldn't be out of the question and might result in the damage we are seeing.

He says "The highway was well-marked, well-maintained, and well-lit. The conditions were dry, and there was no traffic around me. "

Source: YouYou himself
My statement regarding the collision on Autopilot • r/teslamotors

 

[WarpedOne]

Additional thought on:

"..my Model 3 veered suddenly and with great force to the right... I attempted to apply additional grip onto the steering wheel in an attempt to correct the steering.

What if AP did saw that center divider and sudden veering to the right with great force was AP's attempt to steer away from it?
YouYou's reflex countered it by puling the wheel into the left, resulting in car not clearing the center divider any more.

I bet this will be the result of reading the car logs.

 

[J X 3]

@ Runarbt

Not quite sure why you are so vehement and what the dude did is not that important anyway. What we care about is what AP did and why. He was on the phone and almost avoided the impact despite the delayed reaction so he has plenty of blame no matter what.
You are assuming that his statement is accurate and means what you believe it means but that's far from certain as his previous statements have shown that precision is not his thing and edits are often required.

I am simply trying to explore all viable possibilities while you seem hungry for verdicts.
Here's another one, he could have corrected for the loss of traction and that can explain it too.
You also seem to think that a dry surface means infinite grip but that's not how friction works.
Maybe chill a tiny bit and do remember that what really matters is what AP did and why.
You have a theory, I have agreed with it multiple times and you somehow felt the need for hostility and aggression just because I am exploring all options.

 

[J X 3]

Changed my mind actually on the steering left theory. The way the barrier and the vehicle are deformed do not fit well.
If he would have steered left, the front of the car would have made first contact and suffered the most damage. The barrier's damage suggests a different trajectory too. It's not entirely impossible if he turned left just at the right time but he hit the right corner of the barrier with the front wheel so most likely there was a loss of traction when steering right.

 

[smak]

This reminds me of the one AP feature that when getting my car I thought would be great.

User submitted problem areas.

Maybe that is something you can do, but people should be able to mark a problem area, and somehow AP won't work within 1/2 mile.

Either you can mark in your own car, or submit to Tesla, and send video if you have, or Tesla can investigate, and send an update.

Then you can turn on/off this feature that will block AP from working in a particular area.

 

[PoitNarf]

So he was looking at some navigation app on his phone when this happened. If his Model 3 was designed for cellular networks overseas he wouldn’t have to rely on his phone for navigation. If his Model 3 did have a working data connection (and therefor working maps) he may not have been looking at his phone at all once autopilot started doing some unexpected stuff. I’m not saying that’s where the blame lies, just that it’s another factor in all of this.

 

[cellogig]

I just saw this video he posted on Facebook evidently. Wow, stupid. Not sure how anyone in their right mind could say he’s using autopilot correctly.

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=940152862822850

Wow and stupid is an understatement.!!! Thank you for this post.
That post he did right there should make him the poster child of what you should not do and ruin it for others.

 

[Garlan Garner]

WOW.....what a horrible video.

Its a shame he blamed Auto Pilot.

Elon did state that "people unfamiliar with Autopilot ARENT the ones crashing. Complacency is the problem". I say....stupidity is the problem.

 

[bro1999]

I am pretty sure he BECAME overconfident in AP capabilities. Same as the very first Tesla fatality.

Owner over-trusts semi-autonomous driving system called Autopilot.