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Zero phone lock/unlock issue in the last 2 days

tuoncan

Member
Sep 10, 2017
130
191
California
So I found out that I only need to have Bluetooth on to unlock the car. Internet is needed to use the app to control the car. I don't remember what needs GPS on but I remember that it asked me to do that once. Maybe it's Summon that needs it. Since I have added my m3 as a trusted device on my phone so far I don't need to unlock my phone anymore. I wonder if my phone turns off Bluetooth automatically to save power if I let it sleep for so long. This could explain the only one time where the car won't open the door unless I unlocked my phone.
I found it's a security issue if someone can unlock your car just having your lock phone nearby. Can someone stalk you and wait for you to come near your car and run in and steal the car?
 

PoitNarf

My dog's breath smells like dog food
Jun 7, 2016
2,870
4,011
NJ
So I found out that I only need to have Bluetooth on to unlock the car. Internet is needed to use the app to control the car. I don't remember what needs GPS on but I remember that it asked me to do that once. Maybe it's Summon that needs it. Since I have added my m3 as a trusted device on my phone so far I don't need to unlock my phone anymore. I wonder if my phone turns off Bluetooth automatically to save power if I let it sleep for so long. This could explain the only one time where the car won't open the door unless I unlocked my phone.
I found it's a security issue if someone can unlock your car just having your lock phone nearby. Can someone stalk you and wait for you to come near your car and run in and steal the car?

Yes I believe Summon requires GPS as a safety measure so you can’t move your Model 3 around when you’re no where near it. The Model 3 cannot drive unless it detects the phone key on the inside of the car, so some random person couldn’t sneak into your Model 3 and drive it away if your phone is just close by.
 

Runt8

Active Member
May 19, 2017
1,986
2,373
Colorado
I found it's a security issue if someone can unlock your car just having your lock phone nearby. Can someone stalk you and wait for you to come near your car and run in and steal the car?
If it’s an issue on the Model 3, then it’s also an issue with every other vehicle with a keyless entry system.
 
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jsmay311

Active Member
Apr 22, 2016
1,178
1,693
Chicago suburbs
If it’s an issue on the Model 3, then it’s also an issue with every other vehicle with a keyless entry system.

I mostly agree. But RF fob-based systems have much better accuracy in determining the fob's precise location compared to a phone. So any issue with this would likely be amplified with Tesla's phone key.

Plus, with my current (non-Tesla) car, it will only allow you to unlock doors on the side that the fob is on. So if I'm on the driver's side of my car, someone else can NOT unlock/open a door on the passenger side before I do so on the driver's side.

Had anyone verified how this works on a Model 3? I.e., if your phone is X feet away from the driver's side door and the doors are locked, can someone on the passenger side of the car unlock the car (and vice versa)?
 

Runt8

Active Member
May 19, 2017
1,986
2,373
Colorado
I mostly agree. But RF fob-based systems have much better accuracy in determining the fob's precise location compared to a phone. So any issue with this would likely be amplified with Tesla's phone key.
Source?

Tesla isn't using the phones location, it's using bluetooth proximity (which is a round-trip RF signal).

Not to mention that Model S and X use bluetooth fobs and I haven't heard about any thefts related to people managing to enter the vehicle before the person holding the fob.
 
Last edited:

jsmay311

Active Member
Apr 22, 2016
1,178
1,693
Chicago suburbs
Source?

Tesla isn't using the phones location, it's using bluetooth proximity (which is a round-trip RF signal).

Not to mention that Model S and X use bluetooth fobs and I haven't heard about any thefts related to people managing to enter the vehicle before the person holding the fob.

Will Your Smartphone Replace Your Car Key?

Consumer Reports tested it and the Model 3 couldn't even tell that the phone was not inside the car when it was as far as 5 feet outside the driver's door. My current car won't start if I hold the fob even a few inches outside the driver's window.
 

chronopc

Active Member
Jul 8, 2017
2,873
2,722
California
Will Your Smartphone Replace Your Car Key?

Consumer Reports tested it and the Model 3 couldn't even tell that the phone was not inside the car when it was as far as 5 feet outside the driver's door. My current car won't start if I hold the fob even a few inches outside the driver's window.
Is 5 feet a big deal? Even with my bad site I can make out if someone within 5 feet of me is trying to steal my car.
 
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tuoncan

Member
Sep 10, 2017
130
191
California
What worry me the most is the car will let you drive with the phone lock. I guess it's the same as if someone steal your car key and drive it away. To make me less worry about this, i think I need to get into a habit of turning off bluetooth when i exit the car. This way they need access to my phone to re-enable bluetooth to get the car going.
 

chronopc

Active Member
Jul 8, 2017
2,873
2,722
California
What worry me the most is the car will let you drive with the phone lock. I guess it's the same as if someone steal your car key and drive it away. To make me less worry about this, i think I need to get into a habit of turning off bluetooth when i exit the car. This way they need access to my phone to re-enable bluetooth to get the car going.
I'm going to do a test to see if it's possible to drive away without the phone. Would you still be able to operate the car once it gets past 5ft?
 

jsmay311

Active Member
Apr 22, 2016
1,178
1,693
Chicago suburbs
I'm going to do a test to see if it's possible to drive away without the phone. Would you still be able to operate the car once it gets past 5ft?

Yes. At least back in April when that article was written. They drove 10 miles away and there were no warnings about the phone not being in the car, which could be a big problem if you drive far away and failed to bring your key card with you. Hopefully firmware updates will fix this, but knowing Tesla it could be weeks or years or never.

Is 5 feet a big deal? Even with my bad site I can make out if someone within 5 feet of me is trying to steal my car.

I wasn't arguing there's actually a significant associated risk. I'm rather agnostic on the point. The only point is that the Model 3 is not able to determine the precise location of a phone as well as other cars are able to determine the precise location of a fob.

Has anyone determined the maximum distance from phone to car that still permits the doors to be unlocked? Or if the Model 3 allows doors on the opposite side as the phone to be unlocked?
 

Trevor B

Active Member
Apr 2, 2016
1,173
631
USA
I noticed that "lock on walk away" takes a long time (2 minutes?) to activate when (auto) headlights are on. I have "headlights on after exit"

Any way to fix this?
 

Runt8

Active Member
May 19, 2017
1,986
2,373
Colorado
Will Your Smartphone Replace Your Car Key?

Consumer Reports tested it and the Model 3 couldn't even tell that the phone was not inside the car when it was as far as 5 feet outside the driver's door. My current car won't start if I hold the fob even a few inches outside the driver's window.
Just tested this with my moms Toyota Camry Hybrid - I was able to start it with the key several feet away (further if the window was opened) and drive away without it. Once I drove more than a few feet away I received a key not detected message.
 
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TerriS

New Member
Nov 1, 2018
2
0
Boise
is there a way to make it so your car will not unlock until you unlock your phone? I kind of like the idea that someone who stole my phone couldn't also steal my car.
 

chronopc

Active Member
Jul 8, 2017
2,873
2,722
California
is there a way to make it so your car will not unlock until you unlock your phone? I kind of like the idea that someone who stole my phone couldn't also steal my car.
Yes, you can turn off auto unlock. Then you will need to open the app and press unlock or use the keycard.
 

Runt8

Active Member
May 19, 2017
1,986
2,373
Colorado
is there a way to make it so your car will not unlock until you unlock your phone? I kind of like the idea that someone who stole my phone couldn't also steal my car.
Pin to drive would have the exact same effect without having to take your phone out and rely on an internet connection or use the keycard.
 

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