LOL I read that as "cloud swearing". A car learning to drive itself based on how loudly you swear when it tries to ram you headfirst into an oncoming semi, with the swear wods uploaded into a Tesla swear cloud server :biggrin:
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Autopilot is already improving.
- Thread starter mobe
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LOL I read that as "cloud swearing". A car learning to drive itself based on how loudly you swear when it tries to ram you headfirst into an oncoming semi, with the swear wods uploaded into a Tesla swear cloud server :biggrin:
Johan
Ex got M3 in the divorce, waiting for EU Model Y!
So... If Tesla play this whole fleet learning thing right they'll be sitting on a veritable gold mine of real world data as other car makers move toward automated/autonomous driving.
Economics aside, would it be ethical for Tesla to sit on this detailed data as proprietary information? "Have the others learn the hard way" or share your knowledge? The ethical issues here it's not only $$$ in play, but human safety/lives.
Economics aside, would it be ethical for Tesla to sit on this detailed data as proprietary information? "Have the others learn the hard way" or share your knowledge? The ethical issues here it's not only $$$ in play, but human safety/lives.
Johan
Ex got M3 in the divorce, waiting for EU Model Y!
Yes. So are pharmaceuticals, fire alarms etc. etc. Spoken like a true not only capitalist but also non-solidarian. What if Elon is a believer of something bigger than and better than getting rich. Look at Tesla's main goal: to accelerate the advent of electrical transport. What if they mean: really, that's the real goal not the goal by which we're going to get rich. Elon uses wealth and money to make things happen, I truly believe he doesn't value money or wealth in itself, but only the way in which it's a tool to impact the world and humanities future. I know it sounds grand but I truly believe these may be his motives.
It's a good question. For me, the more interesting question is not "is it ethical," but "will they open the data for any reason." The ethical question is difficult to answer because you cannot control how others use this data - safety is certainly the end goal, but used improperly, it could harm more than help.
Regardless of the ethics, how valuable is the data to other manufacturers? Assuming they have the same sensor suite, it's likely to have some value. The vehicle controls, shape, response, etc would need to be tweaked, and the sensor locations will obviously make things a bit more complicated. My guess is that it has a lot more proprietary value than open value. And when BMW, Mercedes, etc., get their sensors sending feedback to their HQ, it'll take no longer than a few days before they're up to speed. Their scope and production numbers are that much larger.
Johan
Ex got M3 in the divorce, waiting for EU Model Y!
Great considerations, especially the proprietary value of the data, and relative low value to others makes it just a thought experiment, not a real issue.
Cyclone
Cyclonic Member ((.oO))
True, but absent other manufacturers setting up their cars to phone home and update the fleet, I could see others licensing the Tesla Map data for static loading to the cars in the fleet (perhaps at service intervals). There is real value in having the network phone home, but that means others have to build it. They may yet do so.
I doubt AP improvements we are seeing now has anything to do with "fleet learning"; that will come with 7.01. However, one simple way to explain some of the reported improvement in not taking the wrong exit lane could be that the car is averaging your car behavior based on GPS location.
Based on GPS, the air suspension and remote can learn to activate, why not auto steer to learn not to take a sharp right to exit freeway?
personally I love AP and frankly I am not sure whether the improvement I feel is from me knowing the AP limits better or it actually improved.
Based on GPS, the air suspension and remote can learn to activate, why not auto steer to learn not to take a sharp right to exit freeway?
personally I love AP and frankly I am not sure whether the improvement I feel is from me knowing the AP limits better or it actually improved.
Spoken like how I see it. I don't care either way what Tesla does with its data but I can guarantee you, there is no ethical quandary about this. If you think Elon is losing sleep if Tesla should actively share and publish their algorithms and software about how they detect collision, road signs, debris, or how they center their car within a lane, etc. with Mercedes and Hyundai to save lives, you don't live in the real world. Their engineers are too busy getting **** done. Tesla is not the Android of the automobile world. Their patents are open but they still have to survive and compete against well established and well funded competitors.
If Tesla gives away all their proprietary software, algorithm and data to their competitors in a Kumbaya moment of saving lives, they will themselves need saving from all the barbarians at the gates (including Apple). Besides, where does this benevolence end? Open sourcing Patents is one thing, giving competitors your crown jewels like say, battery management software (you know.. to save lives so that it doesn't explode) is just being naive about how a competitive market works.
Johan
Ex got M3 in the divorce, waiting for EU Model Y!
Thanks, great reply! I agree, I'm a realist too and I understand Tesla will be in aggressive growth/profit mode for many, many years still to come....probably way beyond autonomous driving.
billarnett
Member
I just came back from a trip across the Sierras on Hwy 120 thru Yosemite. The TACC was almost useless because of this "feature" :-( Sometimes, and I couldn't accurately predict when, it would slow down for a corner by a huge amount, 10 or 20 mph, even though in my judgement it would have been easy to negotiate the corner with no speed reduction at all. Other times I felt some speed reduction would have been appropriate but it slowed down MUCH more than I wanted. I tried fighting it with the accelerator but that is more work than driving manually. I was forced to turn off the AP :-(
Of course, slowing and accelerating thru corners wastes energy.
OTOH, my wife liked it.
Clearly, this algorithm needs more than tweaking. It needs a user setting to tell it how aggressively to slow down. Or at least a way to turn this "feature" off without disabling the rest of the AP.
Johan
Ex got M3 in the divorce, waiting for EU Model Y!
Bill,
Your should listen to your wife. If she likes it it probably means the way you're normally driving is too aggressive (according to your wife, and the wife is almost always right, as all married men know).
Your should listen to your wife. If she likes it it probably means the way you're normally driving is too aggressive (according to your wife, and the wife is almost always right, as all married men know).
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sillydriver
Member
So EM announced 'Autopilot 1.01' -- What is the consensus here on how it's going to be delivered? I think my car has the .56 release, and I hear talk of a .77 release on the main v7.0 thread. Is that it? Or another build that will show up soon? Or we skip to v7.01? Or is this a hint they are about to release v7.1? Or will they download the changed algorithm over the air without going through the process of having us install a new build?
Cyclone
Cyclonic Member ((.oO))
Don't forget that Tesla has reps that read these forums those as their permanent jobs. I started a thread a few days ago about a trunk concern and 36 hours later my service center gave me a call because HQ forwarded my message to them. Similar things could happen with the AP engineering team.
anxman
Member
I can't say wether it's improving for me yet, because it just performed flawlessly when I tested it on 80 km's of "interstate". It drove perfectly from the on-ramp to the off-ramp. It was quite spooky actually to just sit there and let the car drive itself.
I will admit that conditions were good, it was a clear night and the roads here have clear markings for the system to follow. But it really did work and it worked well.
I will admit that conditions were good, it was a clear night and the roads here have clear markings for the system to follow. But it really did work and it worked well.
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