Service and communication (out of main)

[neroden]

These are probably just one-off problems, but they're bad ones:

Model S shut down at 32 miles, leaving me stranded - why?
Service refusing to admit that the battery is defective. WTH, Tesla?

Tesla is either extremely incompetent, or extremely dishonest, or both.
Bad, confusing, misleading delivery experience. Do NOT buy a used P90DL from Tesla.
(Same incident) Refund delays.

By contrast, these are definitely affecting large groups of people, and the worst problem is dishonest communications:
2019 Supercharging Speed Update Nerfed Overall Charge Times
Sudden Loss Of Range With 2019.16.x Software

 

[ReddyLeaf]

Looking like Tesla is starting to find out that building the car is the easy part.

 

[neroden]

The crazy thing is that some of this really really really should be easy. Like, hire enough people to answer the phones, and have a single system to track all of the issues of one customer, which everyone can see, and process refunds fast and automatically with a small "refunds department" made of easy-to-reach humans to handle issues like new addresses or changed credit cards.

 

[sweter]

This is the only problem I have with Musk. He's an engineer and loves finding "silver bullet" solutions to problems (I did roll my eyes when he mentioned that car will order broken parts itself or other "improvements" to service via app), while sometimes some problems are best solved with brute force. Service is one of those. They should just go on a hiring spree, get a VP of Service or smth and let him/her solve this, not Musk himself.

 

[DurandalAI]

I don't see any problem with requesting service via the app exclusively with exception to roadside assistance, in theory. However, contact should be made by a human to the customer within 24 hours at maximum to confirm the needs, etc. If a customer doesn't receive a reply in 24 hours, it's a problem. Centralized ticketing across all mobile and SCs would allow for HQ to review aging tickets, and identify commonalities between tickets to identify service trends. Callbacks should be handled in a centralized call center to allow for trending and consolidation of human resources which will cut costs. When you call the customer instead of having customers call you, you maximize the efficiency of your call center workers.

Centralized ticketing across all divisions
Centralized call center to return calls within 24 hours!
Every interaction should be commented/logged to the vehicle.

NO customer should wait over 24 hours for a response to an inquiry.

Now, my personal experience with putting in emails, etc is sending notes down the memory hole. They do need to fix this.

 

[Mario Kadastik]

Well just a few datapoints. As I was on a roadtrip the past two weeks when I arrived in Stockholm after overnight ferry the GPS didn't reset to the new location. I ended up calling roadside 3x over 28h to get it resolved. The first try took 45 min, the second 34 min and the third 50 min until I got ahold of someone.

Arriving in Copenhagen with a squeaking car they were full, but did take a quick look and agreed that this squeaking is beyond abysmal, they luckily had the upper link arm in stock (they were amazed too) and replaced it under warranty while giving me a loaner that I took to the zoo with my family.

In general though, the recent change to app/online booking only is horrible. We operate a rental fleet, we are outside of the core market (with Helsinki just 100km away, but over sea). We have frequent enough issues that we were exchanging e-mails with Service weekly if not more often. We had developed our own communication lines until they were cut. The general e-mail didn't work anymore, phone was an endless wait and for what ever reason most people in Estonia didn't have Schedule Service button in the app.

If I now try to book an appointment I see times in september(!!!). In most cases we just need Tesla to do prediag, help us understand what the issue may be and we have a local garage take care of the rest. In extreme cases we come in as the trip to Helsinki costs us ~200€ so every single service visit is costly. We were able to recover communications after I wrote to the Nordic service manager whom I know from old times when Tesla still had decent service. He re-established communication lines and now we can communicate directly with Helsinki service.

However they are awfully overloaded, even pre-diag queues are weeks at times, which is kind of abnormal when you have a car pop up with 10 errors in the middle of the night and noone has even a lookie for 3 weeks. No communication, nothing. Hopefully now that the service manager is involved things move along better (the past two weeks have been better), but service is the one reason that I've gone from total Tesla promoter (I owned the first S and first X in Estonia) to being cautious. I'd like to expand the fleet by multiple 3's, but first off we can't buy them in Other EU (in fact we can not buy ANY Tesla anymore as there is no Other EU price list) and secondly I don't know how the service and parts will be. We've waited for the nosecone of a 2016 Model S for 4 months. Yeah we could sticker the old one back and could keep driving, but seriously... parts logistics and service can be the tombstone so I agree, this needs to be brought to Elon's attention HARD.

 

[Sudre]

The crazy thing is that some of this really really really should be easy. Like, hire enough people to answer the phones, and have a single system to track all of the issues of one customer, which everyone can see, and process refunds fast and automatically with a small "refunds department" made of easy-to-reach humans to handle issues like new addresses or changed credit cards.

Not when you divert the entire field employee groups all to delivery only.

 

[MarcusMaximus]

These are probably just one-off problems, but they're bad ones:

Model S shut down at 32 miles, leaving me stranded - why?
Service refusing to admit that the battery is defective. WTH, Tesla?

Tesla is either extremely incompetent, or extremely dishonest, or both.
Bad, confusing, misleading delivery experience. Do NOT buy a used P90DL from Tesla.
(Same incident) Refund delays.

By contrast, these are definitely affecting large groups of people, and the worst problem is dishonest communications:
2019 Supercharging Speed Update Nerfed Overall Charge Times
Sudden Loss Of Range With 2019.16.x Software

I think those last two are from the update that tried to prevent overheating of the cells to the point of combustion... doesn’t really strike me as a service issue, just an update to protect the battery.

 

[Skipdd]

I think those last two are from the update that tried to prevent overheating of the cells to the point of combustion... doesn’t really strike me as a service issue, just an update to protect the battery.

The service issue is the lack of communication, and (perhaps unintentional) attempt to obsfucate what is occurring - which is also a communications issue. Fundamentally they are creating a trust and confidence issue. This is as much a strategic threat to their business as anything else.

 

[neroden]

I don't see any problem with requesting service via the app exclusively]

Not everyone has a smartphone. Yes, really.
App *or website* would be tolerable, but still doesn't really make sense. The cost of answering the phone is low.

with exception to roadside assistance, in theory. However, contact should be made by a human to the customer within 24 hours at maximum to confirm the needs, etc. If a customer doesn't receive a reply in 24 hours, it's a problem. Centralized ticketing across all mobile and SCs would allow for HQ to review aging tickets, and identify commonalities between tickets to identify service trends. Callbacks should be handled in a centralized call center to allow for trending and consolidation of human resources which will cut costs. When you call the customer instead of having customers call you, you maximize the efficiency of your call center workers.

Centralized ticketing across all divisions
Centralized call center to return calls within 24 hours!
Every interaction should be commented/logged to the vehicle.

NO customer should wait over 24 hours for a response to an inquiry.

Now, my personal experience with putting in emails, etc is sending notes down the memory hole. They do need to fix this.

What you said.

 

[madodel]

Had Tesla mobile tech here today. I just wanted an increasingly loud squeak checked to see if it needed to be addressed before taking my Tesla on a long vacation drive in a couple weeks. That would not have been a problem last year or earlier. I could just pick up the phone and talk to someone. Now it's a major chore. Springfield NJ Tesla Service can't be called any more. "Use the app". I used the app and the only selections for service were Devon PA and Brooklyn NY. Not Springfield or Paramus which are a little over an hour away while Devon is almost 2 hours and who in their right mind would drive from Pennsylvania to Brooklyn, NY for service? . So I used the chat function and they tried to direct me back to the app. I told them that wasn't working so they passed my problem to Tesla Mobile Service. They couldn't give me an appointment until August 15 which is when I will be away. But they had a tech driving to a Scranton appointment who could stop off here on his way just to check it out. So kudos for the effort. He diagnosed the problem as control arm bushings and they passed the information to Springfield where I have an appointment next week (after my complaining on the chat app they apparently fixed the service center selections for me). Hopefully they can get the parts in time. I've either been really lucky or there are some really poorly run service centers elsewhere that people are experiencing and reporting about on the forum.

Tesla service has always been great for me. I have no complaints about the actual service. They have always gone the extra mile when needed. I have no complaints about my Sig X which was a great decision despite an almost 3 year wait for it. And to be honest up until this month I haven't really needed anythingin the past 2 years from them except wheel alignment. To me the problem is not being able to phone someone if you have a problem and need help figuring out what to do. There is no way my wife would deal with using an app. She likes the Model S but won't consider getting rid of her Lexus because she loves the service and that they at least pretend she is important and they care enough to offer her pastries she won't eat and fancy coffees while waiting for her car to be serviced. They need to allow people to at least have an option to talk to a service rep to discuss options for people who don't have a service center around the corner.

 

[neroden]

To me the problem is not being able to phone someone if you have a problem and need help figuring out what to do. ....

They need to allow people to at least have an option to talk to a service rep to discuss options for people who don't have a service center around the corner.

Good summary of the problem. I am DREADING trying to set up an appointment at Henrietta. I've got service issues on both of my cars but I'm putting them off until I can afford to waste days on trying to contact them.

 

[neroden]

OK, I started at 3 PM.

-- online chat doesn't exist
-- still no direct phone number for Mobile Service OR for Henrietta NY
-- online, can only "schedule" at Devon (can't schedule Mobile or Henrietta), can't "contact" anyone, so put in a fake appointment at Devon
-- main phone number, "service" -- "schedule appointment" hangs up on you (telling you to use chat which doesn't exist)
-- main phone number, "service" -- "vehicle currently in for service" hangs up on you after "mailbox full"
-- main phone number, "roadside assistance" actually gets a human after 5 - 10 minutes on hold. He says they get LOTS of people calling trying to reach the service department. (I tell him they will get EVERY SINGLE service call until they manage to fix the main phone tree.) He claims to be able to transfer me to service. I'm now on hold again.

----

Eventually got through to Las Vegas after 15 more minutes. Jared was able to schedule an appointment (he was very helpful), but not actually reach them. Now Henrietta is supposed to call me back. He also got me the Henrietta email address (which it turns out is published on the *map* but not on the *list* of service centers, aaargh), and the Henrietta phone extension.

It appears that the single biggest problem with Tesla customer service is the broken phone tree. Once I reached Jared in Las Vegas, progress was made. However, it was impossible to reach anyone through the "service" option in the phone tree, which was infuriating -- going through roadside assistance was the only way to get to the service support department !!!! Jared didn't know this. The guys at Roadside Assistance did know that they were getting tons of calls for service, though.

If it were possible to reach Jared immediately, it would have saved me hours of frustration and saved Tesla 30 minutes of phone time.

 

[cpa]

Tesla knows that labor is the most expensive component of most companies. By the time you add wages, overtime premium, payroll taxes, worker's compensation, compensated absences, pension contributions, and training, the effective hourly rate could easily be 40% more than the base hourly rate.

So, how to save on labor? Make everything computerized and techy. Reduce customer interaction to a minimum. Customer service, like the accounting department is overhead. They do not make a direct contribution to the bottom line; rather they are a burden on the bottom line. They suck a lot of money away from profit and from reinvesting in the business.

With the conventional automobile repair business, dealers have the dreaded "service writers." They are the contact for the customer. They explain the issues and provide an estimate. They notify you when your car is ready. They are overhead to the repair shop, but their salary is mostly commission-based. They get a cut of the $125/hour shop rate. They get a cut of the $650 worth of parts replaced. This may not be a perfect model, but we customers have a person to contact and a person to make complaints if the problem is not corrected. Clearly, we pay for this ability.

Musk is vocal. Musk is innovative, creative, brilliant, charming in public, and many other good things. But he appears to loathe the mundane, the trivial, the ordinary.

If he were serious about these perceived problems that too many of us owners experience or perceive, he needs to roll up his sleeves and get out into the field. He needs to answer the phones. He needs to hang around the service centers. He needs to see first hand what is going on in the trenches that have nothing to do with manufacturing or sales. Then he needs to hire someone to fix them, and pronto.

But he won't. Those pedestrian functions are beneath him. And to hire a VP for Customer Service and Relations and give that person carte blanche to fix these issues is relinquishing control. Musk will never relinquish control.

 

[neroden]

Either Tesla provides customer service (Jared did a fine job, but I have to be able to reach him), or they go bankrupt.

I hope Musk has enough sense to make the right choice.

 

[neroden]

More news (from a very longtime member) about Tesla DESTROYING its reputation by providing APPALLING customer service:

Tesla (the company) killing itself slowly?

 

[neroden]

Tesla (the company) killing itself slowly?

"Yes, this will sink the company."

Tesla (the company) killing itself slowly?
"He addressed it off the top of the previous quarterly meeting stating he knew of the issue & assured everyone that addressing it was a priority. Nothing changed. If anything, it got even worse since that lip service."

Tesla (the company) killing itself slowly?
"I gave up on buying a new Tesla because of similar service experiences I had. Saving money for the e-tron GT"

Face it, investors. This is a life-threatening event for the company.

Tesla (the company) killing itself slowly?
"The rapidly increasing production rates of the Model 3 initially put Tesla through "production hell", and when that was resolved, they hit "delivery hell", and now they're going through "customer support/service hell" in 2019."

Tesla (the company) killing itself slowly?
"The service issues discussed at TMC have exploded this year. I LOVED this company when I bought my car. I was so excited. But now I'm wondering if the misery is worth it and maybe I should just get an ICE until someone else makes an electric car that holds 6 people. How ****ed up is that? "

....
Actually, just read the whole thread...

 

[Singuy]

Tesla (the company) killing itself slowly?

"Yes, this will sink the company."

Tesla (the company) killing itself slowly?
"He addressed it off the top of the previous quarterly meeting stating he knew of the issue & assured everyone that addressing it was a priority. Nothing changed. If anything, it got even worse since that lip service."

Tesla (the company) killing itself slowly?
"I gave up on buying a new Tesla because of similar service experiences I had. Saving money for the e-tron GT"

Face it, investors. This is a life-threatening event for the company.

The service for Orlando FL is fine and I have been happy with them. Why? Because they are not trying to service a 400 mile radius. If no one picks up, I'll just drive to them and demand someone to see me.

Your expectations are nuts because no sane person would buy a car from a company with no service center within 30 miles away. You did and now you are dealing with the consequence. This is to be EXPECTED.

 

[neroden]

Tesla is now losing arbitration cases because they're trying to deny warranty repairs!

Update from Tesla service on screen yellowing

Apparently their managing counsel of product liability, Ryan McCarthy, is an idiot who tried to defend the indefensible.

Looks like they lost a second case over the same issue, with a third case pending:
Dispute Resolution - Ncds / Screen Defects / Anyone Ever Try This?

 

[neroden]

The service for Orlando FL is fine and I have been happy with them. Why? Because they are not trying to service a 400 mile radius. If no one picks up, I'll just drive to them and demand someone to see me.

Your expectations are nuts because no sane person would buy a car from a company with no service center within 30 miles away. You did and now you are dealing with the consequence. This is to be EXPECTED.

Tesla sells to people who live further than 30 miles away. The consequences are on TESLA. From an investment point of view, Tesla has to provide service, period.