Elon & Twitter

[hacer]

The mess continues unabated.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1590724257608134657

This is my "favorite" part:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1590725083294990336

Talk about an overhang. How about a multi-billion dollar FTC suit?

This could explain the selling of TSLA vs the bridge-loan thesis. Elon wants to iterate fast with twitter operations but the FTC consent decree doesn't really allow that. So maybe Elon just sees this as another cost of business so he's going to iterate fast and pay a few billions in fines to get it done.

 

[PeterJA]

Another payment system , so many already.
Why bother...

Maybe because the existing systems suck. Or are so mediocre that Elon's team can do better. My experience with Venmo, Western Union, and several banks has been a catalog of ineptitude and bad service.

IMO, the entire financial industry is ripe for disruption. Why does it take 7-10 days to clear a bank check? Why does it take 2 days to settle a stock transaction? Why does it cost $15 to wire funds from my brokerage account? This is the 21st century, yet the financial system is a patchwork of expensive isolated services kludged together like the old-generation microprocessors in a non-Tesla car.

So if Elon wants to disrupt the financial industry while simultaneously disrupting the media industry and improving social discourse with one super-app, then I'm all for it. When this app runs on Tesla car screens, maybe the newly minted Elon-haters will figure out that he had a plan.

 

[EVNow]

With stolen credit cards what's to stop them? The Russian's have plenty of stolen credit cards to work with.

They need better verification than just credit cards. Like mobile numbers and residence address with all the names matching and OTP. May be social security numbers and bank accounts too.

Afterall Twitter wants to be a financial player - you can't be that without solid verification system.

ps : Verification is not like "FSD". Lots of companies do it. There is a huge industry behind it. Twitter will have to pay the first month's subscription to get it done. May be charge a onetime extra fee for verification.

 

[Knightshade]

Once card number gets shut down/ reported stolen, all linked accounts get deactivated.
100k accounts need 100k credit cards and only last until flagged.

There's hundreds of thousands of stolen card #s just in the US alone annually.

Millions worldwide.

and that's just folks using stolen ones.

Folks wanting to do non-stolen-card ID fraud without that can use the self-generated card #s many issuers have available-- since those #s will never be reported stolen you can just keep generating them as long as you're willing to actually pay $8 per fake ID.... and govt actors like China and Russia have massive tens or hundreds of millions budgets for misinformation to do so (or use govt. backed banks to generate #s for that matter- if they're willing to pay it would be no obstacle at all)

 

[mongo]

There's hundreds of thousands of stolen card #s just in the US alone annually.

Millions worldwide.

and that's just folks using stolen ones.

Folks wanting to do non-stolen-card ID fraud without that can use the self-generated card #s many issuers have available-- since those #s will never be reported stolen you can just keep generating them as long as you're willing to actually pay $8 per fake ID.... and govt actors like China and Russia have massive tens or hundreds of millions budgets for misinformation to do so.

Re: one time #: Unless the card issuers allow confirmation that two one time use numbers originated from the same account. Alternatively, if they allow mechants to block root accounts from having charges approved (no privacy impact).

Re stolen #: each card get reported, so the most fake account up time is X cards (or less if card holder had Twiiter Blue) * 1 month (or less if providers do push notifications/ charge backs)

 

[insaneoctane]

While I've been grumpy lately, I continue to reflect, study and consider...

For all that Elon has done "wrong" with Twitter and funding and timing and...., would you prefer him to step down from Tesla? Are you so fed up with his antics that you think Tesla would be better off without him? The constant key-man risk discussions imply that is not the case for most.

So, that would mean many don't want Elon to leave, rather behave differently.

Hmmmm. It seems to me that some of Elon's superpowers stem from his lack of patience, his somehow motivational, yet impossible expectations that nothing can wait. Isn't his impatience for the virtual "town square"/ X.com the reason he's buying Twitter vs just building his own? Building it would not require 1/10 the TSLA liquidation we've been suffering through and would likely be far less controversial. He claimed that by buying Twitter it would accelerate his vision by 3-5 years. He mis-timed the market and overpayed for Twitter and is now having to sell even more TSLA at arguably the worst timing just to save some time. My point is that Elon is just being Elon. We can't choose which superpowers he has or doesn't, he's a flawed human and, thus, a package deal.

I find myself guilty of wishing he'd do certain things differently, but I feel the unique combination of characteristics/behaviors make Elon literally one in a billion, how could I presumptiously think I can tweak that without ruining the miracle that is.....Elon?

https://twitter.com/x/status/1577428673971777536

 

[BornToFly]

Stop it. ‘-if he can’t turn the ship around-‘ Really? Really? Can you give him at least a few days to fix what was clearly an extensively dysfunctional company? Can you at least acknowledge that people here have already reported positive changes?

So many of you need to be hugged and then given a cookie.

Just to clarify - I'm not worried. Elon has shown he can make a company lean and profitable. But the market is worried and won't buy TSLA as a result.

 

[NicoV]

IMO, the entire financial industry is ripe for disruption. Why does it take 7-10 days to clear a bank check? Why does it take 2 days to settle a stock transaction? Why does it cost $15 to wire funds from my brokerage account? This is the 21st century, yet the financial system is a patchwork of expensive isolated services kludged together like the old-generation microprocessors in a non-Tesla car.

A very US centric view. Europe‘s financial industry is a lot more modern. You can basically wire money from any EU bank account to any other EU bank account. In the worst case this takes a couple of days max, in the best case the payment arrives in real time.
In Belgium everybody stopped accepting checks as a form of payment 2 decades ago.
Electronic payment via chip cards is available everywhere. For situations where a bank terminal is too expensive (because of the rental price of the terminal) QR code payments are used more and more. There’s nothing to disrupt in the EU anymore. Elon can only create a me-too payment system like Paypal.

 

[Knightshade]

Re: one time #: Unless the card issuers allow confirmation that two one time use numbers originated from the same account.

Not understanding what you're saying here-- the card issuer doesn't care about any of this if the use is authorized.

Alternatively, if they allow mechants to block root accounts from having charges approved (no privacy impact).

They don't.

The entire point of those generated #s is the merchant gets no info whatsoever about your "real" account.

Re stolen #: each card get reported, so the most fake account up time is X cards (or less if card holder had Twiiter Blue) * 1 month (or less if providers do push notifications/ charge backs)

Ok. But again there's millions of such stolen cards annually- so plenty enough for lots of fake verified accounts.

 

[elasalle]

A very US centric view. Europe‘s financial industry is a lot more modern. You can basically wire money from any EU bank account to any other EU bank account. In the worst case this takes a couple of days max, in the best case the payment arrives in real time.
In Belgium everybody stopped accepting checks as a form of payment 2 decades ago.
Electronic payment via chip cards is available everywhere. For situations where a bank terminal is too expensive (because of the rental price of the terminal) QR code payments are used more and more. There’s nothing to disrupt in the EU anymore. Elon can only create a me-too payment system like Paypal.

But it is not just payment, it is mass comm switch blade knife ..video, news, payments ....

 

[thx1139]

It sounds like you doubt that is Elon's plan. In my opinion, it's 100% certified and guaranteed. That's what he's doing, and only new insight of a monumental nature could change that.

Why would anyone use or want another online payment platform? What kind of question is that? Clearly, you are not thinking clearly. Have you never used PayPal? Are you unaware that credit cards pretty much make everything cost 2-3% more? I'm not speaking of interest expense if you don't pay off your balance each month, I mean everything online and in stores is marked up 2-3% to cover the fees from MC, Visa, et al. I cringe when it turns out PayPal is my best payment option (due to the high fees).

All of this makes the payment system a HUGE part of our economy, very inefficient, like a huge tax on all of us. Yes, credit cards and PayPal, et. al. make it easy to pay, but at a huge cost. Almost as bad, a credit card or a PayPal account cannot replace your need for multiple other financial institutions. What if there existed a low-cost on-line bank that integrated all the functions from borrowing money to buy a car or a house, making payments, earning interest, exchanging funds between individuals, buying groceries, paying rent, holding crypto, etc. etc. etc. that was reliable, trusted, intuitive and made a profit by skimming but a small fraction of what legacy credit card companies, mortgage companies, etc. take from every transaction?

In short, VISA and MC and a bunch of other multi-billion-dollar companies would be disrupted. And good riddance! The financial sector consumes ~10% of our GDP which economists say is like a big tax on us all (ideally, the financial sector should be closer to 2-3% of the overall economy because it's inherently unproductive from a primary perspective). Elon wants to spend about 2% of our GDP to make life interplanetary. If he can shrink the financial sector by even that little bit, then he can take the profits that would have gone to financial types and re-appropriate it to make life interplanetary (or whatever other good causes are on his plate), all without being the slightest burden on anyone (except for the displaced finance billionaires).

Lower transaction costs. Sounds like a win for humanity. Any questions?

ANOTHER

 

[NicoV]

But it is not just payment, it is mass comm switch blade knife ..video, news, payments ....

We already have all that too.

 

[BornToFly]

Right now -
Nio +10.88%
RIVN +2.69%
F + 1.52%
TSLA -0.65%

Whether it's Twitter, or something else, the market just doesn't want to buy the fastest growing Mega Cap of all time....

 

[hacer]

You'd be surprised how many people have small fraudulent monthly charges on their CC that they fail to discover for several months. With a state actor running the scheme it's a very low cost of business - far cheaper than the (still easily affordable) actually paying for your disinformation accounts.

 

[EVNow]

The entire point of those generated #s is the merchant gets no info whatsoever about your "real" account.

Twitter needs to go full "Know your customer". Like financial institutions are required to do (anti-money laundering). Ofcourse there might still be some fake accounts (like there are ID thefts), but a very, very small %.

 

[FireMedic]

I hadn’t seen any links to this article posted, so I figured I would mention it. A bit OT but in boomer mama’s opinion, it’s quite pertinent to this current ‘Elon selling’ discussion.

Tesla Shareholders, be the wise guys

Going down the rabbit hole, again

open.substack.com

I’m a big fan of Jared Isaacman; and there does seem to be a strong relationship between him and Elon. Perhaps shift4 at bargain pricing could be a decent additive to twitter…and Tesla for that matter. I bought a few chairs as a placeholder.

Let me know if this is too OT or been already posted and I’ll delete it.

 

[PeterJA]

A very US centric view. Europe‘s financial industry is a lot more modern. You can basically wire money from any EU bank account to any other EU bank account. In the worst case this takes a couple of days max, in the best case the payment arrives in real time.
In Belgium everybody stopped accepting checks as a form of payment 2 decades ago.
Electronic payment via chip cards is available everywhere. For situations where a bank terminal is too expensive (because of the rental price of the terminal) QR code payments are used more and more. There’s nothing to disrupt in the EU anymore. Elon can only create a me-too payment system like Paypal.

Thanks for a European view. If wiring funds can take "a couple of days", then I'd say your system has room for improvement.

The US has near-ubiquitous credit card payment also, but it costs 2-3% of the transaction, as @StealthP3D pointed out (maybe while you were writing your post). Does it cost less in EU? Are all your banks online only? How much do they charge for accounts, late fees, currency exchanges?

I highly doubt there is nothing to disrupt in the non-US financial industry.

 

[mongo]

Not understanding what you're saying here-- the card issuer doesn't care about any of this if the use is authorized.

But they *could* provide that service.

They don't.

The entire point of those generated #s is the merchant gets no info whatsoever about your "real" account.

And the merchant still wouldn't under this setup:
Twitter: hey Visa, do not approve any future charges by us from the account tied to {one time number used previously}

 

[JRP3]

You'd be surprised how many people have small fraudulent monthly charges on their CC that they fail to discover for several months.

It's easy to enable email alerts for every purchase, everyone should do it. Admittedly I didn't until the first time I had unauthorized card use happen.

 

[hacer]

They need better verification than just credit cards. Like mobile numbers and residence address with all the names matching and OTP. May be social security numbers and bank accounts too.

Afterall Twitter wants to be a financial player - you can't be that without solid verification system.

ps : Verification is not like "FSD". Lots of companies do it. There is a huge industry behind it. Twitter will have to pay the first month's subscription to get it done. May be charge a onetime extra fee for verification.

Given twitter has more user outside the USA than inside, I'd be very surprised (but not shocked based on what's happened so far) if they insisted on getting social security number from everyone. Plus your suggestions are almost like real actual verification of identity which has, so far, been discarded as an idea for the checkmark.