Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

[M|S|M MYP]

All this bickering and all i want is one...one....one stinking green day!!!!

 

[Webeevdrivers]

I have to hand it to current Tesla CEO for possibly being one of the most tone deaf CEOs in history. While the stock is down-11% all the guy can talk about is his social media platform
Tesla needs a new CEO. This guy needs to go

Yep. Absolutely. Along with the entire board.

 

[2daMoon]

Talk is cheap. Actions speak louder than words.

He just paid 44 billion for a company that makes no money going into a recession he was talking about for 3 years.

I'm pretty sure that folks said many things like that about SpaceX, and Tesla too, and we all know how they turned out.

"So, yeah." - Elon Musk

Talk IS cheap. Just because most people can't visualize the potential of these projects as he starts them isn't proof that it isn't a good idea. In fact, the fact that nobody else can see the potential will be true of nearly every disruptive and revolutionary break from the status quo.

You do Moo, and Elon will do Elon

 

[EVNow]

Buying Calls? MM need to short the stock to derisk.

MM need to buy stock to delta hedge when someone buys a call.

ps : I should add, when I sell a call (to a 3rd party), MM doesn't need to do anything. They are just the middle man. Infact MM ideally would like to be not exposed either on short or long side. If they have net exposure, then they need to delta hedge. When they sell calls they need to buy stock and when they sell puts they need to short stock.

 

[Singuy]

Mostly agree. It is a little weird though since 2023, buyers won’t get the cash until they get their tax returns. They will have to qualify for the full loan and take out debt against the full amount including that $7,500. For some buyers that will be a deal breaker.

I am still very much in wait and see mode, on the impact of the IRA, it kind of smells too good to be true for Tesla. I think we’ll get a revision in their fairly quickly when the democrats realize what a gift it is. I’m sure plenty of republicans would vote for changes that reduce spend on EVs as well.


My big questions are around how much Giga Texas will shave off the cost to build a Model Y. This quarter and next are likely to see some significant feedback on the margins the new factories unlock.

For those who wants the 7500 up front will lease. I do expect leasing to increase next year.

 

[Ogre]

For those who wants the 7500 up front will lease. I do expect leasing to increase next year.

This would be a good way for Tesla to take advantage of the current market. Might be a good/ consumer friendly time to start offering lease buyouts at the end of the terms on the Model 3/ Model Y.

 

[bigsmooth125]

Best thing Elon could do is sell twitter. Take the loss and egg on face. Would be best financially for him as tsla would gap up and remove the millstone from TSLA. Quit the crap and focus on running Tesla. Would be best for him and TSLA shareholders. But he won’t do that of course.

If only he could erase 2022.

 

[ElectricIAC]

If only he could erase 2022.

I wouldn’t mind going back to 2019.

Who has the Mr Fusion ready to go?

 

[generalenthu]

Best thing Elon could do is sell twitter. Take the loss and egg on face. Would be best financially for him as tsla would gap up and remove the millstone from TSLA. Quit the crap and focus on running Tesla. Would be best for him and TSLA shareholders. But he won’t do that of course.

One can wish. Unfortunately, Elon just declared he is open to the idea of acquiring another social media network. Where is that facepalm emoji when you need it?

https://twitter.com/x/status/1607936197602562050

 

[mongo]

Thanks for the update. Now, for the folks here hoping that Elon is replaced soon as Tesla CEO (assuming he doesn't also resume the Board Chair role), that could possibly trigger a clause in the 2018 CEO comp. plan which would require Elon to exercise all his stock options within 1 year. This is an accelerated time schedule vs 2028 options expiry w. the status quo. I'd better page @mongo to see if I got the details mostly right. TIA!

TL;dr be careful what u wish for...

Search for "Henry Ford" since Aug 2018 | Artful Dodger on TMC

Elon must be (CEO) or (Executive Chairman and Chief Product Officer) to vest.
He must be an employee, or be within one year of having left, to execute vested options.

Once the twelfth tranche vests this quarter, his comp plan is no longer tied to roles other than employee.

 

[Ogre]

One can wish. Unfortunately, Elon just declared he is open to the idea of acquiring another social media network. Where is that facepalm emoji when you need it?

https://twitter.com/x/status/1607936197602562050

Musk is going to try and build value with Twitter regardless of perception; if you think otherwise, you are a fool. If it makes sense for Twitter, he will do it.

There is a ton of synergy between the two companies... I'd love to discuss the idea seriously but all we have is this thread where Twitter talk is banned, and a burning dumper fire where it is "Ok" to talk Twitter.

 

[ElectricIAC]

One can wish. Unfortunately, Elon just declared he is open to the idea of acquiring another social media network. Where is that facepalm emoji when you need it?

https://twitter.com/x/status/1607936197602562050

I would rather he buy Reddit.

 

[Maarten]

.... Unfortunately, Elon just declared he is open to the idea of acquiring another social media network ....

https://twitter.com/x/status/1607936197602562050

 

[EVNow]

Elon must be (CEO) or (Executive Chairman and Chief Product Officer) to vest.
He must be an employee, or be within one year of having left, to execute vested options.

Once the twelfth tranche vests this quarter, his comp plan is no longer tied to roles other than employee.

I think he should go to a role that is not CEO. In all his companies - Tesla, Twitter, SpaceX (though less relevant because of COO). Like chief product architect .... similar to what Gates did, hopefully with much better results

 

[EVNow]

I would rather he buy Reddit.

Really ... what do you have against TSLA stock holders ?

 

[2daMoon]

Really! Don’t be surprised if the guy is voted out within a year
Good Riddance
And I say this for simple reason that CEO is clearly not acting in best interest of shareholders and breaching his fiduciary duty by acting in a manner that is causing direct damages to shareholders
We need someone like Tim Cook. This fellow is best suited to run his social media platform

This constant claim of direct damages is repeated, yet only supported by loosely formed correlations which fail to account for all the significant variables, and, of course, the emotional outbursts. It seems impossible for any repeatable means of proving this claim through application of the scientific method to be made.

There are many other possibilities as to who else might receive this sort of blame, any/all of which could (does?) have a greater influence on the SP. Though, because they are protected by the rules, we cannot focus our ire upon them as easily as pointing fingers at the eccentric genius who is literally changing the world.

Let's wait a year and see who is most surprised. Perhaps at that time we can finally say good riddance to the emotional folks who are so upset with Elon for being Elon.

In life you always have to take the good with the bad. Anyone expecting life to be fair should understand that a Fair is a place you go to be fleeced by Carneys while being entertained. Have you not been entertained by this circus for years or decades so far?

I'm a big boy and know that taking chances sometimes doesn't work out. I'll take my lumps and keep going. In no way do I feel I've suffered damages by Elon. I suspect I'm not alone in holding this point of view.

Sticks and stones...

 

[carterm2]

I was looking for a source for data of total margin held by shareholders of $TSLA. But found this... general market margin statistics.

Here is a link that shows overall statistics... not ($TSLA specific)

Or this .. FINRA

If there is a better source, more specific to $TSLA please post a link.

 

[TrendTrader007]

So name a few thing you are unhappy with Elon's execution at Tesla?

Are you unhappy with production? Profit margins? Future investments? Direction Tesla is taking the next few years? Like what Elon signs off as a CEO you think he is going the wrong direction and thinks he should be voted out?

Also can you name a few CEOs who tweeted their stock price up? AMD is down 70%, have Lisa Su done anything on tweeter that have rescued the share price or should we vote her out too?

i have zero problems with his execution and frankly i could not care less about short term noise. Elon is a genius and there is nobody like him and i have been a huge fan since 2014. i do see him as someone who has allowed success to go to his head and started making decisions which are in his own best interest over that of his shareholders as evidenced by numerous actions over last several months already well publicized. . Even then, role of CEO is to be the biggest advocate and guardian angel of his/her company instead of acting against or failing to act in best interests of ALL shareholders. Tesla does not belong to Elon anymore. neither does it belong to LTBH investors only. CEO has a fiduciary duty not to engage in any conduct or actions which cause serious brand damage.
i have zero desire to blame Elon for temporary decline in my personal wealth. i have been around a long time and have zero problems making millions in a very short time. There are retail shareholders on margin who probably got wiped out thanks to his haphazard stock sales breaking $200 floor; this fellow has zero empathy and further continues to engage in wilful conduct which may cause serious loss of confidence in Tesla by institutional shareholders as well as brand damage.
i would 100% love to be wrong and if Elon comes up with a great quarter and continues to execute then why, no one will be happier than me. my philosophy is to make money rather than to be right. on the other hand if Elon continues on this destructive path then his 14% stake in Tesla might not be enough to save his job if big institutional holders decide to replace him.

 

[larmor]

Estimates/projections and release date for P&D Q4?

 

[Buckminster]

So I thought funds were going to buy Tesla this week so that they have TSLA on their books for their annual reports etc. Maybe 20% chance that will happen in next 3 days following biggest treeforest shakefire ever.

HOWEVER, is it possible that the reverse is happening? Elon's name is so toxic they want him off their books for the report?

I don't think so but who knows. RIVN down 7.3% today and 38% in a month suggests it is nothing personal.

Whatever, we are 3 days away from a firebreak. Can't come quickly enough.