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Where are the new fsd versions?
- Thread starter mtiede
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My car is 2024 MS. 2024.3.15. What is AP 4? From Teslafi, as near as I can figure out, I am AP 4.
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I just got it last night. Disappointed that it didn't include the hatch opening triggered by phone. Does MS normally eventually get what the other models do?
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EVRider-FL
Active Member
The hands-free trunk feature is in 2024.14.3, and only works in newer Model S/X cars and the Highland Model 3. Newer models typically get the same updates, but some features in those updates are only available on certain model configurations. The release notes on Not A Tesla App have those details: 2024.14.3 Official Tesla Release Notes - Software Updates
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EV Rider answered your question fully but I wanted to chime in with this adjacent comment.
Don't update immediately assuming an update includes the new features discussed on forums or tweeted out by lord elon. Or assume any update is stable. Or won't break something on your car.
Check out Not A Tesla App and look to see if it is worth it to you to update and if the update includes what you are are expecting. If not, and you are happy with how your car is working, wait patiently, you may find yourself avoiding some grief.
Feel free to ignore this advice if you want to be an early adopter who wants to be an alpha tester for tesla. I'm on the opposite end of the spectrum and would prefer to not be even a beta tester, especially on things I need like wipers. I understand tesla's strategy for FSD requires me to be a beta tester but I didn't expect cruise control and wipers, things that have been 'perfected' for decades, to be beta software or borked by updates.
I don't know for sure that everyone on 2024.8.x would have been offered 2024.3.x if they had waited to update (as EV Rider said, model configurations matter, not everyone gets the same thing) but since we don't know exactly the update paths tesla has in mind when they talk about upcoming features/changes, it is best to sit back and wait to make sure you understand the exactly what you are getting and the risks it might incur.
After the flurry of updates offered in December, people were updating immediately hoping to get the Christmas update (and thus ended up with the AP recall changing the nag behaviour of their cars without getting the goodies.) After the rumours that FSDV12 was coming, people jumped on the first 2024 updates and kept updating and when FSDV12 finally arrived about 1/8th of the NA owners were beyond that update path so have, so far, had to sit out on the FSD free trial.
I sat out the December updates and was offered 5 (IIRC) different updates but I held out for V12 and ended up with FSDv12.3.3. I just sat out an incremental update to V12.3.4 and have just been offered V12.3.6. I'll continue to wait because that incremental update hasn't been around long enough for tesla to find the flaws in it. At some point when the new UI is available (and proven not to break anything or take away my USS) I'll update and take whatever version of FSD that comes with that update.
I'm pleased to see that 2024.14.x is finally rolling out for those with 2024.8.X and I hope it offers an update path to FSDV12, which really is on a different level than previous FSD offerings. I feel really bad for those folks who had to put up with all the chatter on forums around FSDV12 and all the press about free trials. Talk about an eye-opening example on how tesla treats its owners. At any time, any one of us can end up on the "left behind" update path, just like at any time the early adopters can spend hours and $$$ at tesla service trying to get cameras working again. It is a double-edged sword.
My experience in usually taking 100+ days to update is that I've never had less offered to me by waiting. I can always catch up and I usually avoid waiting impatiently for an update to fix flaws in a previous update. I learned the downside to jumping on updates after I lost easy access to window defrost in 2021. I lost decently working wipers when I updated to FSDV11.4 (which was a big enough improvement to update although I may have put it off if I knew about the wiper issue) but even if I had waited, I would have still lost them when the recalls were forced upon me.
The amazing ability to update OTA and tesla's making these updates free is a game changing plus to owning a tesla. But patience and careful reading of reviews from real owners is what is needed to make this feature a positive experience.
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EVRider-FL
Active Member
I’m not as cautious about updates as SidetrackedSue, but I wanted to reinforce that you have to be selective about which updates you install, especially if you don’t already have FSD v12 but want it. Unlike most other features, the newest versions of FSD are not in the newest updates. Currently, the 2024.3.x builds have FSD v12, but the newer 2024.8.x builds have FSD v11, so if you already have 2024.8.x, holding off on installing updates might get you FSD v12 sooner, assuming you meet the FSD v12 hardware requirements.
There have been cases where an update breaks something, but that hasn’t happened much in my experience. To be safe, when you get offered a new update, see what people are saying about it here before deciding whether to install it. If the update is determined to be buggy, Tesla will sometimes recall it, which means it will disappear if you haven’t installed it yet.
There have been cases where an update breaks something, but that hasn’t happened much in my experience. To be safe, when you get offered a new update, see what people are saying about it here before deciding whether to install it. If the update is determined to be buggy, Tesla will sometimes recall it, which means it will disappear if you haven’t installed it yet.
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legendsk
Member
I learned early on, if it isn't broke, don't try to fix it. Medical doctors have a motto of; First, Do No Harm. It makes more sense if you understand, writing a computer program is very much like write a story for a book.
The story simply expresses what you want the computer to do and the language is like English or any other language, but one that the computer also understands. Each line of program code is like a sentence. All the lines of code form the computer program just like all the sentences form a mystery novel or any book.
The program(s) that form the 'book' named FSD have been written over quite a few years, by a bunch of different people, and according to Tesla have grown to 300,000 lines of code or sentences. That's a pretty thick book! And if you go in and make a minor change, like changing the color of the hat a character is wearing at one point, in a book 300,000 sentences long, it will almost surely affect several seemingly unrelated things off in some other part of the book. So the bigger it gets, the more risk there is in making any change at all. Management becomes very difficult. Added to the problem is that the program has to run in different models of cars that have hardware changes that make them require different responses to get the same action and the program has to keep track of which car it is running in and all those hardware differences.
This is why the NN written software being only 3,000 lines of code is such a big deal. Being 100 X smaller or only 1% as large and the manually human written program, not only makes it run much, much faster in the same computer, (in the car), there is so much less opportunity for interaction between sentences or lines of code - program management, defining, designing, writing, testing, deploying, distributing, modifying, editing, repairing, literally everything involving the program gets so much better, just because of the size reduction.
And do remember that only city driving has been moved to the small program. When the NN training is done on highway driving, they will get the A.I. computer to write the program for highway driving and that will go through the same kind of controlled releases and testing and fixing until it is ready for general distribution. There will surely be another series of bumps in the road along the way, but v12 certainly hints that highway driving should be truly remarkable in a few weeks or months when it moves to NN highway.
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I'm going to have to search the web for how the heck these update numbers work. I JUST got the 2024 MS in March. I think that is a "newer Model S/X". And yet, my Release Notes show 2024.3.25 with FSD v12.3.6. How are people getting up to 2024.14.3 or 2024.8.x? Were there a bunch of updates after I bought my car? I only saw 2 and applied them. And I recently paid for the FSD. Did that "back version" me?
How do I determine if I will eventually get these newer updates?
How do I determine if I will eventually get these newer updates?
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Thanks for the elaborate description of programming, however, I wrote my first program in 1966 in a Physics class when the professor said "Here is a Schroedinger wave equation and here are the boundary conditions so go solve it on a computer." So we all learned Fortran and ran punch cards through our IBM mainframe computer to get our results. Over my career as a programmer, I've written a few programs that were 150,000+ lines of code. I don't recall having coded anything where an update broke something. I always tested PLUS we had a person that would run regression testing on the code. But I know what you are talking about.
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legendsk
Member
That reminds me of when I hired a programmer, (around 40 years ago), he was one of those folks who thought he was the smartest person on planet earth. His first day he started in writing a program and called me over to explain to me what he was doing. "This is the compiler that I use. It is so smart when it is compiling the program, if it finds an error, it shows on the screen like this example here, so you can correct it and then try compiling again." I told him, "Wow! That's really neat. Ron over here next to you has been using that same compiler for 4 years now, and I never knew the compiler showed errors." He was much more subdued after that.Thanks for the elaborate description of programming, however, I wrote my first program in 1966 in a Physics class when the professor said "Here is a Schroedinger wave equation and here are the boundary conditions so go solve it on a computer." So we all learned Fortran and ran punch cards through our IBM mainframe computer to get our results. Over my career as a programmer, I've written a few programs that were 150,000+ lines of code. I don't recall having coded anything where an update broke something. I always tested PLUS we had a person that would run regression testing on the code. But I know what you are talking about.
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You actually can't. Although I can assure you, you won't get the 2024.8.x ones because, even though your car is apparently 'behind' in update numbers it is ahead in FSD numbers.
Basically there are four numbers you are following:
Update number (firmware number), starts with the year, then the week of the release, then I guess you'd call it a release number (it is actually a version code but 'version' is used elsewhere so I don't want to completely confuse you.
So, 2024.3.25 came out in 2024, in the 3rd week (but that is the week it was given a number by tesla, not the week it was made available to owners) and the 2024.3 is now up to release 25.
2024.8.x came out in the 8th week of 2024.
According the Teslafi, both made appearances in the cars tracked by TeslaFi in March, confusingly, 2024.8 showed up around the middle of the month and 2024.3 showed up at the end of the month.
FSD Version is the next number you are following. It is typically three numbers. Currently I have V12.3.3 FSDV12.3 with minor adjustment to .3. The latest version out right now is 2024.3.6 with the .6 version having a significant improvement of autopark.
All updates include a version of FSD so if you haven't bought it, when you subscribe, you will have some version of FSD available.
When tesla releases a new Update, they don't tell you what version of FSD is in the update. So while we know the firmware 2024.14.X is currently being offered to some cars, we don't know (as of me writing this) which version of FSD it has.
User Interface Version is the last number important number to follow although it isn't very important. Currently the UI version is V11.x (which is easy to confuse with the FSDV11.x , welcome to tesla ownership, I believe deliberate naming confusion is part of a mission statement at tesla.) While firmware updates will include minor tweaks to the UI, every few years tesla will release a new 'base' UI with major changes. For example, using my car's changes, I lost the ability for the passenger to access voice command from the screen during a firmware update. A new version of the UI took away the defrost button.
People are really excited that the Spring Update is supposed to include a new UI version.
NAV Map Update number is the last number but the least important because you really have no control over it at all. You'll get a new map update when you get one (my car doesn't have access at home to wifi so my maps are now really out of date (according to version number) but my car is never connected to happen to get a new mapping software .
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EVRider-FL
Active Member
The short version of the previous response is that the 2024.3.x build you have now has FSD v12, but 2024.8.x and probably 2024.14.3 have FSD v11. You won’t get a newer build with an older version of FSD, so you have wait until Tesla provides a newer build with FSD v12.
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