I really like it. As an engineer, I am fascinated by its performance and steady rate of improvements. FSD has a huge WOW factor. This technology is not to be taken lightly and is extraordinarily complex. Face it, driving an automobile is a dangerous activity and FSD will one day minimize this hazard and probably save countless lives, I am certain. An investment in FSD is an investment in our future. IF and when NHTSA approves it, FSD vehicle-life subscription will appreciate in value and so will TSLA.
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FSD Price Cut to $12k Tonight, Aug 31/ Sept 1 2023
- Thread starter JHCCAZ
- Start date
CTruck_BMW
23’ MS
Is that Elon joining us from an undercover account : ) ? JK
In just 3 days testing FSD, I was about to be killed twice man (It almost switched lanes tried to take a left ignoring an incoming a semi truck!!!). Not sure what u r talking about. Not ready, not anytime soon. Highway? maybe but with FSD I will have to be aware even more than just lane keeping assist standard AP. I don't trust it... Granted my HW4 MS is still on 11.4.4
Cheburashka
Active Member
There is no proof of this. It's not even close. They still can't figure out how to get autowipers working properly.
IMHO a major issue with Tesla FSD is the Tesla software team. They've not shown the level of capability needed for something as complex as FSD. For example, they were never able to make sensor fusion work so they just gave up.
Other companies such as Waymo are actually demonstrating true FSD capabilities far in advance of Tesla's so it's not beyond current technology. Tesla just doesn't have the organization and personnel currently.
Other companies such as Waymo are actually demonstrating true FSD capabilities far in advance of Tesla's so it's not beyond current technology. Tesla just doesn't have the organization and personnel currently.
Basic Autopilot is horrible compared to FSD. You only see this when you switch from FSD back to Basic Autopilot. When I re-calibrated the cameras FSD was disabled, I had to use Basic Autopilot for couple miles and I noticed the difference.
BitJam
Active Member
In San Diegio, sure. But here in rural New Mexico FSD was terrible when I tried it in June and July of 2023.
One problem is the map is wrong so the car could literally not drive me 5 miles to the grocery store. Another problem is the speed limits are wrong so the car wanted to go 35 in my residential neighborhood where it's unsafe to go over 15. It missed turns, turned where it wasn't supposed to, crept way too close to 55 mph traffic for no reason, and it seemed to be allergic to being in the correct lane for an upcoming turn. It often tried to make surprise, incorrect, risky lane changes. There were other problems. FSD was an unsafe, inconvenient pain in the neck.
It was a huge relief when I canceled my subscription and went back to basic Autopilot. This is not a huge surprise because there are almost no Teslas where I live. I've seen a total of eight others and six of those had out of state plates. It makes perfect sense for Tesla to focus their efforts where there are more people and many more Teslas but the consequence is there are places in the US where FSD still sucks.
BTW basic Autopilot was not available when I recalibrated the cameras. I'd be surprised if you were able to use Autopilot when your car was recalibrating.
"BTW basic Autopilot was not available when I recalibrated the cameras. I'd be surprised if you were able to use Autopilot when your car was recalibrating."
It's available when the the calibration is complete (about 5-8 miles). When the message "Calibration is complete" appears it means it's good enough for basic autopilot and you can activate basic auto pilot. FSD needs additional calibration (a few more miles). Also you need to park the car to re-enable FSD.
Watts_Up
Well-Known Member
I would be interested looking at a video of the problem that you encountered because
I felt vibrations in my steering wheel and the car was forcing back into my lane while
I was starting to pass a vehicle but the car behind me started to over pass me
even when I already had my blinkers on for a while. I am feeling even more secure now.
ATPMSD
Active Member
FSD Version 11 is good, but can only go so far because it is constrained by its approach parameters (object recognition, labels, etc).
If FSD V12 neural net AI generated code approach is the correct path, than I expect FSD to advance very rapidly and with significant improvements with every software update. And I also expect FSD to be safer than the average driver within 12 months and 10x better in 24 months.
I wonder what a FSD subscription will cost then. Kinda hoping my MSP appreciates.
....and then there's an Optimus subscription.
Tesla will make this happen.
"It had long since come to my attention that people of accomplishment rarely sat back and let things happen to them. They went out and happened to things"
Leonardo da Vinci
If FSD V12 neural net AI generated code approach is the correct path, than I expect FSD to advance very rapidly and with significant improvements with every software update. And I also expect FSD to be safer than the average driver within 12 months and 10x better in 24 months.
I wonder what a FSD subscription will cost then. Kinda hoping my MSP appreciates.
....and then there's an Optimus subscription.
Tesla will make this happen.
"It had long since come to my attention that people of accomplishment rarely sat back and let things happen to them. They went out and happened to things"
Leonardo da Vinci
You're still drinking the Kool-Aid. There are many, many people who shared your sentiment... but as more and more time passes, their enthusiasm wanes.
Perhaps Tesla will strike gold with FSD, but I suspect it's more like a lottery now than it is just "put in the hard work". There's a good chance they'll fail, or just perpetually state that "awesomeness is just around the corner".
Not 100% certain, but feel that if v12 is not a vastly improved driving experience vs v11, Tesla will drop the cost of FSD add-on down to $8,000 and $150/month to keep us hanging in there.
In NY metro, v11.4.4 needed too many interventions, therefore just ended my subscription and hope to be back at v12 in Dec.
I will keep watching this post for positive improvements.
In NY metro, v11.4.4 needed too many interventions, therefore just ended my subscription and hope to be back at v12 in Dec.
I will keep watching this post for positive improvements.
R.P.E.
Member
It does though. Your quote below is inherently false you posted to that member. .
You stated:
“However, if you trade it in to Tesla they will give you zero for it as they simply remove it and then resell the car without it.”
I would suggest to check Teslas used inventory. Many of their ‘used’ M3’s includes FSD as part of the purchase agreement. [It’s possible they might remove FSD, but they certainly sell used M3’s with FSD.]
Elon stated very clearly on X that V12 is a "complete rewrite." So, the expectation will be that it's normal to take years to get an entirely new code base sorted out, which will be just in time for the next complete rewrite to start the process all over again.
ATPMSD
Active Member
SalisburySam
Active Member
and its sensor suite, sensor locations, computing power, communications with the mothership servers, and the ever-appreciated delivery of an improved feature while breaking something else.
Have expectations is generally a good thing. Occasionally meeting them is much better and that’s the void.
Again, good to have expectations, however unfounded. Putting any time line against a Tesla development effort is a lottery-type guess.
It will cost whatever. For the Model 3 it has varied from the low, low act-now price of only $2000 to a high of $15,000 and today at $12,000. Not quite the dream of ever-increasing pricing due to ever-increasing DELIVERED capability.
Again with the expectations couched as a hope. With the exception of classic automobiles, and universal used car shortages, no car has ever appreciated, MSPs included. While nice if it did, I’m not seeing evidence of this happening or even likely. What do you see?
Those of us who bought into the hype and made the silly “investment” in FSD all have this hope. Now, however, we temper that with reality and resetting expectations much, much lower. Certainly not everyone but there is definitely more of a “show me first and then you’ll get my money” attitude than there was in the earlier days.
"It had long since come to my attention that people of accomplishment rarely sat back and let things happen to them. They went out and happened to things"
Thanks for Lenny’s inspirational message this morning…I needed that. For Tesla, the greater issue seems to be its desire to reinvent wheels unnecessarily (AutoWipers is the stellar example here). So yeah, Tesla is “happening to things” but for some things probably should not have. How they can accurately land rockets yet not get wipers working well is concerning to me. I don’t ride rockets, I do drive my M3.
ChooseFreedom
Member
I guess we're just going to agree to disagree.
In an economy without inflation (e.g. before fiat) tech advancements lower overall costs to manufacturers, fixed assets don't necessarily go up, and manpower (payroll) doesn't have to go up. So a company can increase profit without raising prices. Workers aren't demanding pay raises because their dollar isn't inflating, and they can save money without fear of inflation taking away their buying power. Prices could even deflate and still be profitable, if that's what the free market demands. But we don't really have a truly free market anymore.
The problem (at least to consumers, not corporations or banks) is, inflation has been so normalized by the Fed that people now think it's necessary. And in the current broken fiat debt system, it is.
But in a system with a better base money, it would not be. #Bitcoin
CTruck_BMW
23’ MS
I have no plans to pay 12K for FSD... even in the future, for whatever it offers, that is a lot for FSD.... However, my concern is if they increase the monthly subscription too much that it becomes virtually not possible to get it too.. If it stays at 200/m USD, I am find with that. I just don't want a Tesla if I lose access to FSD at a reasonable price in the future. Right now I am using it to guide me while my hands are on the steering all the time and so as my eyes.. Still more relaxing to drive that way than steering the car actively.
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