It looks like your update fixed it. I did a dc fast charge this morning and it no longer showed supercharging! Thanks for the fast response!
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It looks like your update fixed it. I did a dc fast charge this morning and it no longer showed supercharging! Thanks for the fast response!
@MMC- , awesome thanks for testing! Did you also find the related charging metrics to be accurate when fast charging? (amperage, voltage, charge rate, etc). I believe there is a known issue with some of these being off when supercharging, again I need to drive out to a supercharger (45 min for me) and resolve this. It's on my list!
@scottf200 , yikes that is a gross service error and definitely on me, I'll look into it ASAP and get a fix out this evening.
For your smart charging question, the 'Allow charge stopping' option means you give this smart charging location permission to stop an active charge if it's calculated charge completion time is before your desired completion time.
Regardless of this setting, smart charging will always try to start a charge at the correct time such that the charge completion time is near your desired completion time. When this is combined with the allow charge stopping setting, you may experience a cycle of charge starting and stopping, I call it charge restart behavior. This occurs if the manual charge rate setting used to calculate when to start charging differs too much from the actual charge rate when charging that's used to calculate if charging should stop in order to start again at the appropriate time.
tl;dr
If that doesn't help clear it up let me know, you shouldn't be seeing too many charge stops and starts so long as your manual charge rate is close to your actual charge rate.
@scottf200 , yikes that is a gross service error and definitely on me, I'll look into it ASAP and get a fix out this evening.
For your smart charging question, the 'Allow charge stopping' option means you give this smart charging location permission to stop an active charge if it's calculated charge completion time is before your desired completion time.
Regardless of this setting, smart charging will always try to start a charge at the correct time such that the charge completion time is near your desired completion time. When this is combined with the allow charge stopping setting, you may experience a cycle of charge starting and stopping, I call it charge restart behavior. This occurs if the manual charge rate setting used to calculate when to start charging differs too much from the actual charge rate when charging that's used to calculate if charging should stop in order to start again at the appropriate time.
So think of this scenario and hopefully it'll give insight into how smart charging works:
Given the above scenario, because you are plugged-in at an enabled smart charging location, smart charging begins processing...
Note: In order for the manual charge rate setting to be averaged with the actual charge rate, you must have at least 45 minutes of actual charge time remaining. So if you've been doing short charges this whole time (<45 minutes), your manual charge rate setting hasn't been getting updated. This 45 minute buffer is a protection against the huge fluctuations that happen in the charge time remaining reported by the APIs as charge gets closer to completing (the balancing and tapering can swing the remaining charge time up to 30 minutes for brief periods). I may be a bit too cautious with this buffer, I could lower it to 30 safely.
- it is 4:00 am
- your desired completion is 6:00 am
- you're plugged-in at an enabled smart charging location
- charging is stopped
- you have 20 miles until full battery and charging would complete
- you set your manual charge rate to 5.0 mph
- your actual charge rate will be 20.0 mph
Side-note: Smart charging does not know your actual charge rate because this information is not provided by the APIs unless you're actually charging, thus we require an estimated manual charge rate just to get us going. You only have to provide this once though as smart charging will automatically average into your manual charge rate setting all the actual charge rates it experiences during each session, so over time your manual charge rate becomes closer and closer to your actual charge rate for that location assuming you do not mess with amperage/charge rates at all (in which case you should add a new location for use with that amperage)
Given the above scenario, because you are plugged-in at an enabled smart charging location, smart charging begins processing...
- It uses the 5.0 mph manual charge rate to calculate that it will take 4 hours to fill the battery the 20 miles needed to complete charging
- It then calculates the required charge start time needed in order to complete charging by your desired time of 6:00 am, so it subtracts this 4 hour charge time from your desired completion time of 6:00 am to determine that you need to start charging at 2:00 am
- It sees it is currently 4:00 am which is past your required charge start time of 2:00 am, so it immediately starts charging. The smart charging service is scheduled to check back in 15 minutes to see how things are going and adjust accordingly
- ...15 minutes pass, the time is now 4:15 am, during this time the car has been charging at the actual charge rate of 20.0 mph, the battery filled 5 miles in these 15 minutes leaving only 15 miles needed for charge completion. Smart charging begins the above same processing again
- This time, it uses the actual charge rate being experienced of 20.0 mph to calculate that it will take 45 minutes to fill the battery the 15 miles needed to complete charging.
- Smart charging averages this actual charge rate into the manual charge rate setting at this point (with some logic to protect bad data from throwing off a perfectly good average)
- It then calculates the required charge start time needed in order to complete charging by your desired time of 6:00 am, so it subtracts this 45 minute charge time from 6:00 am to determine that you need to start charging at 5:15 am.
- It sees it is currently 4:15 am which is before your required charge start time of 5:00 am (we minus a 15 minute buffer here to account for inaccuracies), so it immediately stops charging. The smart charging service is scheduled to check back in 15 minutes just in-case.
- ..15 minutes pass, go back to step 1 but the manual charge rate setting used in calculations is now slightly higher due to the averaging that took place in step 6.
Note: In order for the manual charge rate setting to be averaged with the actual charge rate, you must have at least 45 minutes of actual charge time remaining. So if you've been doing short charges this whole time (<45 minutes), your manual charge rate setting hasn't been getting updated. This 45 minute buffer is a protection against the huge fluctuations that happen in the charge time remaining reported by the APIs as charge gets closer to completing (the balancing and tapering can swing the remaining charge time up to 30 minutes for brief periods). I may be a bit too cautious with this buffer, I could lower it to 30 safely.
tl;dr
If that doesn't help clear it up let me know, you shouldn't be seeing too many charge stops and starts so long as your manual charge rate is close to your actual charge rate.
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scottf200
Well-Known Member
@SG57 , a) thanks for looking into that error. My charge is fine tonight so don't worry about fixing it tonight if you have other plans. I should have mentioned that I didn't drive today so my charge is within a few miles of already being at my set SOC. That may be a hint or the code snippet let you know where to check for the null object before executing that code.
b) Thanks you for that detailed explanation. I followed it. My average charge rate is accurate now at 19.9 as I've used your app for a few weeks now so I don't think that aspect is applicable.
MORE to the point, I think, is that you may have overlooked the activities and timing in my graphic. What happens is that I am out somewhere, then come home and plug in (ie. Home at 20:57 and car charges from 20:58:21-05). The car starts charging for several minutes and then stops. I *think* Dashboard for Tesla check the car every 15ish minutes (?) and ends up stopping the charging. This makes reasonable sense to me if it is working they way that I think it is. I just noticed some 7-8 minute charges after I got home/plugged in. I was thinking I could avoid that from happening by turning on the built-in Tesla start charging at XX:XX time feature and setting it after my Smart Charging end time.
Sorry for the long winded reply and hope it makes more sense.
@scottf200 , thanks for not rushing me but null exceptions are a disgrace, it's likely an issue due to backwards compatibility, I'm looking into it now.
Speaking of backwards compatibility, with everyone with smart charging setups already, I make sure to not force you to have to re-create them, or any other service you may have enabled (plug-in reminder, automatic behaviors, etc.)
Oh I see, so you don't have a scheduled charge in the car? So by plugging the car in whenever you get home, it automatically starts charging I assume? To answer your question then, yes you can avoid the charge from starting automatically by scheduling a charge from within the car itself.
Depending on when you set this scheduled charge for, and based on calculations I went over in the previous post, smart charging will either let it go or stop it right after it. So if you set the car's scheduled charge for 2 am, but charging needs to start at 1 am to hit your completion time, smart charging starts charging early and the scheduled charge in the car does nothing at 2 am as it's already charging. If charging needs to start at 3 am, then the 2 am scheduled charge in the car starts then smart charging immediately stops it so that it may later resume charging at 3 am to hit your completion time.
I suggest setting the car's scheduled charge time to a fail-safe time (mine is 2 am) should your device be powered off, or your device or vehicle lost internet connection, etc.
The fact you are seeing the charge stopping after 7 minutes or so is just the timing at which smart charging polls vs. when you got home. Had you been home 6 minutes later, you'd see the charge stop almost immediately just off luck.
Speaking of backwards compatibility, with everyone with smart charging setups already, I make sure to not force you to have to re-create them, or any other service you may have enabled (plug-in reminder, automatic behaviors, etc.)
Oh I see, so you don't have a scheduled charge in the car? So by plugging the car in whenever you get home, it automatically starts charging I assume? To answer your question then, yes you can avoid the charge from starting automatically by scheduling a charge from within the car itself.
Depending on when you set this scheduled charge for, and based on calculations I went over in the previous post, smart charging will either let it go or stop it right after it. So if you set the car's scheduled charge for 2 am, but charging needs to start at 1 am to hit your completion time, smart charging starts charging early and the scheduled charge in the car does nothing at 2 am as it's already charging. If charging needs to start at 3 am, then the 2 am scheduled charge in the car starts then smart charging immediately stops it so that it may later resume charging at 3 am to hit your completion time.
I suggest setting the car's scheduled charge time to a fail-safe time (mine is 2 am) should your device be powered off, or your device or vehicle lost internet connection, etc.
The fact you are seeing the charge stopping after 7 minutes or so is just the timing at which smart charging polls vs. when you got home. Had you been home 6 minutes later, you'd see the charge stop almost immediately just off luck.
Oopf. I've identified the problem, it's a result of the API changes (read: reductions) to car's running the latest firmware. I have a fix in place and it'll be going out shortly.
scottf200
Well-Known Member
I complete understand and appreciate that. I used to be a lead developer on a product and we were always careful about compatibility when users upgraded release/versions and what defaults were used on new features.
Thanks much, I was watching for it ... that is I used the 'check for updates' option in the app. The new version resolved it. Dreaded API changes.
Hi, I think there may be a problem with the amps calculations as you only show 30 amps when it should show around 60 amps on this dc fast charger.
See the attached screen captures and pics for details.
@MMC- , excellent data! Just what I needed. Curious, was your last not-fast-charging experience (at home on a HPWC, etc) at 30 amps / 48 amps? It looks like the voltage and charge rate metrics are reporting correctly, just the amperage is incorrect and likely due to the pilot current and pilot request data being reported is not correlated to the current fast charger but to your last regular charge setup.
HPWC.. 48 amps. Not sure where the 30 came from as I always charge at 48 amps at home.
Anything else I can help with just let me know....
Here are some captures and a pix from Supercharging today. I'll try to hot the dc fast charger later today or Tuesday. 
@MMC- , thanks again for the data.
I've actually fixed the supercharging amperage issue, I'll get it out there now. Strange that the charge rate in DfT is reporting 4 mi/hr less than the car or the official app when all I'm doing is reporting the exact value as returned from the charge_rate field from the APIs. Let's see if that's consistent enough to be an issue.
I've put a fair amount of time into upgrading this charge information section in the app over the weekend.
Unfortunately with the new 8.1 APIs and the removal of the battery_current field, I need to assume this will be the new norm and have removed all usages of it. This means I'm now using the streaming API to acquire the current power which works great, but I've lost some precision as the data is reported in integers.
I've actually fixed the supercharging amperage issue, I'll get it out there now. Strange that the charge rate in DfT is reporting 4 mi/hr less than the car or the official app when all I'm doing is reporting the exact value as returned from the charge_rate field from the APIs. Let's see if that's consistent enough to be an issue.
I've put a fair amount of time into upgrading this charge information section in the app over the weekend.
Unfortunately with the new 8.1 APIs and the removal of the battery_current field, I need to assume this will be the new norm and have removed all usages of it. This means I'm now using the streaming API to acquire the current power which works great, but I've lost some precision as the data is reported in integers.
I would not worry much a out the 4 mile difference as that could have changed from the time span between when the two captures were done.
As I said before I'll try dc fast charging later today or Tuesday.
Thanks for all your work!
@MMC- , thanks for all the testing! I've been pushing out updates near daily with concise improvements lately, so be sure to check for an update before you plug into the fast charger just-in case. I will definitely have something new out tonight for you to do the fast-charging testing tomorrow.
(Captured on 1.19.4)
Ok I thought I could delete the charging location but for some reason it won't let me. I thought back on 7.1 you could.
Anyway here are the shots for the dc fast charger. Thanks.
Ok I thought I could delete the charging location but for some reason it won't let me. I thought back on 7.1 you could.
Anyway here are the shots for the dc fast charger. Thanks.
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