Did Tesla really lay off their entire Supercharger staff

[Bouba]

Betamax was a standard, too. (Technically superior to VHS. We all know how that went.)

The point is that there's substantial overhead for other manufacturers to switch to NACS as their charging standard. They might have been willing to take that hit because access to Tesla's Supercharger network had been perceived as such an appealing draw for their prospective customers. But now, with Tesla giving all overt indications that they are going to let the Supercharger network stagnate, that makes it immediately much less appealing for anyone else to jump on the NACS bandwagon, despite its technical superiority. Tesla will continue to use it of course, but for all other manufacturers, Tesla's shenanigans make it far more likely that it will wither instead of thrive.

I’m not so sure it’s that dramatic....all of these car companies have a long history of retrenchment, layoffs, shutdowns, closures, divisions sold cheaply, bailouts etc......laying off 500 people won’t phase them a bit

 

[JHCCAZ]

I’m not so sure it’s that dramatic....all of these car companies have a long history of retrenchment, layoffs, shutdowns, closures, divisions sold cheaply, bailouts etc......laying off 500 people won’t phase them a bit

won’t phase faze them a bit

 

[stopcrazypp]

Betamax was a standard, too. (Technically superior to VHS. We all know how that went.)

Betamax was a proprietary standard that largely was controlled by Sony even though they licensed it out for others to make some VCRs. NACS instead is provided license free and is now controlled by SAE under J3400.

The point is that there's substantial overhead for other manufacturers to switch to NACS as their charging standard. They might have been willing to take that hit because access to Tesla's Supercharger network had been perceived as such an appealing draw for their prospective customers. But now, with Tesla giving all overt indications that they are going to let the Supercharger network stagnate, that makes it immediately much less appealing for anyone else to jump on the NACS bandwagon, despite its technical superiority. Tesla will continue to use it of course, but for all other manufacturers, Tesla's shenanigans make it far more likely that it will wither instead of thrive.

Tesla makes up almost 60% of the DC charging stalls in the US. Even if Tesla installs zero new stalls going forward (which clearly is not the case given recent reports some were just installed), it's still a huge advantage to have supercharger access.
Tesla Accounts for 58% of All New US DC Fast Charger Ports Added in 2023 Through May – EVStatistics

Also, although the timing is bad, Ford and Rivian already have access to the network and GM is in testing phases. So right now the biggest players already have access or are in the process of having access. Any EV that decides to abandon NACS and give up supercharger access would have a huge disadvantage, as they lose access to well more than half of the DC charging stalls in the US. I personally would never consider an EV that doesn't have supercharge access, I'm sure a lot of upcoming EV owners are the same (given the initial buyer group that are less concerned about charging has been well saturated already).

The rumormill had some German makes reconsider in their boardroom meetings, but those were iffy in the first place, given lack of 800V support thus far. I think they will thumb their nose and continue on because the cons of not doing so greatly outweighs the pros.

 

[Ben W]

I’m not so sure it’s that dramatic....all of these car companies have a long history of retrenchment, layoffs, shutdowns, closures, divisions sold cheaply, bailouts etc......laying off 500 people won’t phase them a bit

I'm not so sure it is either. But I'm also not so sure that it isn't. The consequences are unpredictable. Perhaps manufacturers will decide to keep CCS connectors as the default on their cars (plus clunky adapters for NACS), rather than switching the cars' built-in ports to NACS, because they no longer have confidence that v4 800v Superchargers will be built out, so they want to preserve CCS 800v compatibility.

"Laying off 500 people", in an ordinary layoff scenario, wouldn't faze them a bit. But laying off 500 people in the atrocious manner in which Elon did it, might.

 

[Ben W]

Betamax was a proprietary standard that largely was controlled by Sony even though they licensed it out for others to make some VCRs. NACS instead is provided license free and is now controlled by SAE under J3400.


Tesla makes up almost 60% of the DC charging stalls in the US. Even if Tesla installs zero new stalls going forward (which clearly is not the case given recent reports some were just installed), it's still a huge advantage to have supercharger access.
Tesla Accounts for 58% of All New US DC Fast Charger Ports Added in 2023 Through May – EVStatistics

Also, although the timing is bad, Ford and Rivian already have access to the network and GM is in testing phases. So right now the biggest players already have access or are in the process of having access. Any EV that decides to abandon NACS and give up supercharger access would have a huge disadvantage, as they lose access to well more than half of the DC charging stalls in the US. I personally would never consider an EV that doesn't have supercharge access, I'm sure a lot of upcoming EV owners are the same (given the initial buyer group that are less concerned about charging has been well saturated already).

The rumormill had some German makes reconsider in their boardroom meetings, but those were iffy in the first place, given lack of 800V support thus far. I think they will thumb their nose and continue on because the cons of not doing so greatly outweighs the pros.

I think the most likely change in outcome (if any) is that some manufacturers decide to leave CCS ports on their vehicles for a while longer and provide clunky NACS adapters, rather than build in NACS directly. Also, as a multi-Tesla owner I'm disappointed that the network probably won't continue to be built out as rapidly as I had previously hoped. I recently did a 3500-mile roadtrip in my Model Y LR, and doubling the Supercharger density in sparse regions would have made a considerable difference. For 200-mile EV's that may want to use the network, including perhaps "Model 2" / Robotaxi, increasing the density will be essential. It's disappointing that Tesla has evidently decided to led this buildout stagnate (unless others pick up the slack, which may take years).

 

[Bouba]

I'm not so sure it is either. But I'm also not so sure that it isn't. The consequences are unpredictable. Perhaps manufacturers will decide to keep CCS connectors as the default on their cars (plus clunky adapters for NACS), rather than switching the cars' built-in ports to NACS, because they no longer have confidence that v4 800v Superchargers will be built out, so they want to preserve CCS 800v compatibility.

"Laying off 500 people", in an ordinary layoff scenario, wouldn't faze them a bit. But laying off 500 people in the atrocious manner in which Elon did it, might.

I would say the opposite....they would be extremely jealous of how easy he did it....compared to all the labor and union strife they get whenever they want to desize

 

[Bouba]

I know I’m not going to be the first person to print this article...

Elon Musk says Tesla is spending $500 million on Superchargers this year after firing entire team

Elon Musk says Tesla is going to spend over $500 million on expanding the Supercharger network this year after firing...

electrek.co

But if it gets another set of nervous eyeballs on it then that’s good

 

[Dracaris]

All things come to those who fire people capriciously. He already did the same at Xitter, and clearly learned nothing from the experience.

So, yeah, all the best, well-connected employees who used to work in that division of Tesla most likely already have new and more stable jobs elsewhere in the industry which pay at least as much as their old jobs did, and Musk will be out of luck if / when he decides to try and rebuild it

 

[Ben W]

I would say the opposite....they would be extremely jealous of how easy he did it....compared to all the labor and union strife they get whenever they want to desize

It’s not the ease in which it was done. It was apparent lack of forethought or planning or consideration in which it was done.

Musk: “This 747 jumbo jet we’re flying is too inefficient. Reduce the size of all of its engines by 14% immediately!”

Lead engineer: “But sir…”

Musk: [chops off one of the engines] [plane continues flying, a bit lopsided] “See, I told you we didn’t need that engine!”

Rest of world:

 

[KelvinMace]

If Tesla opens up the network to all EVs and it can't be profitable then it either says that EVs can't work without a subsidized network, or that Tesla's network is too expensive.

Otherwise, a slowdown in network growth makes sense if overall EV sales growth is also slowing down or drivers of other EVs are using other networks instead.

Tesla's sales may be slowing down, but EV sales as a whole are still up. More non-Tesla EVs being sold means more use of the previously highly reliable SC network by non-Tesla customers.

 

[Seattle]

I know I’m not going to be the first person to print this article...

Elon Musk says Tesla is spending $500 million on Superchargers this year after firing entire team

Elon Musk says Tesla is going to spend over $500 million on expanding the Supercharger network this year after firing...

electrek.co

But if it gets another set of nervous eyeballs on it then that’s good

there's a charging industry company YouTube channel (Smart Charge America), and they seem to be well connected to Tesla. They said Tesla spent $300 million already this year by their estimates, and so it could mean they are only spending $200 mil more. It's at the least still not a good thing to fire a team that was the queen of the company, extremely successful and the most important infrastructure across all EV makers. And then start hiring them back a few days later.

 

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

Tesla's sales may be slowing down, but EV sales as a whole are still up. More non-Tesla EVs being sold means more use of the previously highly reliable SC network by non-Tesla customers.

But at a lower proportion. Superchargers in the USA are expensive, and for drivers of some of the more popular non-Tesla EVs such as the EV6 or IONIQ5, slower, or in the case of all the Bolts, no faster.

 

[KelvinMace]

But at a lower proportion. Superchargers in the USA are expensive, and for drivers of some of the more popular non-Tesla EVs such as the EV6 or IONIQ5, slower, or in the case of all the Bolts, no faster.

The advantage of the SC network to non-Tesla drivers is not speed, but reliability. A 350kW EA charger is not really helpful if it doesn't work.

 

[MP3Mike]

Perhaps manufacturers will decide to keep CCS connectors as the default on their cars (plus clunky adapters for NACS), rather than switching the cars' built-in ports to NACS, because they no longer have confidence that v4 800v Superchargers will be built out, so they want to preserve CCS 800v compatibility.

That would apply to few OEMs right now, as pretty much only Lucid, GM on their trucks, Porsche, Kia, and Hyundai have 800V vehicle. But I would assume that they are far enough along in the process to switch to J3400 that they wouldn't throw that away and start over, just as the CPOs are about to start installing J3400 cables. (EVgo seems like it will be one of the first.)

 

[RSpanner]

I think I’m done with Tesla. It was hard enough swallowing that my car brand is associated with a lunatic. Now this.

How do you ramp slower with zero staff?

I can see a drastic cut to keep the lights on? But 100%

So sad. Tesla was a shinning light for what can happen in America.

people thought the depreciation on our cars was bad before because of price drops. Watch what happens over the next few months.

My thoughts exactly, sad to say. Will keep our 2021 M3 until ? 27K miles and 3 years old...probably for years. The future looks murky.

 

[Webeevdrivers]

Not an American so not sure how this works. Polls indicate that the republicans will be elected this time around. Will the NEVI money just disappear when that happens?

Thanks.

 

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

Not an American so not sure how this works. Polls indicate that the republicans will be elected this time around. Will the NEVI money just disappear when that happens?

Thanks.

Future money. Money already committed isn't pulled back. So some would still be built, but anything not already fully approved would not get funding.
(Also not American, but occasionally pay attention to politics.)

 

[Webeevdrivers]

Future money. Money already committed isn't pulled back. So some would still be built, but anything not already fully approved would not get funding.
(Also not American, but occasionally pay attention to politics.)

Ah ok. Thanks. I saw an article that indicated only 7 locations had been built in two years. I suspect at best they’ll double that in the next 8 months.

 

[MP3Mike]

Not an American so not sure how this works. Polls indicate that the republicans will be elected this time around. Will the NEVI money just disappear when that happens?

I'm not entirely sure, but they would have to at least go through a process/vote to change the BIL. And I think the first three years of money has already been distributed to the states, which then have to grant contracts and distribute the money to the CPOs installing chargers.

So maybe one or two years of the funding would be at risk.

 

[MP3Mike]

Ah ok. Thanks. I saw an article that indicated only 7 locations had been built in two years. I suspect at best they’ll double that in the next 8 months.

Only about 7 locations have opened, but a lot more contracts have been granted and work started. (It took almost 2 years for the states to decide how they were going to issue the money and create the RFP process.)

Things should speed up rapidly from here.