Entire Supercharging Team Fired?

News yesterday is that the entire 500+ person word-wide SC team has been let go. That is alarming. Why would Elon sack the execs and all the employees of this important part of Tesla's business? Could Tesla be selling the SC network off to a third party? Opinions? Other theories?

 

[gearchruncher]

I've had so many Elon apologists over the years decompose an Elon tweet using hyper pedantic language that I have learned how to do it. Let me try:

Tesla will spend well over $500M expanding our Supercharger network to create thousands of NEW chargers this year. That’s just on new sites and expansions, not counting operations costs, which are much higher.

The term "will" does not have to refer exclusively to the future from this moment. Note that he says they "will" open thousands of new chargers this year.
Tesla has ALREADY opened thousands of chargers this year. About 3,100. So if they halt opening any new ones, this statement is true. They'll get some additional ones from builds and contracts already in flight.

As for the spending of money? Don't forget that firing people is expensive with severance packages and allowing people to exercise stock options. So that goes into the $500M, on top of the 5 months of pay and benefits for the 500 people up to this point. $100M of the $500M easy. $400M for 4000 stalls means $100K per stall so that's not crazy. Remember that BP is planning on spending $1B to open 3,000 stalls, which is $300K per stall.

So basically, nothing in this tweet commits Tesla to more than they have already done as of May 10th, 2024.

This tweet says nothing about anything past this year either. So nothing here says they will continue any investment in 2025+. They could literally build 500 more stalls this year then never, ever build another new stall and this tweet would be accurate.

Just to reiterate:

I got nothin' for this, given the silence up to this point.

 

[HitchHiker71]

But how is Tesla going to do this? Who is going to be doing the work?

BP from the looks of it...

 

[gt2690b]

BP from the looks of it...

i dont know if i like the idea of an oil company controlling the NACS... oil prices up... charger prices up

its a conflict of interest and seems like it could lead to price fixing

 

[HitchHiker71]

i dont know if i like the idea of an oil company controlling the NACS... oil prices up... charger prices up

its a conflict of interest and seems like it could lead to price fixing

Well, electric utility companies are almost universally monopolies with almost no competition in comparison - which is basically price fixing by design - so I don't really see a downside to additional competition - at least for those states that have allowed for deregulation and at least some level of competition as it relates to the costs for power generation vs transfer/delivery (which are typically still provided by the monopoly utility and those prices are set in stone), whether it's coming from fossil fuel energy companies or otherwise. IMHO it's good to see BP branching out to other forms of energy generation and delivery - since peak oil has likely already occurred and the downtrend on oil consumption will continue as fleet electrification accelerates - these large fossil fuel energy companies need to find their next big thing.

 

[gt2690b]

Well, electric utility companies are almost universally monopolies with almost no competition in comparison - which is basically price fixing by design - so I don't really see a downside to additional competition - whether it's coming from fossil fuel energy companies or otherwise. IMHO it's good to see BP branching out to other forms of energy generation and delivery - since peak oil has likely already occurred and the downtrend on oil consumption will continue as fleet electrification accelerates - these large fossil fuel energy companies need to find their next big thing.

i was under the impression BP was gunning for all of the tesla sites but if that is not the case then sounds like good competition to me

 

[HitchHiker71]

i was under the impression BP was gunning for all of the tesla sites but if that is not the case then sounds like good competition to me

There is no detail provided in this regard really. BP has indicated a desire to acquire real estate for supercharging purposes. My guess is if Tesla wants to scale down direct production (installation) of new SC sites and also scale down operations (ongoing maintenance of those sites), then initially what we'd likely see is Tesla wholesale transferring leases for net new sites that were on their map but not yet started - to third parties - such as BP - with agreement that these sites would be accessible to the Tesla ownership base via the Tesla navigation system and app just like existing Tesla SC sites. This would allow Tesla to scale back their own production/maintenance costs while also continuing to grow the NACS based charging networks - using the same underlying tech - the SC stations themselves - which Tesla produces and resells to BP and other third parties. This approach would permit Tesla to continue to ensure quality control for the NACS stations since they are manufacturing the equipment - while offloading the considerable amount of work associated with site acquisition (real estate leasing/purchase) permitting, installation, and ongoing maintenance. I'd surmise that Musk already had this in the works before he fired the entire SC team - a major third party installer/maintenance deal waiting in the wings - likely BP.

I suppose it's possible that Tesla could wholesale transfer existing SC sites/leases to third parties as well - but IMHO if this was going to be the case - then Tesla would have simply divested the SC teams in entirety to some large buyer, such as BP, without firing the vast majority of the SC personnel in the process. This isn't what happened though, which leads me to believe we won't see this right away. Perhaps if major third parties start expanding the NACS networks per above, and this process goes well over the next 1-2 years - we could see Tesla offload existing SC sites to those third parties eventually. Anything is possible really.

 

[tivoboy]

I doubt tesla is going to offload any current or currently nearly complete SC’s that are operational or operational within a month… but BP is probably interested in sites that were planned, currently getting paperwork, power lined up, etc.. whatever it is. It would SEEM from reports that third party contractors for the various stages of construction have been told to stop in place, plan for delays in current invoices or milestone billing/payments.,, and BP could probably easily sweep in and make offers to either tesla, local business owners, municipalities, whatever to take over putting in similar DCFC charging.

I’m sure Tesla has done SOME of the legwork to figure out where is optimal to put in additional SC’s, so why not just take advantage of that effort, and put them in instead (and probably can access IRA funds for now) and then all the revenue goes to the white knight vendor instead of Tesla.

For whatever reason, Tesla seems to be planning for “winter is coming” either for industry, macro economy, or maybe JUST for Tesla.

 

[MP3Mike]

Here is a report from someone that knew a Supercharger team member:

I have an acquaintance who who worked in the Supercharger division and was let go. The story, according to him, is that Elon asked the head of the Division to make additional cuts to her team. She declined. Elon said make cuts or I will layoff the whole division. She again declined.

It seems like the division manager tried to call Elon's bluff, and he wasn't bluffing. I get that Elon could have handled it differently, but so should have the division manager. She went all in with the jobs of her team, and lost them all. (It seems like she tried to save ~20 people's job, and instead caused 500 to be let go.)

 

[Mr. Nuke]

Here is a report from someone that knew a Supercharger team member:

It seems like the division manager tried to call Elon's bluff, and he wasn't bluffing. I get that Elon could have handled it differently, but so should have the division manager. She went all in with the jobs of her team, and lost them all. (It seems like she tried to save ~20 people's job, and instead caused 500 to be let go.)

I mean this has literally been reported from the get go. And she didn't cause 500 people to be let go. He unilaterally made that decision...

 

[gearchruncher]

For whatever reason, Tesla seems to be planning

Citation needed.
Elon saw sales drop 20% and now is laying off 20% of people with no additional strategy. That's the exact reverse of planning, that's reacting.

 

[gearchruncher]

I get that Elon could have handled it differently,

I mean, let's not get crazy here. Asking the highest paid CEO in the world to strategize and deal with difficult situations? He's got right wing conspiracies to retweet and unconstitutional ideas to promote, as well as 5 other companies to micromanage! Leave him be.

The hilarious thing is that if the option you present to a "division manager" is "either lay off 20% of your staff or I will lay them all off and close the division" is actually handing control to that manager unless you are bluffing. That's an insane thing to do. That's not what a CEO does. A CEO fires that "manager" and thins the division strategically because that was the actual direction they set for the company and it's their job to actually achieve it, not be able to be thrown completely off that path by a single "manager" not doing what they want so they shutter the whole division as a way to prove a point about loyalty using fascist methods.

This behavior would get the CEO of any other public company on the planet fired by the board immediately as they clearly are a completely ineffective strategist and executor, the only two things a CEO needs to do. He's being as unloyal to Tesla's long term strategy as Tinucci supposedly was to him, yet somehow it's OK when he does it and we should just give him a break.

Can we also stop with the gaslighting of Tinucci's position? She was a senior director reporting direct to Elon, not a "manager,"

 

[ucmndd]

(It seems like she tried to save ~20 people's job, and instead caused 500 to be let go.)

This is misplaced blame if I've ever seen it.

Firing a direct report for questioning/refusing your order is a prerogative of leadership.

Firing 500 people because a direct report questioned/refused your order is the scorched-earth work of a fragile, petulant man child. There is no passing the blame.

 

[E90alex]

Remember that Tesla and BP already had a previous agreement (fostered under Tinucci) where BP was going to buy V4 Supercharger hardware from Tesla to deploy on their own charging network.

So scooping up orphaned Tesla sites to deploy a BP branded site would be pretty trivial and easy work for BP, especially if much of the leg work had already been done. All the hardware, ground work, electrical requirements, layout etc would probably be identical to what Tesla would have done. Just need to install BP branded V4 pedestals instead of Tesla ones.

 

[gt2690b]

Remember that Tesla and BP already had a previous agreement (fostered under Tinucci) where BP was going to buy V4 Supercharger hardware from Tesla to deploy on their own charging network.

So scooping up orphaned Tesla sites to deploy a BP branded site would be pretty trivial and easy work for BP, especially if much of the leg work had already been done. All the hardware, ground work, electrical requirements, layout etc would probably be identical to what Tesla would have done. Just need to install BP branded V4 pedestals instead of Tesla ones.

So they still use the NACS plug?

 

[gt2690b]

Citation needed.
Elon saw sales drop 20% and now is laying off 20% of people with no additional strategy. That's the exact reverse of planning, that's reacting.

Classic Monday morning QB comment

 

[legendsk]

So much ranting about Tesla communications, decisions and the effect on employees. It's pretty much baseless without direct knowledge of an enormous amount of facts. There is so much FUD directed at Tesla from the industries and competitors that Tesla is disrupting, I hate to see more piled on.

My only concern, (as an all in investor and reasonably satisfied owner), is this: To have happy productive employees a business must pay them a reasonable wage for their work, treat them fairly, appreciate and recognize their efforts and provide them with opportunity for growth. With this environment there is no need for a union, those employees are not a good target market for unions and unions aren't going to waste good money trying to sell them their union services.

Tesla is apparently such a great rewarding place to work, not only are the employees staying with them longer than average, the company is top of the list for high performing candidates.

Complaining and whining about what you have heard, (or read) is just begging the unions to believe the employees are unhappy and likely a great target for union services. I do hate to see that.

 

[texas_star_TM3]

This is misplaced blame if I've ever seen it.

Firing a direct report for questioning/refusing your order is a prerogative of leadership.

Firing 500 people because a direct report questioned/refused your order is the scorched-earth work of a fragile, petulant man child. There is no passing the blame.

yup. good leaders question and stand up for what's right. not fire 20% off their team because the dear Leader said so "or else" ... Whatever culture Elon is currently fostering at Tesla ain't a good one. Exhibit a) senior executives leaving left and right

 

[gearchruncher]

Classic Monday morning QB comment

Cool.
So what "strategy" was involved in allowing Tinuuci to pick either laying off 20% of her team or laying off the whole team? Why did Elon leave that up to her instead of him?

What is the well thought out strategy in not telling your customers that supposedly Superchargers will sill expand "this year" until a week later, after getting completely roasted from every angle for that whole week?

 

[gearchruncher]

Tesla is apparently such a great rewarding place to work, not only are the employees staying with them longer than average, the company is top of the list for high performing candidates.

What data do you have for this in 2024? High ranking people are resigning in droves and posting stories about it on linkedin. It's not 2019 anymore.

Tesla executive says he's resigned as recent layoffs hurt morale and throw the company 'out of balance'

Tesla's former head of product launches, Rich Otto, said layoffs are "rocking the company and its morale."

www.businessinsider.com

It's a company I love and that has given me so much, but has also taken its pound of flesh," Otto wrote on LinkedIn. "Great companies are made up of equal parts great people and great products, and the latter are only possible when its people are thriving. The recent layoffs that are rocking the company and its morale have thrown this harmony out of balance and it's hard to see the long-game. It was time for a change."

That's from Rich Otto, the ex head of product launches at Tesla.

To have happy productive employees a business must pay them a reasonable wage for their work, treat them fairly, appreciate and recognize their efforts and provide them with opportunity for growth.

Guess what makes people question this? Seeing co-workers being fired in the middle of the night via email, or learning only when their badges do not work, without their managers even knowing. Or seeing that 500 people were fired all because Elon was annoyed that one of his Directors wouldn't do what he asked.

Nothing about that is a top performing company in 2024, and it's 100% on Elon's behavior, nothing else.

 

[MP3Mike]

I mean this has literally been reported from the get go.

The new detail, as far as I had seen, was that she was given a second chance to do as directed. So, it wasn't just a knee-jerk reaction from her initial refusal to follow directions.

And she didn't cause 500 people to be let go.

Sure, she did. She could have let go the extra 4%, or whatever the number was, and the rest wouldn't have been laid off. But she chose insubordination and got almost the entire division laid off. (You could say this was like the "trolley problem", and she decided to try to save the few by putting everyone in danger.)

I will lay them all off and close the division

Where are you getting the detail that Elon said he would "close the division"? Or are you just making that up? (It sure doesn't seem like he is closing it.)

Can we also stop with the gaslighting of Tinucci's position? She was a senior director reporting direct to Elon, not a "manager,"

From what I had heard she had literally just been made a direct report. So, this was a new relationship and she decided to set the tone be refusing to follow orders. (And if that was how she ran the division, that insubordination was acceptable, I can see why he would clear everyone out and start over. Insubordination is not to be taken lightly)