Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

[dl003]

So Elon will not build a bike because he "almost got killed by a truck" on one.

That's his reasoning for it?!

Yet he has no problem building trucks?

Make it make sense. I don't get it.

He said Tesla would not build unsafe vehicles. Is CT unsafe? No? There you go.

 

[2daMoon]

The CEO of a public corporation cannot simply take intellectual property from that corporation. That is called theft. Elon would be spending a lot of time in prison.

This will never, ever happen. Let’s stop considering it as a possibility.

The very fact that some shareholders are actively trying to keep Elon from receiving what is owed to him is example enough of how voting shareholders should not be trusted with deciding the future of AI.

However, if the board were to decide to change some aspects of the current arrangement because they felt it important for Tesla to keep AI safe, that would be entirely possible without it being theft.

Heck, I'd love to see it set up where the R&D is contracted to a benevolent private caretaker and the application of the AI is reserved for use by Tesla as part of the agreement.

Tesla funds the private organization for their research and development by paying them to create the applications. Maybe the private firm shares time on Tesla owned servers.

Nothing changes with development of the AI aspect of FSD, Optimus, and other Tesla AI applications. Tesla keeps 100% control of the hardware design, production, and sale/subscription for the products. The private company holds the rights to the AI development, contracted to Tesla.

Such an arrangement solves for Elon's concern of bad actors gaining enough voting shares to control the AI development in a detrimental manner. Which is possible as it is set up now. This is scary important stuff. Look at what happened to OpenAI now being "ClosedAI" thanks to Microsoft getting their fingers in that pie. This, and worse, is what Elon wants to prevent. AI is in its infancy and needs to be provided a well-rounded view of the world.

Money-grubbers might not spend time teaching AI about morals, ethics, and philosophy. That might not be good for mankind.

There have been plenty of people who think that just because the AI brain trust and the rights to the AI development move into private hands that this will automatically have a negative affect on Tesla. This is not necessarily the only way to do it. If the transfer is designed to be mutually beneficial for Tesla and the private party, and protects the ethical development of the AI, everybody wins.

If push comes to shove, I think I'll trust the Tesla BoD to figure out a clever way to accomplish this, and do it in a way that includes future financial benefit for Tesla in the process.

There's more than one way to skin this artificial cat.

Interested parties should take time to think about the myriad ways this could be accomplished, instead of knee-jerking like someone wants to take their birthday away. There are endless possibilities on how this can be accomplished, it is just a matter of choosing which way they want to do it.

 

[dhanson865]

General Lee wrap on a Cybertruck. Done well I'd say. The rebel flag was put on the tonneau cover so it can be rolled away and hidden. 4 pictures behind the first link, a video on the 2nd.

https://www.reddit.com/gallery/1cuzi4z

Spoiler: I hate autoplay videos

https://www.reddit.com/r/cybertruck/comments/1cv193d/cybertruck_kid_rock

 

[dbeiler]

He said Tesla would not build unsafe vehicles. Is CT unsafe? No? There you go.

You're missing the point. Elon's ironic solution to minimizing motorcycle fatalities by truck................................is by building more trucks.

 

[dl003]

You're missing the point. Elon's ironic solution to minimizing motorcycle fatalities by truck................................is by building more trucks.

Except Im not missing the point. You are. His goal has never been to minimize motorcycle deaths. His goal is to build the safest vehicles on the road. Period.

 

[dbeiler]

We clearly have different definitions of safest. Your definition apparently does not extend past the occupants of said vehicle.

 

[dbeiler]

Zero Motorcycles DS - Electric Motorcycle Company

Pushing the boundaries of technology and design

zeromotorcycles.com

There are a few already. Leave Tesla out of this.

I'm aware of that. Sondors has had my money for about two years now. I still don't have the motorcycle I paid for. Probably never will either. Rumor has it, Mr. Sondors now drives a Range Rover around Italy, a good fortune made possible by me and ten thousand other suckers paying him for motorcycles we'll never actually receive.

 

[dl003]

We clearly have different definitions of safest. Your definition apparently does not extend past the occupants of said vehicle.

Safety for passengers is literally the only parameter of NHTSA's rating tests. Nobody buys a car with the goal of keeping everyone outside the car safe. If thats your goal, walk.

 

[jabloomf1230]

I want to preface my remarks that for what it's worth, I voted yes. But if the nos have it and Elon leaves, I won't cry. It was one thing when he was advocating for electric vehicles and Mars, but after COVID hit, his true libertarian side began to show. I don't blame him for being anti-government. Most corporate leaders are also. But his use of X as a personal hype machine overemphasizes his views on a multitude of hot button topics. My guess is that the next Tesla CEO will be more like other CEOs. The most visible of the lot are people like Buffett and Dimon and they rarely pontificate at the levels that Elon Musk does. What Tesla needs is a quiet, sensible leader, not a loose cannon.

Considering the lack of community consensus, as evidenced by the disparate ratings of my post, I request that it be nominated as a Post of Indistinction.

 

[aswami]

Thoughts...
Elon prefers private companies without all the public scrutiny and manipulation. ALL of Elon's non-Tesla companies are private. He's already tangled with taking Tesla private (fail) and has recently expressed dissatisfaction with his current control position of Tesla vs his vision of "futures"...If this compensation package re-vote fails, I don't see how he doesn't use that sentiment to help him decide his future effort/time should be different.

Simply, I don't think my investment in Tesla improves if the comp vote fails. As a matter of fact, I would seriously have to reconsider my exit strategy, likely sooner since Tesla's future products and demonic drive become questionable. Short term seems like it could be very ugly. I just can't wrap my head around the point of view that one's TSLA investment improves with a "no" vote.

You are absolutely spot on. I am quite shocked to see people on this forum also think a "no" vote is a good option. Thought people here understood the situation a lot better than say, people on Reddit. A "no" vote does not help anyone, neither in the short term nor in the long term, including the shareholder who voted. The fact that some people have been led to believe it's a good option shows how vulnerable people can be to propaganda-induced hate and hate-induced bad judgment.

 

[Knightshade]

Not only is a dedicated GPU in the vehicle an expensive part that only a small percentage of owners end up using, but it becomes obsolete rather quickly and would take even more time and service resource to upgrade.

To be clear- the dGPU in the S/X is still more powerful than the majority of the top 10 GPUs in steams HW survey of its users... ... the #2 and #4 most used cards in the survey are from early 2019 for example- the #6 and #10 most commonly used cards are from 2016.

Given it's driving a ~1080p/60 screen the dGPU in those cars would be fine to run AAA games for at least another 5-8 years if not longer without issue-(see again 8 year old GPUs are still 2 of the top 10 most used on Steam today-- there'd be no need to upgrade anything.

We know Elon is on a hard core cost cut to the bone kick though, and this'll certainly save a few bucks on the BOMs of S/X

A lot has changed in the PC gaming industry since Tesla first put gaming GPUs in the S and X. The Nintendo Switch and the Steam Deck have really shifted the industry toward performant and affordable gaming handhelds that can easily be played in a vehicle. Even with robotaxi, it just doesn't make sense for Tesla to provide the gaming hardware in-vehicle when you can get a better experience you can play in the car or at home with a PC handheld.

I mean, it never really made sense.... even weirder was MCU3 for the 3/Y never got the HW to do it in the first place- it was exclusive to the S/X. (not even the 100k CT got the "better" MCU)-- so it's unclear why they ever did it at all other than it made a flashy tech demo at the refresh launch...


BTW [B}speaking of that[/B] since Folks were discussing things Elon says that don't come true--- we can add this one to the list... he promised you'd be able to play Cyberpunk 2077 on your Cybertruck- but CT never shipped with steam-capable HW and now no Tesla will going forward-

https://twitter.com/x/status/1496245689201967104

It could also be that they looked at how many people use the Steam functionality, and, it is actually not very many at all. (guessing)

See above, Only like 5% of annual sales even had the HW to do it in the first place.

 

[BioSehnsucht]

To be clear- the dGPU in the S/X is still more powerful than the majority of the top 10 GPUs in steams HW survey of its users... ... the #2 and #4 most used cards in the survey are from early 2019 for example- the #6 and #10 most commonly used cards are from 2016.

Given it's driving a ~1080p/60 screen the dGPU in those cars would be fine to run AAA games for at least another 5-8 years if not longer without issue-(see again 8 year old GPUs are still 2 of the top 10 most used on Steam today-- there'd be no need to upgrade anything.

We know Elon is on a hard core cost cut to the bone kick though, and this'll certainly save a few bucks on the BOMs of S/X




I mean, it never really made sense.... even weirder was MCU3 for the 3/Y never got the HW to do it in the first place- it was exclusive to the S/X. (not even the 100k CT got the "better" MCU)-- so it's unclear why they ever did it at all other than it made a flashy tech demo at the refresh launch...


BTW [B}speaking of that[/B] since Folks were discussing things Elon says that don't come true--- we can add this one to the list... he promised you'd be able to play Cyberpunk 2077 on your Cybertruck- but CT never shipped with steam-capable HW and now no Tesla will going forward-

https://twitter.com/x/status/1496245689201967104

See above, Only like 5% of annual sales even had the HW to do it in the first place.

I'd buy an upgrade to ryzen mcu for my atom based model 3 if they'd let me.

 

[cliff harris]

and his staff is almost back to pre EM days.

And your verified independent source for this would be?

 

[Matias]

Is he saying he will take AI and Optimus out of Tesla if the vote fails?

View attachment 1048462

He doesn’t own Tesla’s AI and Optimus. Tesla owns them.

 

[Matias]

Another FSD vs. Waymo video from Callas in Pheonix. Both performed well. Tesla won again by taking a faster route, but it was close.

The only challenging part was an unprotected left at the beginning of the drive. Both handled it perfectly.

I think that places like Pheonix should be easy for FSD robotaxi to conquer. It just needs better parking lot behavior and some robotaxi-specific training like how to pick up passengers.

It was nice. First time in few years I'm hopeful for Tesla's FSD.

 

[spacerfc]

He doesn’t own Tesla’s AI and Optimus. Tesla owns them.

What Tesla owns can be sold:

Tesla sells wireless charging unit firm Wiferion, but keeps its engineers

Tesla has sold Wiferion, a wireless charging startup it acquired in June 2023, to PULS, a DIN rail power supply provider.

www.teslarati.com

Or downsized to shift focus:

Tesla downsizing residential solar business bought for $2.6bn

Company to close facilities and end Home Depot partnership after buying company founded by Elon Musk’s cousins

www.theguardian.com

 

[Matias]

What Tesla owns can be sold:

Tesla sells wireless charging unit firm Wiferion, but keeps its engineers

Tesla has sold Wiferion, a wireless charging startup it acquired in June 2023, to PULS, a DIN rail power supply provider.

www.teslarati.com

Or downsized to shift focus:

Tesla downsizing residential solar business bought for $2.6bn

Company to close facilities and end Home Depot partnership after buying company founded by Elon Musk’s cousins

www.theguardian.com

Of course.

 

[FEERSUMENDJIN]

Fortunately, short-haul regional flights will be the first to go electric. Here's one company in the flight testing phase of development with 250 NM range. If they can adopt Tesla's attitude toward manufacturing efficiency this project might really ... take off.

Intercontinental flights are the ones that will call for lighter, energy-dense batteries, as well as lightweight, efficient motors to make those distances and loads feasible.

intercontinental. starship ground to ground. solar catalysed methanogenesis from co2 and water.

 

[FEERSUMENDJIN]

As the weather warms up and summer gets closer, I've become painfully aware of the missing vehicle in the Tesla lineup. We need a Tesla motorcycle.

Where is my Tesla motorcycle, Elon?

All this fabulous battery, BMS, and motor tech, but I'm forced to burn up four tires at a time to experience it?

We deserve a motorcycle!!!

look to Finland, Experience Life on the Verge - Verge Motorcycles

 

[FastEddieB]

Think of that as the electric plane version of the first Tesla Roadster.

It is only a matter of when, not if.

Agree.

Battery technology is creeping forward, but slowly and incrementally. And batteries in an airplane need to be lightweight, energy dense and capable of being recharged quickly*. At the current rate of improvement, I’d say we’re at least a decade away from a transport-category electric aircraft, barring some revolution in battery tech within that time frame.

*Or perhaps swappable.