Pack Performance and Launch Mode Limits

[sillydriver]

Yep, no power limits here - still a happy camper with my P85DL!

I feel the same way. My P85DL has always had less power than most of the cars owned by people on this thread, but I haven't had power taken away. In fact when the L upgrade came along I had additional power added at a reasonable price. So even though your cars all beat mine, I'm the happy one. Psychology/behavioral economics is a funny thing.

 

[benjiejr]

When you say your P85DL is not affected, are you implying that your car achieves the advertised horsepower and acceleration specifications that were in place when you purchased?

The latest update did not remove any power. I'm getting the same power output (within 6 kW) as the prior updates.

I purchased the car without Ludicrous as it didn't exist at the time. I upgraded to Ludicrous and did get a power increase but I never got anywhere close to 500 kW peak.

 

[Tech_Guy]

Nor would you expect a p85d ludicrous to produce more then around 455 heres some community data to reference for power levels at different SOC

 

[jerjozwik]

@jerjozwik Thanks. Though I am thinking the 4/21/2016 manual contains launch mode verbiage?
I would like the Sept 2015 ish version so I can refer directly to the owners manual of the car I purchased when dealing with Tesla. Haven't been able to get it yet. Need to contact Tesla again.

it has comments on launch mode, max battery, and ludicrous modes. i dont have anything before that as i took delivery 2-28-2016.

 

[NOLA_Mike]

@jerjozwik Thanks. Though I am thinking the 4/21/2016 manual contains launch mode verbiage?
I would like the Sept 2015 ish version so I can refer directly to the owners manual of the car I purchased when dealing with Tesla. Haven't been able to get it yet. Need to contact Tesla again.

I have multiple owner's manuals saved from 2013 on. Quick look reveals I downloaded and saved it on 11/2015 (v7.0), 04/2015 (v6.2). 12/2014 (v6.0).

Let me know via PM if you want me to send you any one of those.

Mike

 

[Walta]

I have multiple owner's manuals saved from 2013 on. Quick look reveals I downloaded and saved it on 11/2015 (v7.0), 04/2015 (v6.2). 12/2014 (v6.0).

Let me know via PM if you want me to send you any one of those.

Mike

Thanks @NOLA_Mike - I will PM you.

 

[AnonNJ]

Here it is:

"We have looked into your concern a bit deeper and have found that vehicles will no longer provide full power during regular driving. Full power will now only be available during Launch mode which is firmware controlled. I hope this answers your questions, if not feel free to reach out to me."

The high performance awesome vehicle that I purchased, has become lower performance due to restrictions placed on the vehicle post purchase. I have a problem with this.

 

[JRP3]

I assume you'll be "reaching out" on this matter. Really odd that Tesla thinks this will fly.

 

[jeffro01]

While not technically applicable to the discussion, I wanted to add an additional thought here... Reading this thread has completely talked me out of any future "P" model purchases I was once seriously considering...

Tesla, if you're reading this, keep in mind this thread is most certainly costing you customers for your highest margin vehicles...

Jeff

 

[Walta]

Here it is:

"We have looked into your concern a bit deeper and have found that vehicles will no longer provide full power during regular driving. Full power will now only be available during Launch mode which is firmware controlled. I hope this answers your questions, if not feel free to reach out to me."

The high performance awesome vehicle that I purchased, has become lower performance due to restrictions placed on the vehicle post purchase. I have a problem with this.

WOW!!!!!!!!!!

This is SO not cool. I haven't received word back yet from my SA regarding the recent power reduction. I pinged my SA again this morning. I am assuming at this point I am going to get the same response.

How can Jon / Tesla think that this is a fair solution to their battery design issue? While this does not directly impact all Tesla owners, it is such a slimy action that all owners need to speak up and defend everyone's right to get/keep the car we paid for.

WOW!!!!!!!!!!

 

[AnonNJ]

I assume you'll be "reaching out" on this matter. Really odd that Tesla thinks this will fly.

Very in touch.

 

[yak-55]

Here it is:

"We have looked into your concern a bit deeper and have found that vehicles will no longer provide full power during regular driving. Full power will now only be available during Launch mode which is firmware controlled. I hope this answers your questions, if not feel free to reach out to me."

The high performance awesome vehicle that I purchased, has become lower performance due to restrictions placed on the vehicle post purchase. I have a problem with this.

Here we go again ... more stupidity from The Genius ...

 

[hostman]

Here it is:

"We have looked into your concern a bit deeper and have found that vehicles will no longer provide full power during regular driving. Full power will now only be available during Launch mode which is firmware controlled. I hope this answers your questions, if not feel free to reach out to me."

The high performance awesome vehicle that I purchased, has become lower performance due to restrictions placed on the vehicle post purchase. I have a problem with this.

Yeah, um, F*** THAT.

 

[Andyw2100]

When you say your P85DL is not affected, are you implying that your car achieves the advertised horsepower and acceleration specifications that were in place when you purchased?

There's not a P85DL on the planet that achieves or ever achieved the "advertised at purchase time" horsepower.

 

[Spidy]

How can Jon / Tesla think that this is a fair solution to their battery design issue?

I don't think they do. I think they realized they made a big mistake with pushing their performance cars like this for marketing and sales. Now they just are in full damage control. First the counters where when people discovered it they probably realized that is a class action lawsuit waiting to happen. Now they try this full power in launch mode even for older cars hoping that they maybe can get away with that one...

 

[Walta]

I don't think they do. I think they realized they made a big mistake with pushing their performance cars like this for marketing and sales. Now they just are in full damage control. First the counters where when people discovered it they probably realized that is a class action lawsuit waiting to happen. Now they try this full power in launch mode even for older cars hoping that they maybe can get away with that one...

Back when Tesla was sending software updates that improved vehicles... I was VERY impressed. So many owners were blown away that while they slept their car was waiting for them to install the next batch of goodness. Talk about bang for the buck. Then came the over promise / under deliver years. Now my car has depreciated in value from a software upgrade. Tesla has realized that while software upgrades are great to improve their cars, they can also be used to protect their bottom line.
The P90DL has a battery design flaw that will eventually damage the battery if you drive the car as advertised. No problem. Tesla has a solution. Software limit the power when certain performance counters have triggered ! Don't tell anyone.. just do it.
What??? Owners don't like the permanent power reduction fix??
No problem. Tesla will remove ALL power reduction software. Just wait a couple weeks. Install the new software and you are back to normal. Yay! Thanks Tesla! What a great company. I just want to give Tesla a big hug.

What??? Now max power is ONLY available when using LM and MBR? Check your owners manual - there is new verbiage supporting the new way the car works. Pretty convenient they can also rev the owners manual during the software upgrade to support their new solution. I cannot believe they think this is OK?

How is that not a flat out lie? How is that anywhere near "removing all power reduction software" ????

I did not purchase the car I currently own. I would NOT have purchased the car I currently own.

This is like watching CNN or FoxNews every night. I keep thinking if I just have one more martini - this will all make sense.

 

[jeffro01]

@Walta your post does bring up one thing that I used to never think would happen... Tesla using it's advantage with regards to software updates to retroactively impact the performance characteristics of the car. I used to, in the early days, defend Tesla constantly when people would suggest there may come a time where Tesla could use this to benefit them... I thought surely Tesla would never do something so egregious or risky... I used to also think that people like @Ingineer or @wk057 were doing something "wrong" or "unethical" by reverse engineering the software. I now realize that my stance on both issues was wrong and without those working behind the scenes forcing some semblance of transparency, we may never have known what was going on...

Kuddos to those who have been willing and able to pull the curtain back and show us how this really works and what the software really does, your efforts have been invaluable... Especially in this conversation which started with me attacking @Ingineer for even bringing it up in the first place which of course was wrong....

Come on Tesla... Show some damn integrity and stop with the shell game...

Jeff

 

[SDRick]

Given the current software restriction, has anyone figured out the performance benefit (in normal everyday non-LM driving) derived from the $10,000 ludicrous upgrade?

 

[Jeffgtx]

From a post earlier it was mentioned that before the upgrade, the max output is 1300A. After it is 1500A without launch mode.

So there is benefit to the upgrade if that is true.

 

[stopcrazypp]

Given the current software restriction, has anyone figured out the performance benefit (in normal everyday non-LM driving) derived from the $10,000 ludicrous upgrade?

The same as it was explicitly laid out during the Ludicrous launch: it boosts battery current from 1300A to 1500A. 1500A is the only explicit promise Tesla made (which is likely why they chose that as the limit).

The main change is any extra over 1500A (which only came into being for the P90DL v2/v3 and P100DL) is only available in Launch mode. Tesla never explicitly promised anything over 1500A (although others argue the 10.9 second 1/4 mile was an indirect promise of such).