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Like most things Tesla, its biggest advantage is marketing and deception

In my experience, anyone not put off by Tesla won’t be put off at all by Porsche dealer culture. Far more welcoming and professional than dealing with Tesla.

Most of the discussion is on range. The price difference isn’t primarily due to range. But your confusion is natural- this notion that Tesla’s cheap offering can compete with taycan because they have similar actual range is reliant on promoting range anxiety that would make ICE CEOs blush. A...

Right, by the time it gets to rolling resistance, and potential reduction from tires, and previous inefficiencies deltas are irrelevant. I want EV specific tires for performance, not efficiency. Your last point is on the money too. Let’s be real, it’s nearly all about range, or rather...

What an ignorant post. I wish I could enjoy this bliss. Get out more past your narrow little network. You’ll find much EV angst is ignorance ultimately sourced from political and social motives. Particularly with Tesla. Most haven’t done the research. Most haven’t driven an EV and tested how to...

Recent geo-political things have helped. But I’m on a forum for gas and electric, with many “true” Texans, as they see themselves, and they now treat Austin as though it’s California. Tesla’s are generally good cars, so the hate should slowly erode as more of these people actually become...

The gen side won’t be an issue, although capacity factors will increase. And mass EV adoption is an existential threat to peaking units, not a benefit. They’ll ultimately run less and become economically unviable with the advent of AI/IoT based storage and virtual power plants. There’s a reason...

Only when wanting a toy. Something like a 911 is desired at times. I mean, it’s like the fact I’ve had a motorcycle for decades. It’s fun- a lot of user input needed for the times I’m looking for that. Sounds great too. The only other time I use ICE is road trips. But we use a PHEV.

Agree. Largely due to Tesla, it’s now more than just ICE vs BEV. Or environment benefits. EVs are better coupled to IoT and AI. Big Data. And energy arbitrage. They’re Tech, not just the next generation of cars on the Detroitian family tree. And with anything Tech, but particularly AI, the...

Yep. EVs have been politicalized in America. There is a large segment that otherwise don’t care about cars that are against them. Largely based on ignorance and being the easy targets of those that gain from delaying EV adoption. Whether they hate EVs because of Tesla or they started hating...

Likely all true- and anticipated- but one needs to drive them to see if the “step down” is worth the savings. Put this way, I was torn on whether to get the Taycan I tested over a S, knowing it was paying a lot more for what ultimately still just one “similar” car. I was hoping the new options...

Yes, the main issue with the Taycan isn’t inherent to EV. It’s the same issue as with any top trim level Porsche. I’ve always enjoyed the drive of their top trims, but have passed because you can get the normal trim plus another good car instead. In 2013 we instead got a MS over something like a...

I cannot agree with this more.We had the same experience. And the Turbo S is even a better drive. And the Turbo not that much less than a our first S. I can’t wait to see what VW Group starts producing once they’re a few iterations in like Tesla.

Beautiful car. We felt the same. It’s a better car, and nearly equal EV to the MY. The range was nearly as functional as the MY given charging characteristics, and that we rarely needed 150+ miles. The issue for me was the inferior acceleration. But my wife it’s plenty for my wife coming from ICE.

Cars being AI and part of IoT will help with a lot of these “issues”. In high population density areas, car ownership will likely go down as the next generation of EVs disrupt transportation. That’s assuming the industry doesn’t go towards leasing batteries and battery swapping as the dominant...

Right on. Lol at overblown range anxiety. I’m surprised this ignorance exists on TMC. You would think EV owners and fans would understand. But I suppose they’re more Tesla fans than they are EV fans. Nearly all experienced Tesla owners that have real-world tested the Taycan will be impressed...

It’s a not a startup issue. It’s not even an viewed as an issue to Tesla. Things like panel gap and private owners frustrated with customer service is a relic in the vision of Tesla. Great customer service from a car manufacturer is a weak moat in a competitive market, and no benefit in the...

Will it be a high end sports car? Will it have high-end handling and luxury? The original was great, but also a Lotus. The Model 3 gives me hope in regards to handling, although I still don’t see Tesla matching some of the legacy manufacturers outside of the superior drive train. At $140k...

Wow, I hope the production model looks like that.

Interesting point. There is definitely a dichotomy between offering bleeding edge performance at ultra premium prices and things like spartan robo taxis, making EVs the cheap, mainstream car.

I still think the S is a great looking car, maybe the best. It does need to be brought up-to-date and better appointed. Please use some of the production cost savings to at least have the features of a Kia.

It isn’t? I’ll try to be clearer, but it would help if you could elaborate on why you don’t think it’s an explanation. You posted “How is it shameful that they didn't agree to do something that has nothing to do with them?“ I dispute it had nothing to do with them. Is this not emission policy...

Only supporting Utopian solutions is obstruction too. The “ if it’s not perfect we won’t support it” policy is shortsighted at best, self-serving at worst imo. In the transition to lower emissions, only supporting that being a step change isn’t actually expediting the movement imo

This is all political, and there is arguably no bigger player now in the politics of vehicle emissions.

You egregiously missed the point, which was not about praising Ford for lowering emissions via their production lines. Perfection is the enemy of good in the transition to lower emission standards. It’s shameful Tesla didn’t join Ford imo, and corporate greed got the better of them imo. Tesla...

Ha! I think the average consumer still benefits to some degree. Some of the R&D required to achieve this performance trickles down. Not a perfect example, but Tesla isn’t what they are today without the Roadster and Model S, which at the time were expensive cars. But it’s an interesting...

Other manufacturers really miss the mark with their regen braking.

Your previous scenario falls short of being an example of throwing bad money after good, or endlessly funding a loser. Thanks to Tesla, a company like Rivian has a long leash. However, I do hope there those that still apply more conventional valuations. My retirement thanks them for their...

We won’t really know until they’re both on the road. Way too many fine print details to hide behind in these reveals. What we do know is that cars powered by electric motors and batteries are increasingly more capable than anything you’ll find in ICE. For much less, too. Even just carefully...

I definitely blame Lucid having a better car than they initially had in the Plaid. The cobbled together reveal with little real details or substance in combination with the delay to late 2021 seems clearly due to Lucid’s specs. I hope Lucid’s tri motor doesn’t turn out to be even better, or...

It’s true that in the infancy of the transition to EVs, and there will be new blood to sustain growth. It’s completely within Tesla’s ethos to exploit that most buyers coming from legacy manufacturers are ignorant that Tesla is not bound by industry quality standards and customer service...

For how long the Plaid drivetrain has been worked on and rumored, the presentation/reveal was short in substance and seemed hastily thrown together. Like they were recently forced to delay or reformulate what they’ve been working on. It’s possible that under 9 number is in reality just...

Sure, I reserved one. It’s basically free. I hope it happens as Elon alluded to, before 2022. I remember getting excited about the roadster years ago and buying into the Plaid as a response to the Taycan in 2019. Now it’s probably 2022 before i can get one? After all this time, it’s now more...

How long do you plan to own the car? I can’t speak to your area, but I wouldn’t have any problem utilizing a taycan like I do our M3P. Better range performance than expected. In a couple years I anticipate it to be further marginalized. I’m interested in a EV Macan.

It’s a great car. The 911 is more fun, but the Taycsn gives you nearly as much fun but with 4 doors.

Was good (great) in the beginning and now it’s appalling from a corporate ethos standpoint, although I know many good but overwhelmed people at local levels. Way too little infrastructure investment, particularly given the desire to push QC to the consumer and service level. Poor customer...

The “don’t worry” about it remedy says it all about Tesla quality control. I don’t mind panel gaps, but I’ll measure them on my next Tesla purchase as a means to gauge Tesla’s ethos. They’ve more than earned the rep of utilizing “with-in spec” as a way out of service, so the actual spec and...

He’s effectively correct, although I’m sure Tesla legal would have him rephrase it. Tesla passes on the burden of quality control to the buyer, and they are increasingly reliant on obstructionism to decrease the burden even further. They know the industry standard for quality is higher than...

Little value without Robo? Robo taxis isn’t that much of the Million mile battery value. The million mile battery converts Tesla from being an EV company to an energy storage company. V2G, Energy arbitrage, and FinTech/blockchain become Tesla’s domain. It’s just as needed as Dojo/AI for Tesla...

Great marketing gimmick. Capitalize on the misconceptions of EVs.

Not that interesting in lap times.The UP M3 driven by Pobst beat Tesla’s 3-motor Model S. For Lucid’s tri-motor to already beat the UP M3P by 2 seconds and the Plaid by 3 seconds is significant. I wonder what UP and Pobst could post in a Lucid tri-motor?

Having less range isn’t ad important in most countries, or to those that realize most of it is just anxiety. This marginalizes the SC advantage, assuming that exists outside of the US.

It makes no sense if price is the biggest factor. But until the Plaid comes out, the M3 is the closest in feel to the Taycan. The best EV I’ve driven is the Taycan Turbo S. I can’t wait to see what the roadster is like, although I prefer the 5-door sedan.

You think they’re beating Tesla Plaid’s record by 3 seconds with just a dual motor? That would be quite the feat.

Ford trying to Osborne the Cyber Truck and Rivian? This doesn’t really speak to most F150 buyers. Imo not many Ford ICE truck buyers will make the jump to EV without Tesla fans first spreading the EV Enlightenment. Ford just needs to be ready for when more and more of those ICE truck buyers...

Relevant doesn’t matter? I guess that logic is consistent with thinking $50k for a car in which most everything is cost-cut and that will quickly be antiquated is a better value. I think the opposite is true. The analog, physical controls are much cheaper and easier to keep working. Ask Model S...

Decades? Ask model S owners how quickly that “decade” goes. Is spending thousands more making changes needed to keep this car somewhat relevant, like some Model S owners have had to do, is appealing to you? Yes, Tesla’s cabin will “age” better, but that’s inherent to the fact cheap now is...

Let the tri-motor race begin. Lucid’s Tri-Motor Retakes Tesla’s Plaid Record at Laguna Seca

Unfortunately I can imagine spending $50k on a spartan car optimized for the 20% of driving utilization (and for robo owners cleaning puke out of the cabin on a Sunday morning), when I could have bought a car better for the 80% of my use, and without losing much on the other 20%. I tell myself...

I think that’s a leap, but I also don’t view legacies as being that keen on what disruptive technology they should worry about. Based on cost, CT should be more of a concern. Rivisn’s truck is competing more with Jeep types than full size F150 types imo.