Displayed range is actual, not ideal, right?

[Hhrraath]

Hello,

I just wanted to confirm with anyone who knows the actual info from Tesla. The number showed on the mileage range is a predicted actual and not ideal miles, correct? I ask because I have a P3D+ and the numbers shown look accurate for actual when calculating Wh/mi but very flow if ideal.

The Model S has a toggle between the actual and ideal but us 3s don't seem to have the toggle.

Thanks,

Jeff

 

[TexasEV]

It displays the EPA rated range. It’s only the “actual” range if you’re driving the EPA test cycle. Remember the YMMV from ICE ads? Same thing here.

 

[azred]

From our colleague Troy’s post Aug 6, 2017. (Of course, there have been many posts before and after with differing opinions.)


“2. Model 3 LR usable capacity is more than Model S 85/85D/P85D.

Usable capacity is 78.3 kWh (source: page 6 footer). This is more than the usable capacity of the Model S 85, 85D, P85D. Those have 77.5 kWh usable capacity (source). At that time Tesla was over advertising battery pack sizes. This problem only affected the 85 and 90 kWh packs. Both of these packs have less than advertised capacity. Tesla later corrected this problem with the 75 and 100 kWh packs.”

I know you asked for the data from Tesla. Good luck with that search. (FYI my 2016 S75 has been estimated at 72.6 useable kWh and of course all Model S models are much heavier.)

Bottom line is most of the tech experts here believe the LR 3 capacity has been deliberately underestimated at 310 miles to protect S and X sales. Makes sense, right?

As for the previous post referring to EPA rated range, I believe the EPA estimated 338ish miles and Tesla requested that it be reported as 310 miles.

 

[Hhrraath]

It displays the EPA rated range. It’s only the “actual” range if you’re driving the EPA test cycle. Remember the YMMV from ICE ads? Same thing here.

If it is showing the EPA range why does mine show 222 miles at 80% charge? That sounds to me like a number adjusted for my energy usage which is higher than a RWD model. The number used to be higher when I first got it. I am now at almost 5k miles. It feels in line with where it would be for actual. For further context, I brought it in to service a couple weeks back and they said the log said the battery was operating as it is supposed to.

 

[brianmeow]

If it is showing the EPA range why does mine show 222 miles at 80% charge? That sounds to me like a number adjusted for my energy usage which is higher than a RWD model. The number used to be higher when I first got it. I am now at almost 5k miles. It feels in line with where it would be for actual. For further context, I brought it in to service a couple weeks back and they said the log said the battery was operating as it is supposed to.

I have the same issue, been dropping a lately to around 235 miles at 80% charged.
Did the service center run any test? I have an appt with them next week.

 

[TexasEV]

Stop limiting your charge to 80% and the algorithm which estimates state of charge will be more accurate. Try setting it to 90% and charging daily to that level for several weeks.

 

[ChrisH]

Mine has been charging to 80% for weeks and charges to 247 or 248 every time.

 

[brianmeow]

Mine has been charging to 80% for weeks and charges to 247 or 248 every time.

it had been around 247 miles for me as well for 2 months, then started to drop around 2 weeks ago, around 2-3 miles every other day

 

[JeffK]

I average 320 Wh / mi

It doesn't say 187 miles when I charge to 80%

 

[brianmeow]

I average 320 Wh / mi

It doesn't say 187 miles when I charge to 80%

i avg 210 wh/mi, and yet it dropped to 233 miles at 80%

 

[Hhrraath]

Stop limiting your charge to 80% and the algorithm which estimates state of charge will be more accurate. Try setting it to 90% and charging daily to that level for several weeks.

Why will limiting charge to 90% make the estimate more accurate? I read that charging to 75-80% daily is better for the long term life of the batttery.

 

[D3xDt3Reaction]

Why will limiting charge to 90% make the estimate more accurate? I read that charging to 75-80% daily is better for the long term life of the batttery.

See Model 3 Performance Battery Degradation One Month (Story)

 

[dgpcolorado]

Hello,

I just wanted to confirm with anyone who knows the actual info from Tesla. The number showed on the mileage range is a predicted actual and not ideal miles, correct? I ask because I have a P3D+ and the numbers shown look accurate for actual when calculating Wh/mi but very flow if ideal.

The Model S has a toggle between the actual and ideal but us 3s don't seem to have the toggle.

Thanks,

Jeff

The Model 3 manual doesn't make clear what the "estimated driving distance" number actually is, but if it is like the Model S it should be this:

The battery estimated driving distance number is based on the EPA energy use number, as TexasEV said above. It is usually referred to as "rated miles" here at TMC because it is based on the "EPA rated" range. Another way to look at it is that the displayed miles is an energy gauge. It does NOT mean that you can drive that far unless you drive at the EPA rated efficiency, which would be rare. The number is based on the calculated energy in the battery pack divided by the EPA efficiency number (I think it is about 230-240 Wh/mile for the Model 3 but I'm not sure). The number does not adjust for driving style or conditions.

It might be less confusing if new owners would change their display to %SOC instead of rated miles, so that they don't get misled into believing that the rated miles is how far they can drive — it is not, it is a calculation of the energy in the battery and does not adjust for driving conditions.

The rated miles number will fluctuate somewhat at a given state of charge because measuring battery charge is difficult and is subject to fluctuations in the variables (it's complicated). The number should gradually decrease over time as the battery degrades, because the battery will hold less charge, but it will also fluctuate with temperature, charging regimen and when the measurement is made (driving, charging, or just parked).

Some other EVs try to give a range estimate that adjusts for driving conditions. Tesla's rated miles number is not like that. However, Tesla does have an adjustable energy gauge when using navigation. It will tell you the estimated %SOC left at your destination and it will update this number in real time as you drive. This is a very helpful tool for road trips. The Model 3 owner's manual describes it like this:

Predicting Energy Usage
When navigating to a destination, Model 3 helps you anticipate your charging needs by calculating the amount of energy that remains when you reach your destination. The calculation is an estimate based on driving style (predicted speed, etc.) and environmental factors (elevation changes, weather, etc.). When you initiate a navigation route, the touchscreen displays this calculation at the bottom of the turn-by-turn direction list. Thereafter, you can display it by touching the area at the bottom of the turn-by-turn direction list.

Throughout your route, Model 3 monitors energy usage and updates the calculation. A popup warning displays at the bottom of the turn-by-turn direction list in these situations:

• A yellow warning displays when you have very little energy remaining to reach your destination and should drive slowly to conserve energy. For tips on conserving energy, see Getting Maximum Range on page 55.

• A red warning displays when you must charge to reach your destination.

If you always want to know if you have enough energy for round trips, you can choose to display the round trip energy calculation at the bottom of the turn-by-turn direction list. Touch the Settings icon on the map, and then touch Always Show Estimated Round Trip Energy. If this setting is not enabled, an estimate of your round trip energy usage displays at the bottom of the turn-by-turn direction list only if the estimated energy remaining after completion of the round trip is less than ten percent, or if the round trip consumes a significant amount of your available energy.

FWIW.

 

[sperkin]

Mine has been charging to 80% for weeks and charges to 247 or 248 every time.

Same here. Mine is at 247 to 249 at 80% depending when it stopped charging.

 

[Hhrraath]

The Model 3 manual doesn't make clear what the "estimated driving distance" number actually is, but if it is like the Model S it should be this:

The battery estimated driving distance number is based on the EPA energy use number, as TexasEV said above. It is usually referred to as "rated miles" here at TMC because it is based on the "EPA rated" range. Another way to look at it is that the displayed miles is an energy gauge. It does NOT mean that you can drive that far unless you drive at the EPA rated efficiency, which would be rare. The number is based on the calculated energy in the battery pack divided by the EPA efficiency number (I think it is about 230-240 Wh/mile for the Model 3 but I'm not sure). The number does not adjust for driving style or conditions.

It might be less confusing if new owners would change their display to %SOC instead of rated miles, so that they don't get misled into believing that the rated miles is how far they can drive — it is not, it is a calculation of the energy in the battery and does not adjust for driving conditions.

The rated miles number will fluctuate somewhat at a given state of charge because measuring battery charge is difficult and is subject to fluctuations in the variables (it's complicated). The number should gradually decrease over time as the battery degrades, because the battery will hold less charge, but it will also fluctuate with temperature, charging regimen and when the measurement is made (driving, charging, or just parked).

Some other EVs try to give a range estimate that adjusts for driving conditions. Tesla's rated miles number is not like that. However, Tesla does have an adjustable energy gauge when using navigation. It will tell you the estimated %SOC left at your destination and it will update this number in real time as you drive. This is a very helpful tool for road trips. The Model 3 owner's manual describes it like this:
FWIW.

Thanks! I chaned my display to show %.

 

[caldersj]

I’m 3 months into my first EV ownership, with a 2-year-old Model S 90D. Initially I had the battery display set to miles, and found myself getting stressed because it always dropped by more than the distance travelled - even more so as the temperature dropped with the approach of winter. Now I’ve changed it to %charge, and am much more relaxed. Here’s what led me to that decision.

Initially, I naively assumed that the ‘miles’ reading on the battery indicator was the answer to the question ‘how far can I drive before I completely run out of charge?’. Then I thought about it, googled a bit, and realised that only God knows the answer to this question, and even he would likely need some time to calculate the answer, because it depends on so many variables that can only be estimated at best: my driving style; terrain; traffic; altitude; temperature; age and condition of battery; payload; accuracy of charge measurement; level of initial charge (as discharge rate will be non-linear).

And of course I won’t drain the battery completely. I’ll be looking to recharge before it drops below 20% or so.

My previous ICE car was a BMW. It had a computer that could display what purported to be a ‘miles before the fuel runs out’ figure. I paid no attention to it. I simply waited until the guage showed around 25%, then filled up.

So I’m taking the same approach by switching to %charge remaining.

Things aren’t quite a simple as with the BMW, because charging stations are currently much rarer than fuel stations - a situation that will reverse over the next few years. I also have my own private ‘refuelling’ station at home, something no ICE driver can claim, though as I have lifetime free supercharging and a supercharger 3 miles from home, I tend to use that. The ‘cost’ is now measured in time spent at the supercharger, which I try to use productively.

In summary, I have no need for an inaccurate and overoptimistic miles number that, being to the nearest mile, gives a false impression of precision. I’ve switched to an approximate ‘tank level’ number, which is all I ever needed before, and the stress has evaporated.