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Waymo brings in $2.25 billion from outside investors, Alphabet

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cwerdna

Well-Known Member
Jul 11, 2012
5,123
4,239
SF Bay Area, CA
I found out about it elsewhere and found someone had already posted it in the very long TSLA investor thread which I don't read anyway, I figure it make sense in this forum too.
Waymo brings in $2.25 billion from outside investors, Alphabet – TechCrunch
Waypoint - The official Waymo blog: Waymo raises first external investment round

I wonder if each of the players (e.g. Waymo, Cruise, Baidu, Apple, Plus AI, Nuro, etc.) in the autonomous space should each get their own thread w/a new one created when we see news from them?
 
Sounds like they are going to make a big push. Whether that will be expanding the taxi service or deploying some of the technology into other manufacturer's vehicles I don't know, maybe both.
 
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Sounds like they are going to make a big push.
on the 13 years of working on Autonomous Vehicles, Wyamo is going to make a big push to get... oh, sh!t they still have not stated an end date of when to expect it.
... wake me up in 2032.

p.s. it would be awesome if they did make a push, it would be a huge help to get this problem solved if there are competing and passionate teams striving to outdo each other.
If Elon was on Waymo timeline, you all would have so much to gripe about this forum would not be able to handle the load.
 
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I wonder what the valuation was.
on the 13 years of working on Autonomous Vehicles, Wyamo is going to make a big push to get... oh, sh!t they still have not stated an end date of when to expect it.
... wake me up in 2032.

p.s. it would be awesome if they did make a push, it would be a huge help to get this problem solved if there are competing and passionate teams striving to outdo each other.
If Elon was on Waymo timeline, you all would have so much to gripe about this forum would not be able to handle the load.
A decade ago Waymo was way ahead of where Tesla is today. It’s possible that it’s harder to build an AV than you think.
 
on the 13 years of working on Autonomous Vehicles, Wyamo is going to make a big push to get... oh, sh!t they still have not stated an end date of when to expect it.
... wake me up in 2032.

p.s. it would be awesome if they did make a push, it would be a huge help to get this problem solved if there are competing and passionate teams striving to outdo each other.
If Elon was on Waymo timeline, you all would have so much to gripe about this forum would not be able to handle the load.

Waymo has really good L4 autonomous driving. They did 1.4 million autonomous miles in CA alone last year with an excellent disengagement rate of only 0.076 disengagements per 1,000 miles (or 13,219 miles in between disengagements). But "really good" is not good enough. Doing safe autonomous driving is a lot harder than people think. There are a lot of edge cases. Waymo is simply being deliberate in their approach to make absolutely sure that their cars are 100% ready before they deploy.
 
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Waymo has really good L4 autonomous driving.
Waymo is a party trick that you cannot bring to a party. (At least you can take Smart Summon to any party you want /sarcasm )
You literally have to go to a designated city/route. That is not a solution.

I am all for Waymo (or anyone surpassing Tesla) but from my observation of Waymo it is run as a PhD project with dissertations being written on some edge case or another.
The problem with PhD programs is they end up looking for more cool stuff to dive into and research.
 
Waymo is a party trick that you cannot bring to a party. (At least you can take Smart Summon to any party you want /sarcasm )
You literally have to go to a designated city/route. That is not a solution.

I am all for Waymo (or anyone surpassing Tesla) but from my observation of Waymo it is run as a PhD project with dissertations being written on some edge case or another.
The problem with PhD programs is they end up looking for more cool stuff to dive into and research.

You are misinformed. Waymo cars are not limited to only following a designated route. They are true autonomous cars that can operate anywhere. They are only geofenced right now for testing purposes. Yes, it absolutely is a valid solution. Waymo has built autonomous cars with the hardware and software to drive themselves anywhere but they temporarily limit them to an area first to make sure they are safe before expanding the area. That is far better than just releasing an autonomous car loose on every road before you know if it will be safe or not.

From Waymo's own report, here are some of the things that Waymo cars can do without a driver:

1. Detect and Respond to Speed Limit Changes and Speed Advisories
2. Perform High-Speed Merge (e.g., Freeway)
3 Perform Low-Speed Merge
4 Move Out of the Travel Lane and Park (e.g., to the Shoulder for Minimal Risk)
5 Detect and Respond to Encroaching Oncoming Vehicles
6 Detect Passing and No Passing Zones and Perform Passing Maneuvers
7 Perform Car Following (Including Stop and Go)
8 Detect and Respond to Stopped Vehicles
9 Detect and Respond to Lane Changes
10 Detect and Respond to Static Obstacles in the Path of the Vehicle
11 Detect Traffic Signals and Stop/Yield Signs
12 Respond to Traffic Signals and Stop/Yield Signs
13 Navigate Intersections and Perform Turns
14 Navigate Roundabouts
15 Navigate a Parking Lot and Locate Spaces
16 Detect and Respond to Access Restrictions (One-Way, No Turn, Ramps, etc.)
17 Detect and Respond to Work Zones and People Directing Traffic in Unplanned or Planned Events
18 Make Appropriate Right-of-Way Decisions
19 Follow Local and State Driving Laws
20 Follow Police/First Responder Controlling Traffic (Overriding or Acting as Traffic Control Device)
21 Follow Construction Zone Workers Controlling Traffic Patterns (Slow/Stop Sign Holders)
22 Respond to Citizens Directing Traffic After a Crash
23 Detect and Respond to Temporary Traffic Control Devices
24 Detect and Respond to Emergency Vehicles
25 Yield for Law Enforcement, EMT, Fire, and Other Emergency Vehicles at Intersections, Junctions, and Other Traffic Controlled Situations
26 Yield to Pedestrians and Bicyclists at Intersections and Crosswalks
27 Provide Safe Distance From Vehicles, Pedestrians, Bicyclists on Side of the Road
28 Detect/Respond to Detours and/or Other Temporary Changes in Traffic Patterns
29 Moving to a Minimum Risk Condition When Exiting the Travel Lane is Not Possible
30 Perform Lane Changes
31 Detect and Respond to Lead Vehicle
32 Detect and Respond to a Merging Vehicle
33 Detect and Respond to Pedestrians in Road (Not Walking Through Intersection or Crosswalk)
34 Provide Safe Distance from Bicyclists Traveling on Road (With or Without Bike Lane)
35 Detect and Respond to Animals
36 Detect and Respond to Motorcyclists
37 Detect and Respond to School Buses
38 Navigate Around Unexpected Road Closures (e.g. Lane, Intersection, etc.)
39 Navigate Railroad Crossings
40 Make Appropriate Reversing Maneuvers
41 Detect and Respond to Vehicle Control Loss (e.g. reduced road friction)
42 Detect and Respond to Conditions Involving Vehicle, System, or Component-Level Failures or Faults (e.g. power failure, sensing failure, sensing obstruction, computing failure, fault handling or response)
43 Detect and Respond to Unanticipated Weather or Lighting Conditions Outside of Vehicle’s Capability (e.g. rainstorm)
44 Detect and Respond to Unanticipated Lighting Conditions (e.g. power outages)
45 Detect and Respond to Non-Collision Safety Situations (e.g. vehicle doors ajar)
46 Detect and Respond to Faded or Missing Roadway Markings or Signage
47 Detect and Respond to Vehicles Parking in the Roadway

Waymo also did 1.4 million real autonomous miles in CA alone. Tesla only did 12 miles. That's not a mere PhD project or party trick.

Fact is that Waymo is way ahead of Tesla because Waymo has autonomous cars that actually can self-drive on their own and Tesla does not. And Waymo has millions of autonomous miles while Tesla only reported 12. Tesla has no FSD. They are still working in perception and image and video labelling which Waymo did years ago.
 
Alright, you've convinced me, I would love to try them out, point me to a Waymo car in Charlotte area that I can hop into?
...
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I'll wait.

If Charlotte is too much of an ask, I will take anything on the East Coast!
 
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Alright, you got me I would love to try them out, point me to a Waymo car in Charlotte area that I can hop into?
...
..
.
I'll wait.

Ah, the classic "where I can ride one?" argument. The fact that you can't ride one yet does not take away from their tech. At least, Waymo has FSD. They just need to deploy them to more areas. As soon as the cars are safe enough, Waymo will either deploy them to the Charlotte area or Waymo will sell their autonomous tech to an automaker and you will be able to buy one.

When will my Tesla be FSD?
..
...
...
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I'll wait.
 
You're the one with the lists of all the FSD things Waymo can do RIGHT NOW! Except 99.999% of the population can't experience it, we just have to read about it on the news or your silly lists of all its accomplishments.

I am waiting on Tesla FSD myself.
But with the Tesla approach I will have something I can use when I want, not something that will be locked down to a select list of cities/routes for the foreseeable future.
 
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I am waiting on Tesla FSD myself.
But with the Tesla approach I will have something I can use when I want, not something that will be locked down to a select list of cities/routes for the foreseeable future.

Yes, if Tesla can deliver some FSD features, we will be able to enjoy them on our cars. In fact, I am counting on that. But what if Tesla can't do L5 FSD? So far, Tesla has not done any FSD. If Tesla can't do L5 FSD, then we will be waiting forever for that fully autonomous robotaxi.

My question to you: what are you expecting from Tesla? Are you expecting single FSD features or are you expecting a fully driverless robotaxi? If you are just expecting FSD features, yes, you will get that at some point and you will be able to use it whenever you want. If you are expecting a fully driverless robotaxi, there is no guarantee if Tesla will ever get there.
 
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You're the one with the lists of all the FSD things Waymo can do RIGHT NOW! Except 99.999% of the population can't experience it, we just have to read about it on the news or your silly lists of all its accomplishments.

I am waiting on Tesla FSD myself.
But with the Tesla approach I will have something I can use when I want, not something that will be locked down to a select list of cities/routes for the foreseeable future.
I can "experience" FSD right now by calling myself an Uber. I think you're missing the point of autonomous vehicles.
 
I can "experience" FSD right now by calling myself an Uber. I think you're missing the point of autonomous vehicles.
LOL, well with your definition of Uber == FSD I don't know how one would define autonomous vehicles for you.
I am not here for a centrally planned (commie style) robotaxi, "yes, we provide it, but we will tell you when and where you can use it"
I want to hop in my car and tell it where to go and it does it.
I will gladly take the car telling me "Can't perform task because camera A or radar is blocked, clean the camera/bumper so we can proceed" or "service required radar not detected".

But what if
That's the whole point of placing your bets so to speak, I've purchased cars from Tesla with FSD in mind, and so my literal money is on the Tesla approach.

My bet (like Tesla's approach) is :
Camera Vision and Radar is all that is needed.

Now, will they make changes to address snow/ice buildup, or heavy rain visibility, heck yeah.
Even Waymo is on their 5th generation of Lidar based design Waypoint - The official Waymo blog: Introducing the 5th-generation Waymo Driver: Informed by experience, designed for scale, engineered to tackle more environments << that's fresh off the press FYI.


If Tesla starts backtracking, then I will start worrying about my placed bets.
So far, we're just dealing with "Elon Time" delays.
 
My bet (like Tesla's approach) is :
Camera Vision and Radar is all that is needed.

I get that. Obviously, based on everything I know and see from the leaders in FSD, I don't think that Tesla's approach will do L5 autonomy. I only expect some "FSD" features. You are betting that it will. We will see.
 
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Why cannot Tesla learn
Tesla learns, in fact every Tesla car on the road helps Tesla Inc learn.

and build on Waymo's technology?
Because Waymo's approach is not scalable (they are on the 5th generation of their hardware and every time they claim it is more scalable)
It is also way too expensive still.
But to quote Elon "Lidar is a fool’s errand... Anyone relying on lidar is doomed. Doomed! [They are] expensive sensors that are unnecessary. It’s like having a whole bunch of expensive appendices. Like, one appendix is bad, well now you have a whole bunch of them, it’s ridiculous, you’ll see."
 
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Why cannot Tesla learn and build on Waymo's technology?

Tesla is not using the same hardware at all. For example, Tesla is not using lidar. Tesla's approach and Waymo's approach are not compatible.

Do you think L4 autonomy is achievable with the current Tesla approach?

You bought FSD, what did you think you were getting?

I expect to get more advanced driver assist features. Eventually, I think Tesla will add enough features and capabilities that the car will be able to drive itself but with driver supervision.

L4 and L5 are the same in terms of autonomous driving, just with different ODDs. It would really depend on what ODD you are talking about. L4 highway, in good weather, might be achievable maybe. L4 city is not achievable on the current hardware IMO.

Tesla is aiming for L5 ODD, so L4 is not really part of Tesla's approach.