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220V Charging at the Cottage

Discussion in 'Canada' started by RainmakerJL, Nov 23, 2015.

  1. RainmakerJL

    RainmakerJL Member

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    I believe Doug & Knox had posted about this a few years back but was wondering if anyone could give me some updated advice. I live in New York and have a cottage in the Peterborough Area. Thinking of taking the P85 up for Thanksgiving this week (first time) and worried about charging when we arrive. I have a 220V outlet in the back of my garage that will not fit my car into. So wondering if there is a safe option for an extension cable of some kind. I will of course monitor the first few charges to make sure there are no issues with the outlet and/or the cable. Is this something that is doable? Any advice?
     
  2. iKhalid

    iKhalid Member

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    What kind of 220v are you talking about? 14-50?
     
  3. mknox

    mknox Well-Known Member

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    I purchased a 50' NEMA 14-50 extension cord. It is a brute! Quite heavy. What I've done at the cottage is pull out the stove, plug in to the 14-50 outlet behind the stove and run the cord out the kitchen window. You have to remember that most stoves are wired to a 40 amp breaker, so you have to dial the car down to 32 amps (80% rule) when you do this.
     
  4. RainmakerJL

    RainmakerJL Member

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    14-50. I remember seeing pictures of your setup Mknox or at least i remember you responding on a thread about this. Any issues with your setup? I take it you have done this for a few winters without issue? fortunately i don't need to move my stove. The old garage was once used for housing before they built the main house so there is a stove plug setup already there that was re connected to a new subpanel a few years ago. i think i'm all set except for the 20ft or so from the outlet to where my car will be parked... This is all pending whether the wife is willing to go along with this. The plan is to put a new 14-50 up closer to the front of the garage so i wont need an extension cord.
     
  5. mknox

    mknox Well-Known Member

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    Yes, I posted a picture a while back of my car with the cord running through the window! No issues as long as you confirm the capacity of the circuit and adjust your car's charging rate accordingly. NEMA 14-50's are often found on 40 amp circuits when used for electric stoves. It is very common for RVs to use extension cords like these. You can find cords of various lengths on Amazon (here's an example), and I'd suggest if you don't need 50' (like I got) then get something shorter. They are quite heavy.

    I haven't needed to do this for a while. With the Barrie Supercharger between Toronto and Muskoka all I need, if anything, can be accomplished with a 120 volt connection... and I can just plug in to the receptacle on the outside wall of the building!
     
  6. DMC-Orangeville

    DMC-Orangeville 85D and John Deere 5100E

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    When they (finally) open the Port Hope SC, you should have enough charge to and from the cottage. I'm in Haliburton, north of you, with no SC option. I use a NEMA 14-30 (I got the last adapter available from the Mississauga service centre) and my dryer. My UMC passes through the window in the utility room....until I install a NEMA14-50 next spring.
     
  7. mknox

    mknox Well-Known Member

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    When I ditched my old electric dryer, I kept the cord from it. I installed a 14-50 socket on the other end. With this little 14-30 to 14-50 adapter cord, I can plug in to a dryer outlet, then use my monster 14-50 extension cord if I have to. (I did label the adapter cord "For Tesla Charging Only" and "Set car to 24 Amps Max" just in case it falls into someone else's hands).
     
  8. Bitjockey

    Bitjockey Member

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    Exactly what I've done at my cottage (14-30 dryer outlet in a box outside my garage wall, 14-30 to 14-50 adapter I spliced together). I too have the monster 14-50 cable, bought on Amazon.com and shipped to my relatives in Michigan who delivered it while visiting.

    I also made a 220V-12A charging setup so I could charge from someone's kitchen duplex outlet in an emergency, as well as a 30A generator adapter.
     
  9. mknox

    mknox Well-Known Member

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    Me too. The shipping to Canada was going to cost more than the cable itself (presumably because of the weight) but they had free shipping anywhere in the US. I had it sent to my daughter's place in Illinois and picked it up while I was there.

    - - - Updated - - -

    I have been considering getting one of those Honda inverter generators for some time now. As with most generators, they have a floating neutral which the Tesla UMC does not like. Did you bond the generator's ground and neutral together so that it would work?
     
  10. tomas

    tomas Traded in 9 rep bars for M3, used to be somebody!

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    I got the same 30' camco that Mknox linked above. Has worked at my cottage perfectly for 3 years - except when I dropped end on pavers in -10f weather and the plug fixture cracked. Fortunately, camco sells replacement plugs, so I removed the old one, wired up the new one, and have over 1 year duty on that. One piece of advice: measure the length you need. Get enough, but don't get substantially longer. IE, don't get 50' if 30' will do. It's just more cable to power, more weight, more cost.

    I also found that cost was only about $350 to put a covered NEMA 14-50 outlet on the outside of my cottage... so if all you have is inside outlet and there are enough slots on your panel (2), then it is well worth it in convenience to wire an outside outlet - vs. having to run cable out windows or doors.
     
  11. wayner

    wayner Active Member

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    So you can charge your Tesla with gasoline/diesel? :confused:
     
  12. Peter_M

    Peter_M Member

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    If it's only this one location that you're worried about, moving the 14-50 outlet at your cottage to be within reach of the car would be much cheaper and more convenient than buying an extension cord. Some 8/3 wire and some staples are probably all you need - maybe some conduit. I got a 14-30 extension made up by stayonline.com and it works great and is safe, but it was pretty expensive. (I got 14-30 instead of 14-50 because I got it as a backup for arbitrary locations, and it's usually easier to plug into a dryer outlet near the door than to move a kitchen stove.)
     
  13. tomas

    tomas Traded in 9 rep bars for M3, used to be somebody!

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    Not what I found. My 30' extension was $120, and I have amazon prime so shipping was free. The cost to properly wire outlet 30' further from current location would have been $500 or so to run outdoor conduit, or thousands to run indoor conduit behind existing walls. I know there are some people on this site who would advocate DIY wiring for less $, but who wants to take that risk when extension cable is $120?
     
  14. Peter_M

    Peter_M Member

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    Yes, I was assuming the OP was comfortable doing the wiring himself. Just offering an option that could be cheaper, depending on the circumstances.

    The other point is that an extension cord has to get outside somehow, and if that's through a door or window from a heated area in the winter, you need to fuss with foam or something to keep the cold out.
     
  15. mknox

    mknox Well-Known Member

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    Naw... for home backup, but in an extended outage, it would be useful if I had to top the car up. I think someone did the math on charging an EV with a generator and it yielded pretty poor MPG numbers.
     
  16. DMC-Orangeville

    DMC-Orangeville 85D and John Deere 5100E

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    It depends how "legal" you want to be.....
    Yes to the 8/3 cable - NMWU or AC 90. You will also need a weatherproof NEMA 14-50 (Example attached-approx $50).

    To meet Canadian Electric code - you need to meet to apply CEC 86-304, and 86-306, which means:
    Also a 50 amp GFI breaker, a 50 amp disconnect (I suggest a 50 amp spa panel for both - approx $100) and a 50 amp breaker for your panel (Approx $30).

    OR - 50 AMP GFCI breaker in panel (approx $90) plus 60 amp disconnect ($75)
    Plus - you should get it inspected if you want to be really safe (insurance reasons etc) $200

    You could do it on the cheap - and risk an unsafe installation - by buying a NEMA 14-50 Receptacle, and put it in a 2 gang RAB box, and a weatherproof cover, and nothing else - but I wouldn't recommend it.
     

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  17. wayner

    wayner Active Member

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    Did you have your car during the Dec 2013 ice storm? We didn't have the power out for too long but many folks were out for multiple days so that might have caused problems. I guess you could always go to the Lawrence SC, assuming that they had power.
     
  18. mknox

    mknox Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, I had my Model S during the ice storm, but being in an underground supply area, I only had a couple of outages lasting just minutes. (Main cause of outages was tree branches bringing down overhead lines). I live in the west GTA, so Lawrence wouldn't really be an option.

    I have only personally suffered one very long, extended outage back in the '80s when a transmission line in Mississauga serving a wide area west of Toronto failed. It was quite cold and I borrowed a friend's generator to power my furnace electronics for a bit so I could warm the house up (gas fired furnace, but still needs electricity). I was living out of town at the time, but my family did suffer through the 2003 Blackout. At least it was summer, so the only issue was some loss of food in the fridge and freezer.

    Every now and again I toy with the idea of getting a generator, and I really like the Honda EU7000is. I like the fact that it's fuel injected which supposedly can minimize fuel storage issues (gummed up carburetors and such). A GenerLink connector would be an ideal connection point, but not all utilities will allow them. One of those automatic Generac natural gas systems would be sweet, but I can hardly demonstrate the need for a even a portable unit...
     
  19. wayner

    wayner Active Member

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    The NatGas ones seem like the way to go but they are expensive. It would also be nice if I could switch my 10kW microFIT solar panels over to supplying my house in the case of the grid being down but apparently that isn't allowed. That seems silly to me - you should be able to use something like the GenerLink attached to your solar inverter.
     
  20. mknox

    mknox Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, I could hardly justify the cost of the Generac based on the number of outages I'm likely to see, but my buddy is considering it for his cottage in Muskoka (he has propane on-site).

    I think if I was you, a good option would be to add something like a PowerWall to your system. Leave the microFIT installation alone and use the battery for peak-shifting on your load account, then have the battery available for emergency use if need be. Still probably not economic based on the reasonably good utility reliability we have here.
     

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