85D expected range? Other CPO checklist items

[drummerboy7816]

Congrats on the purchase! Make sure you got 2 key fobs, the mobile charger and the J1772 adapter. Additionally, I would check underneath the carpet in the frunk to make sure the tow bar is there. It’s one of those things you hope to never have to use but if you do, you don’t want to find out it’s missing when you really need it. Mine was missing all of the items I mentioned above (well, I got 1 key fob but everything else was missing).

Thanks! I do have all that except the tow bar :/ No compartment under the frunk. I wonder if they'll just give me one..

 

[shred86]

Thanks! I do have all that except the tow bar :/ No compartment under the frunk. I wonder if they'll just give me one..

I just realized mine was missing about two weeks ago. I contacted the delivery agent and she told me to talk to the local service center and they should be able to get me one no problem. I scheduled an appointment to get some service done and included the missing tow bar in the comments. I’m assuming this is an item that should come with the vehicle, like a charger or second key fob, so I can’t imagine they would charge for it. Honestly not sure why it’s missing to begin with. What else are people using tow bars for??

 

[drummerboy7816]

Nice, I’m getting my service for some items I’ve noticed in the first few days (squeaking roof, wind noise driver window, and the rim rash they agreed to fix), I’ll add this to the list !

 

[Ostrichsak]

Personally, I just keep the display set to battery % and base everything on that.

I still don't understand how people "base everything off of that" when it displays percentage. Percentage is a measurement of the amount remaining to max capacity that has no connection to miles by itself. Miles is the measurement we use to determine the distance between two points. It isn't until you add the algorithm that Tesla has created to link these figures that you get something relatively accurate enough to draw conclusions from within perceived amounts of individual risk aversion.

If the miles displayed are off at least you're still comparing apples to apples and know that you may need to overshoot your estimate to make up for x amount of miles whereas at least you know what x equals most of time time because it's a comparison of miles to miles. I may be comfortable with the estimated range saying I've got 158 miles left and need to drive 150 miles whereas you may decide you would rather charge another 15-20 miles worth to feel safe covering that same trip. If your display just shows 72% how do you make the leap in your mind to the distance you need to travel with any amount of certainty?

When you have it set to percentage it's comparing apples to aardvarks. In math you can compare numbers that at least have some aspects in common to find the missing components. When you compare battery percentage to distance... how do you arrive at a mathematical conclusion based on that? The amount of battery remaining has no distance component so how do you gain anything useful from that when you say to yourself "I need to drive to XYZ city that is 216 miles away, will I make it on the amount of charge I have remaining?" based on a percentage of the battery remaining.

tldr; when a clock is 5 min off you can plan for that at various times of the day based on how important the time at that time is. When you measure the time with a stopwatch... how can you possibly get even close when the time is important?

 

[Pismo]

They fixed most of it and gave me credit for 2 free rim repairs there, so I pulled the trigger!!

Right now it's sitting at 90% charge with rated range of 239mi, so per my math that's 265 miles on full charge so that's like 1.9% battery degregation? not bad for 35k miles I guess.

When they said normal wear and tear - what did you say? or did you hold your ground and threaten to walk away?

 

[drummerboy7816]

When they said normal wear and tear - what did you say? or did you hold your ground and threaten to walk away?

No I didn’t threaten to walk away, the only one that truly bothered my was the last picture with the driver door trim damage where I indicated that it was unacceptable. That they didn’t say it was normal wear and tear but they indicated they would not be able to fix that here, I ask if there were any other locations they would have it fix and they said no. I then looked closer and try to rub some off and it did a little so I felt that it wasn’t a scratch and it was some type of calcium deposit type deal where it could be scrubbed off. Worst case I have to spend money to have it replaced, and with the $500 I saved not having to switch the 3g to LTE I figured that would be enough to cover it. I got home, took a magic eraser, scrubbed for 5 minutes and it came right off haha, looks great/normal now. I think they didn’t try to get it off because they obviously didn’t want to risk damning it.

 

[drummerboy7816]

The other wear and tear item they didn’t fix was the scratches on the inside lift gate door. That didn’t bother as much since I will be constantly transporting my drum set and hardware with this car and I know that inside lift gate will be scratched anyways over my use as evidenced by the inside of my now ex-GTI

 

[aerodyne]

Sounds like you got a good car!

Various products, like Mother's brand VLR, will make scratches on dark vinyl become much less visible.

Don't know if you have room, but if you can fit large items like the drum set in cardboard box, will minimize interior trim damage...

 

[aerodyne]

I still don't understand how people "base everything off of that" when it displays percentage. Percentage is a measurement of the amount remaining to max capacity that has no connection to miles by itself. Miles is the measurement we use to determine the distance between two points. It isn't until you add the algorithm that Tesla has created to link these figures that you get something relatively accurate enough to draw conclusions from within perceived amounts of individual risk aversion.

If the miles displayed are off at least you're still comparing apples to apples and know that you may need to overshoot your estimate to make up for x amount of miles whereas at least you know what x equals most of time time because it's a comparison of miles to miles. I may be comfortable with the estimated range saying I've got 158 miles left and need to drive 150 miles whereas you may decide you would rather charge another 15-20 miles worth to feel safe covering that same trip. If your display just shows 72% how do you make the leap in your mind to the distance you need to travel with any amount of certainty?

When you have it set to percentage it's comparing apples to aardvarks. In math you can compare numbers that at least have some aspects in common to find the missing components. When you compare battery percentage to distance... how do you arrive at a mathematical conclusion based on that? The amount of battery remaining has no distance component so how do you gain anything useful from that when you say to yourself "I need to drive to XYZ city that is 216 miles away, will I make it on the amount of charge I have remaining?" based on a percentage of the battery remaining.

tldr; when a clock is 5 min off you can plan for that at various times of the day based on how important the time at that time is. When you measure the time with a stopwatch... how can you possibly get even close when the time is important?

Your points are well taken. Also, the trip planner takes into account elevation changes, traffic and temps. I guess the one advantage of percent over range is psychology, if you have range anxiety and do not see a range number, then you won't worry so much about it perhaps...

 

[shred86]

I still don't understand how people "base everything off of that" when it displays percentage. Percentage is a measurement of the amount remaining to max capacity that has no connection to miles by itself. Miles is the measurement we use to determine the distance between two points. It isn't until you add the algorithm that Tesla has created to link these figures that you get something relatively accurate enough to draw conclusions from within perceived amounts of individual risk aversion.

If the miles displayed are off at least you're still comparing apples to apples and know that you may need to overshoot your estimate to make up for x amount of miles whereas at least you know what x equals most of time time because it's a comparison of miles to miles. I may be comfortable with the estimated range saying I've got 158 miles left and need to drive 150 miles whereas you may decide you would rather charge another 15-20 miles worth to feel safe covering that same trip. If your display just shows 72% how do you make the leap in your mind to the distance you need to travel with any amount of certainty?

When you have it set to percentage it's comparing apples to aardvarks. In math you can compare numbers that at least have some aspects in common to find the missing components. When you compare battery percentage to distance... how do you arrive at a mathematical conclusion based on that? The amount of battery remaining has no distance component so how do you gain anything useful from that when you say to yourself "I need to drive to XYZ city that is 216 miles away, will I make it on the amount of charge I have remaining?" based on a percentage of the battery remaining.

tldr; when a clock is 5 min off you can plan for that at various times of the day based on how important the time at that time is. When you measure the time with a stopwatch... how can you possibly get even close when the time is important?

Valid points, but I guess it just doesn’t really matter for me. If I needed to know a specific amount of miles I need to have as a “pad”, then it would matter, such as if I need to know if I can’t charge at point A, then I’ll need a certain amount of miles remaining to make it to another charging station. However, I just don’t think or plan long trips that way. I simply want to know I’ll have some level of extra battery capacity remaining arriving at a charging station to account for unexpected delays, winds, weather, terrain, etc. You’re right, it doesn’t translate to a specific amount of miles but that’s not my intent nor would it really help since I don’t know how much additional rated range I would need to account for changing variables. This all obviously assumes you’re using the navigation or a route planner to estimate the charge you’ll arrive with.

 

[Ostrichsak]

Valid points, but I guess it just doesn’t really matter for me. If I needed to know a specific amount of miles I need to have as a “pad”, then it would matter, such as if I need to know if I can’t charge at point A, then I’ll need a certain amount of miles remaining to make it to another charging station. However, I just don’t think or plan long trips that way. I simply want to know I’ll have some level of extra battery capacity remaining arriving at a charging station to account for unexpected delays, winds, weather, terrain, etc. You’re right, it doesn’t translate to a specific amount of miles but that’s not my intent nor would it really help since I don’t know how much additional rated range I would need to account for changing variables. This all obviously assumes you’re using the navigation or a route planner to estimate the charge you’ll arrive with.

I'm not trying to say that the distance measurement is flawless as we all know that's not the case. I'm just saying that, when given two choices where one has no relevant useful data and the other has even a small amount of relevant useful data I'd go with the later over the former.

I wasn't trying to start an argument or anything with my reply. I was more just trying to understand why some would even bother using the % versus distance readout let alone feel strong enough about it to take the time to recommend it on a public forum. I wasn't sure if there was something i was missing as, to me anyway, it seems a simple choice even though both are next to useless... one is just slightly less useless.

 

[BrunoS]

I have a 2015 S85D whose advertised EPA range was 430 km (I say “was” because the car is no longer for sale). I charged it to 100% for the first time in 4 years of ownership (I usually charge to 80% for day to day usage), and got 412 km showing. If 430 km is to be believed, then this is a 4.5% drop in indicated capacity. Not bad. The next question is if 412 km is in fact real.

I don’t know how the Model S with up-to-date software determines the indicated range. I do know that most other devices with lithium ion batteries determine the capacity from the indicated voltage per cell under load and an assumed capacity versus voltage curve. This curve has a horizontal S-shape with the left lower tail at 3V indicating a completely discharged cell and the right upper tail at 4.2V indicating a completely charged cell. The almost flat section in the middle that occupies most of the curve is a nominal 3.6V. If the cell capacity is reduced due to cold temperature or abuse, then the S-curve compresses but still has the same lower and upper voltages. If the Model S does this, then the real capacity may be lower than the indicated capacity. I know that the software attempts to calibrate the battery capacity versus the voltage or other indicator of charge state, but may have had insufficient data from the short daily commutes that I do.

My wife and I did a road trip having a 257 km round trip according to the trip log, and finished with 135 km indicated range. Add 257 to 135 to get 392 km, 20 km lower than the indicated range after a 100% charge. I began to feel disappointment setting in until I remembered that the air conditioner had been running for the 3.5 hours we were driving. The a/c consumes between 700 and 1000 watts. Being generous, I assumed 1000 watts and hence an energy consumption of 3.5 kw-h for the trip, which at the 180 watt-hours per kilometer shown on the trip log translates to 19.4 km of equivalent range. This accounts for the missing 20 km of range and therefore shows that the indicated range is real.

I am a happy guy ... for now.

 

[aerodyne]

Earlier 2015 build cars have no recess in the Frunk for the tow bar. Mine was in the mobile connector case.

Minor correction. The tow bar was in a purpose built pocket in the mobile connector case, but there is a recess for it under the Frunk carpet as well...