ChargePoint level 2 home charger mobile app setting modification

[Murray C.]

Copied below is my recently message sent to ChargePoint customer support.

"Installed ChargePoint level two home charger in my garage four years ago to charge my first EV, a BMWi3. Now driving a Tesla Model 3 - charging function works well; however, Tesla has a setting to limit max charge (I set my M3 at 80%). As per Tesla's recommendation, charger remains plugged in 24/7. Distance and cost of charge register correctly on the mobile app, but elapsed time since plugging in continues until I unplug and thus does not indicate the actual length of time it took for each charge. Can this be remedied?"

Has anyone else encountered this?

When/if I receive a response from them, I will post it to this thread.

Thanks
Murray C.

 

[jjrandorin]

I have the tesla HPWC, not a charge point, but I believe a lot of the third party wall connectors leave a trickle type charge going. I remember a lot of issues in 2019 with third party wall connectors and their app functions of scheduled charging. Basically, some of them would not start the charge when scheduled, if I remember correctly.

I believe that it was determined that the issue stemmed from some of the third party wall connectors not being able to wake the model 3 up to accept a charge. Remember, on the OEM tesla wall connector, there is no scheduled charging, this is set by using scheduled charging in the car.

On many "smart" wall connectors, they have apps with functions of scheduled charging, etc.

Anyway, the work around I remember being talked about here was many of these third party wall connectors leaving a very small, low, charge rate active to keep the car awake (and available to start charging). The result of this would be both more power used (car staying awake) , and also what you are seeing regarding the reporting.

 

[RTPEV]

The EVSE itself does not keep a "trickle charge" going. The EVSE is just a relatively smart switch and the car controls whether it's pulling power or not.

Your Tesla will sometimes pull a small amount of power from the EVSE to power the cooling system or whatever else. It will do this whether it's a Tesla HPWC or a vanilla J1772 EVSE.

To the OP, my question to you is what kind of data are you trying to get out of the Chargepoint unit itself and why is it important to you?

If you are a data junkie, may I suggest using a service like TeslaFi which will give you all kinds of great data. You could also get the charge duration from the Tesla app if you have Start Charge and Stop Charge notifications set, although this would take some math on your part.

By the way, I know Tesla apparently "recommends" leaving the car plugged in 24/7. I think this is more of a recommendation for beginner EV drivers. I don't think it's actually important to keep the car plugged in all the time unless you are the forgetful type or you are planning on leaving the car parked for weeks on end. While it doesn't make a huge difference, leaving it plugged in and at 80% SOC all the time means the average SOC is going to be on the high side. Ideally you want the average SOC to be more towards 50%. If you do want to plug in 24/7 you should charge to 50% + 1/2 your daily anticipated use. That way it will average out to 50%. But personally I just charge to 80% and then plug in 4-5 days later when it's down to 30%. During pandemic times I adjust that to 60% and 40%.

 

[jjrandorin]

The EVSE itself does not keep a "trickle charge" going. The EVSE is just a relatively smart switch and the car controls whether it's pulling power or not.

Your Tesla will sometimes pull a small amount of power from the EVSE to power the cooling system or whatever else. It will do this whether it's a Tesla HPWC or a vanilla J1772 EVSE.

To the OP, my question to you is what kind of data are you trying to get out of the Chargepoint unit itself and why is it important to you?

If you are a data junkie, may I suggest using a service like TeslaFi which will give you all kinds of great data. You could also get the charge duration from the Tesla app if you have Start Charge and Stop Charge notifications set, although this would take some math on your part.

By the way, I know Tesla apparently "recommends" leaving the car plugged in 24/7. I think this is more of a recommendation for beginner EV drivers. I don't think it's actually important to keep the car plugged in all the time unless you are the forgetful type or you are planning on leaving the car parked for weeks on end. While it doesn't make a huge difference, leaving it plugged in and at 80% SOC all the time means the average SOC is going to be on the high side. Ideally you want the average SOC to be more towards 50%. If you do want to plug in 24/7 you should charge to 50% + 1/2 your daily anticipated use. That way it will average out to 50%. But personally I just charge to 80% and then plug in 4-5 days later when it's down to 30%. During pandemic times I adjust that to 60% and 40%.

I was referring to this thread:

eMotorwerks JuiceBox Smart Charging and Model 3 Incompatibility Update

For Model 3 owners having trouble using the eMotorwerks JuiceBox Smart Charging feature, I received this email from eMotorWerks today:

“Thank you for your participation in eMotorWerks Rewards program.

We appreciate you identifying your Tesla Model 3 in your JuiceNet mobile app. As a result, as of Tuesday August 21st, we have implemented special handling of your smart charging events to accommodate Model 3s. You will notice that your car may reduce its charging rate during the night, but not shut off entirely, before returning to a higher charging rate.

This is due to Model 3s not currently following the J1772 charging port standard. Similarly, we strongly recommend use of your Tesla's time-of-use settings, rather than your JuiceNet settings, if applicable. In both cases - smart charging events and time-of-use settings - the Model 3 will not "wake-up" due to instruction from an EV charging station.”


The Smart Charging program website is https://emotorwerks.com/rewards .

This isnt a chargepoint but was a third party charger, and I seem to remember more than one 3rd party wall connector having similar issues

 

[RTPEV]

I was referring to this thread:

eMotorwerks JuiceBox Smart Charging and Model 3 Incompatibility Update



This isnt a chargepoint but was a third party charger, and I seem to remember more than one 3rd party wall connector having similar issues

I took a look at that thread...I think this is apples and oranges. The thread mentions that the Model 3 will go to sleep if the EVSE shuts down charging and then not wake up again once the EVSE re-enables charging. I would not necessarily characterize this as the Model 3 not following the J1772 protocol (as the eMotorwerks e-mail indicated), as any vehicle plugged into a J1772 can either pull power or not, at its discretion (J1772 does not INSTRUCT a vehicle to commence charging--it only indicates that the EVSE is ready to supply power). The problem--if any--is simply that the Model 3 won't wake up on its own and initiate a charge if it previously went to sleep because the EVSE shut it down. So as a workaround, the JuiceBox will allow the car to charge at a reduced rate during on-peak hours, as opposed to shutting down all the way.

The important distinction here is that the car is actively charging this whole time, just at a reduced rate (due to the JuiceBox signaling to the Model 3 that only 9A is available). What Murray is referring to is the Model 3 either continuing to actively draw a small amount of power, or at least be in the Ready to Charge state, and Chargepoint interprets this as being actively charging (even though it may be drawing less than an amp), and this throws off his total charging time stats that Chargepoint gives him.

Although, I would expect the data to still be relevant in terms of total kWh consumed by the car (if Chargepoint collects that).

 

[jjrandorin]

The model 3 goes to sleep (and wakes up to charge) just fine when connected to the tesla wall connector (and did during that time as well). My point is, people with a third party wall connector experienced this issue, while people with tesla wall connectors did not, and in general, that was because they were attempting to use the smart features of the wall connector vs setting the car to wake up to charge.

Since tesla itself does not offer scheduled charging set in its app, or via the wall connector, it stands to reason that they may not follow the proper protocols to allow that... but thats not the discussion I am having.

I was just attempting to point out (to the OP) that third party wall connectors had some issues starting charges, and one of the ways that the manufacturers worked around that was to keep the car charging (which in this OPs case would skew time connected charging metrics).

Thats all I am saying.

 

[RTPEV]

The model 3 goes to sleep (and wakes up to charge) just fine when connected to the tesla wall connector (and did during that time as well).

Yes, but what I am saying is that it's not the HPWC that decided not to charge in that scenario, but the car (presumably because you have a charge timer set). Yes, if you tell the car to wake up at 1:30am to start charging, it will wake up at 1:30am to start charging, and it will do this properly with any 3rd party EVSE as well.

The thread you pointed to was referring to a case of the car going to sleep because the EVSE it was connected to was not allowing it to charge, so it just gave up and went to sleep. It did not know that at 1:30am the EVSE was suddenly going to allow it to charge. I do hope it's clear that these are two different things.

My point is, people with a third party wall connector experienced this issue, while people with tesla wall connectors did not

The reason HPWCs did not have this "issue" is because they don't have the functionality to spontaneously power up at a later time. As you went on to say, it's the smart feature of the JuiceBox that was tripping up the car, but even then it's not a protocol issue. J1772 does not provide a protocol whereby the EVSE commands the car to begin charging. The EVSE simply either puts a signal on the pilot line indicating how much power is available, or it doesn't (indicating that the charging station is down or un-powered). If the EVSE has a smart feature that "wakes up" charging station at a certain time, all it would do is present a square wave on the pilot line indicating it is ready to provide a charge (and the maximum charge rate). It's then up to the car to acknowledge and then request the EVSE power up and provide the charge. It doesn't really have anything to do with whether the car has the ability to do timed charging, it's all about whether the car is monitoring the J1772 pilot line so it can respond to it. In the case of the Model 3, apparently when the car goes to sleep, it doesn't bother monitoring that line so it doesn't wake up to initiate the charge.

I was just attempting to point out (to the OP) that third party wall connectors had some issues starting charges, and one of the ways that the manufacturers worked around that was to keep the car charging (which in this OPs case would skew time connected charging metrics).

Thats all I am saying.

Yes, I follow. But I don't think that's what's happening in Murray's case. I think he plugs the car in and it charges immediately, but at the conclusion of the charge instead of the car going back to Vehicle Connected state, it goes back to Ready to Charge/Charging state (which actually makes sense if it is still drawing power to run the cooling system, or charge the 12V battery or run additional systems).

If it IS the case of the Chargepoint unit doing the JuiceBox workaround thing, technically the car is still charging anyway (just slower), so technically Murray should count that time as active charging time anyway. Which is why I suggested that looking at the kWh consumed might be more meaningful than just looking at how many minutes the car was actively charging.

Either way, I think this too could be addressed with a Tesla software update that puts the car back into Vehicle Connected state once it completely terminates drawing power from the EVSE. But I imagine this would be an extremely low priority, so I wouldn't hold my breath.

 

[garth_angst]

Copied below is my recently message sent to ChargePoint customer support.

"Installed ChargePoint level two home charger in my garage four years ago to charge my first EV, a BMWi3. Now driving a Tesla Model 3 - charging function works well; however, Tesla has a setting to limit max charge (I set my M3 at 80%). As per Tesla's recommendation, charger remains plugged in 24/7. Distance and cost of charge register correctly on the mobile app, but elapsed time since plugging in continues until I unplug and thus does not indicate the actual length of time it took for each charge. Can this be remedied?"

Has anyone else encountered this?

When/if I receive a response from them, I will post it to this thread.

I'm interested in the answer, but it doesn't bother me that I see that it was charging for 7 hours when in fact it was done in about 2.5.