Help me understand FSD ownership

[whitex]

FYI- My Nissan Leaf has free charging at all Nissan Dealers selling the Leaf. In addition, Nissan offered free DC charging at 5 independent charging locations across the nation for 2 years using a special "No Charge to Charge" card on my 2019 Leaf.

I wanted that with my 2020 Tesla MS and it is a great perk, especially on long road trips. Between that and FSD are the two luxuries I love with my Tesla.

I really don't care about the clawback of Tesla subscriptions like FSD. When I bought my MS I never expected it was mine to sell.

I think the key take away from these discussions for me is when a person sells a Tesla he should never make a claim that he has the authority to sell Tesla subscriptions, lifetime or not. And if the buyer asks just say Tesla is known to audit and they may make you pay for the service as a new owner. If you make a guarantee that you can sell FSD with the car and then Tesla claws it back in a couple months, you could get sued and forced to buy the service for your buyer at the current price. If you disagree then take Tesla to court. In my mind it isn't worth the risk to make the claim based on hearsay and opinion from people on a forum. If you want to sell it then get permission in writing from Tesla. TIVO offers subscription transfers to new hardware or to new owner. I don't see that anywhere with Tesla in writing.

FSD is not a subscription. It's marketed and sold as a feature, just like any other feature of the car. The only subscription Tesla sells is premium connectivity.

Of course if you are leasing a Model 3, then the entire car with all of its features is a subscription, since Tesla does not provide a residual value (at least according to Elon tweets, all M3s are going back to Tesla robots taxi fleet after the lease is over, hence no ability for leasees to buy the car out at the end).

 

[S4WRXTTCS]

I really don't care about the clawback of Tesla subscriptions like FSD. When I bought my MS I never expected it was mine to sell.

It's not a subscription as it's tied to the car.

The current owner not only has the right, but the obligation to inform the new buyer that it includes FSD. That way the new owner can take advantage of it or they can have it disabled if they don't want it enabled (like if they had some teenage driver that they didn't trust with it).

As to the Nissan Leaf. The two years is pretty cool. Not nearly as neat as coast to coast free supercharging for life of the vehicle, but pretty cool nevertheless.

 

[TravelFree]

As to the Nissan Leaf. The two years is pretty cool. Not nearly as neat as coast to coast free supercharging for life of the vehicle, but pretty cool nevertheless.

Nissan Leaf does have Free coast to coast DC fast charging that is not associated with the 2 year Free card for the independents. It's just not as fast as Tesla Supercharging.

As for the FSD, until someone can show me an official statement from Tesla that FSD always stays with the car in a private sale, I will continue to believe you should not guarantee a Tesla policy that they have not stated. But really, it doesn't concern me anyway, because I have no intention of selling my FSD to anyone. I love my Tesla MS. It's a keeper.

 

[sheltz32tt]

After a few months of waiting for the activation, it never happened. I'm now being told it will not follow the car.. I assumed it was taking a long time due to reduced staffing and coronavirus. Not sure where to go from here.

 

[Russell]

After a few months of waiting for the activation, it never happened. I'm now being told it will not follow the car.. I assumed it was taking a long time due to reduced staffing and coronavirus. Not sure where to go from here.

I feel there's nothing for you to pursue from Tesla.

I purchased my car 3rd party dealer who purchased the car from Tesla at an auction after a lease was up. The original sticker shows both EAP and FSD. The reason I know it is not on the vehicle anymore is because when I load the app there is an "upgrade" to FSD for $7000. Does anyone know the guy's name who fought it and won?

You bought the car from a dealer not Tesla, right?
At the time of purchase did the car have FSD?
Did the dealer present the car as having FSD enabled? If yes then you need to talk to them, not Tesla.

Monroney lists what the car had when new.
Anybody can change/remove items during the time they own the car and there's nothing wrong with doing that.

 

[TravelFree]

I feel there's nothing for you to pursue from Tesla.

I agree with your posts on this. It fits with what Tesla has said. But, anyone who had FSD clawed back by Tesla who feels they have been wronged, can always sue Tesla in court. Then let the court decide the issue. In the mean time, Tesla has demonstrated they can and will disable the FSD on a used Tesla that passes through their hands, making it necessary for the new owner to pay to add it back. If you bought a Tesla with FSD directly from a private owner or from a dealer who got it from a private owner then FSD remains with the car.

It's an odd policy that is difficult for many to understand and even I have trouble seeing the ethics of it. But it is what it is and if customers wish to see it changed because they feel wronged, then seek action in court. Tesla doesn't seem ready to change their policy on their own.

Personally, I would like to see it either treated as a software subscription with lifetime license as long as you own the car, or a feature that always stays with the car regardless whether it passed through Tesla or not. I feel current policy is confusing and does more harm to the company than the benefit of $8000 adds to their bottom line.