Powertrain fault. Tesla service.

[wiztecy]

On warm days here (85-92F) my PEM is always on the last blue bar. My car sits out in the sun all day and I also charge at 30A sometime during the day. I definitely worry about long-term health of of the PEM as it seems to be hot all the time.

I wonder... There's the coolant reservoir right there next to the PEM. How difficult and beneficial would it be to plumb some lines to carry that coolant over into the PEM? I should try to measure the temp of that coolant.

Plumbing the coolant lines to run through your PEM will lower your PEM temps but it will also raise your battery temps significantly. I'm more concerned about my battery health over the PEM health. For the PEM cooling I try to find shady spots and nearby parking garages to keep the PEM and Roadster's temp better managed.

Yes, heat kills electronics but more so the large fluctuations in heat / cold. I think the only feasible solution to the PEM is to get more airflow and to keep the PEM as clean as possible from dust, leaves, spiderwebs, etc so it can run at its best efficiency.

 

[PRJIM]

On warm days here (85-92F) my PEM is always on the last blue bar. My car sits out in the sun all day and I also charge at 30A sometime during the day. I definitely worry about long-term health of of the PEM as it seems to be hot all the time.

I wonder... There's the coolant reservoir right there next to the PEM. How difficult and beneficial would it be to plumb some lines to carry that coolant over into the PEM? I should try to measure the temp of that coolant.

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I wonder how this would work?

 

[augkuo]

That should work, same as putting ice on the PEM but at 60 degrees!

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I wonder how this would work?

 

[strider]

Plumbing the coolant lines to run through your PEM will lower your PEM temps but it will also raise your battery temps significantly. I'm more concerned about my battery health over the PEM health. For the PEM cooling I try to find shady spots and nearby parking garages to keep the PEM and Roadster's temp better managed.

Yes, heat kills electronics but more so the large fluctuations in heat / cold. I think the only feasible solution to the PEM is to get more airflow and to keep the PEM as clean as possible from dust, leaves, spiderwebs, etc so it can run at its best efficiency.

Well, I only have a 50-mile commute. I can tolerate a heck of a lot of battery degradation before I can't drive to work. However if the PEM dies it doesn't matter how great my battery health is, I can'r drive to work.

Also, the A/C does a pretty great job of keeping the battery cool (though of course it doesn't keep me very cool). I've arrived home after a 25 mile commute on a 90F day and found the battery at 21C. So I think there is a margin of cooling capacity. Maybe something to look into next year when my warranty is up.

But I agree, I think it's those few really hot days that do the most damage. Do you all regularly pull the cover off the PEM and blow it out?

 

[PRJIM]

Well, I only have a 50-mile commute. I can tolerate a heck of a lot of battery degradation before I can't drive to work. However if the PEM dies it doesn't matter how great my battery health is, I can'r drive to work.

Also, the A/C does a pretty great job of keeping the battery cool (though of course it doesn't keep me very cool). I've arrived home after a 25 mile commute on a 90F day and found the battery at 21C. So I think there is a margin of cooling capacity. Maybe something to look into next year when my warranty is up.

But I agree, I think it's those few really hot days that do the most damage. Do you all regularly pull the cover off the PEM and blow it out?

I don't think you can pull the top cover off the PEM (never seen anyone touch the internals of the PEM). I think you have to pull the whole PEM out and blow it out from underneath.

blowing dust out of Tesla PEM and motor cooling fans - YouTube

That should work, same as putting ice on the PEM but at 60 degrees!

Now all we need is someone to create a unit specific to the Roadster. I like the idea of not having an invasive solution. When it gets hot you simply put the cooling blanket over the PEM and plug in the control unit. Much easier and cheaper than a new design.

 

[daniel]

When I had my issue (reported in post #1) the temps never went higher than normal. All those warnings, but normal temps and the fans seemed to be operating normally. I didn't open/close the charge port door that day, because I didn't know that can sometimes help, but the door did get cycled, without stopping the warnings, before they finally replaced the PEM.

I really like the idea of a water-cooled PEM, but again, my PEM never overheated.

The new PEM, though, seems to ride one blip higher on the temp gauge than the old one did. When I start the car it will be on the lowest blip, and within a minute of driving it's on the third blip, and I've seen it on the last blue blip.

As for keeping myself cool on hot days, I really love the Taylor Mesh Top. Of course, that's only practical on dry days, but our hottest days are dry here in Spokane. And I'm gone for the hottest time of year, hiking up in Canada.

Anyway, what seems odd to me is that I was getting the error message without anything obviously wrong. Fans working and PEM temp on the third blip. Battery and motor temps were even cooler. The ranger could not find anything wrong, and replaced the PEM and fan only on the assumption that the problem had to be with them somehow.

 

[ViperDoc]

Well, my Roadster is still down, after about 2 weeks. I am told by Tesla it is the 400v controller based on the error message (no one has laid hands or eyes on the car). They said the company that "rebuilds" these (and presumably makes them new) has been closed for about a month (I am assuming closed doesn't mean out of business, rather a seasonal closure). Now I just wait. It is pretty frustrating. Tesla has a requirement to be able to supply parts for at least 10 years after building a car, so the fact they can't come up with a part now is pretty lame. Fortunately, my wife's old Toyota RAV/4 is still available, but the Tesla was my every day, pretty much 4-season car, even in the snow of Vermont.

 

[hcsharp]

Sorry to hear that. Why haven't they given you a loaner? When my high-voltage controller went out they instructed me to rent a car on their dime. This is a great time of year to be driving a convertible in VT. Hope you can get it back soon.

 

[Botbldr45]

How does one pull the top off thr PEM and blow it out. Sounds like a good idea but I would be worried about screwing something up (literally!)

Oh and by the way just got some Dynamat and will embark on the sound proof insulation journey soon.
Thanks hcsharp for inspiring pics of modification. Less heat and AC means less for PEM to think about.

- - - Updated - - -

Off topic but interesting ..... Please move to proper spot.

Just got a dreaded RED light in charging port and charging error message. Interesting how it happened cause I returned home after 30 miles and plugged 992 in as usual. It started its cool down ( thanks to Tattler) and I got the confirmation that it completed three cycles and reached my target of 30C. I went outside and the RED was lit up.

Before anybody starts hypothesizing I will say that BG&E had us in a Power Decrease of about 50% due to the heat. Usually my Solar Panels makes life normal during those power decreases but I guess this time it was enough to flash the RED.

Anybody know how to check the Tesla 240 charger cable to see if it registers a power decrease like that...... It has a test button, will that work?.

 

[daniel]

How does one pull the top off thr PEM and blow it out. Sounds like a good idea but I would be worried about screwing something up (literally!)

I believe you have to take the entire PEM out of the car. That's what the Rangers do at the annual maintenance, anyway. And then you have to put everything back together and plug everything in properly.

 

[djp]

Anybody know how to check the Tesla 240 charger cable to see if it registers a power decrease like that...... It has a test button, will that work?.

The VDS will show an error message at the same time the ring flashes red. You'll see a "Line voltage lost sync" alert if the voltage drops while charging.

I got a dreaded red ring while charging yesterday. The VDS displayed a "charging unit error" which wouldn't clear when I cycled the charge port door. I was charging outdoors on my parents' driveway and it turned out the UMC had overheated from sitting in the sun. Moving it into the shade with a frozen gel pack cleared it up.

 

[strider]

I believe you have to take the entire PEM out of the car. That's what the Rangers do at the annual maintenance, anyway. And then you have to put everything back together and plug everything in properly.

There are screws on the top of the PEM that imply there's a cover there that could be removed. I still have 5 months left on my warranty else I'd take a crack at it. I did point my infra-red thermometer at the coolant in the reservoir while the car was hot and got 88F. I pointed it at the PEM cover and got 104F - expect it's warmer inside. Seems to me you could rig up a few liquid PC CPU coolers in and around some of the components in the PEM (never seen the inside so don't know if that statement is valid). I'm still hoping Tesla comes out w/ a factory solution but I'll look into this next spring.

 

[Botbldr45]

An adventure that we all need to explore when warranties expire. Maybe Elons statement that "something cool for the roadster in 2014" implies the PEM solution that we all dream of.

Hope so!

 

[ViperDoc]

Warranties

An adventure that we all need to explore when warranties expire. Maybe Elons statement that "something cool for the roadster in 2014" implies the PEM solution that we all dream of.

Hope so!

Not even warranties help if they can't get the part to fix the car. It has been 2 weeks and part still back-ordered. I called Tesla Ownership services and was told they would try to get a firmer ETA on the part showing up. I asked if they don't maintain an inventory of parts, and the rep basically blamed the suppliers for not giving Tesla the same priority they give other auto manufacturers (and how many of those need 400v convertors?) It sounds like poor planning on Tesla's part or trying to run something a little close to the edge.

The only good part of having the car grounded is that I am not wearing down my rear tires...

 

[Arddrea]

Nice to return home from vacation to my driveway washed out and my car on the fritz.

If your house was flooded enough to loose the driveway are you sure the car stayed dry? IGBT shouldn't fail under low / no load (the 400v part) situations. Water in the circuitry on the other hand....

 

[ViperDoc]

flood

If your house was flooded enough to loose the driveway are you sure the car stayed dry? IGBT shouldn't fail under low / no load (the 400v part) situations. Water in the circuitry on the other hand....

Yes. My house didn't flood, a creek my driveway crosses did though. The driveway wash out was about 200 feet from the house. They finally picked the car up on Wednesday to take it in for service, and as of yesterday, they told me the issue was repaired. Today they do my annual service and a couple of other little things. Hopefully back in the saddle this weekend or next week!