Tesla seeking to open Richmond facility

[bhzmark]

Regarding attempts to shut down public testimony: Be very polite and very calm and state (even interiupt at the right time if you can -- preferably when VADA moves to do something tiresome) -- say something like:


"Point of order: Under Virginia Code Section 46.2-1572 this hearing is supposed to be about the public interest. VADA is a trade association whose stated purpose is to further the interests of its dealer industry. VADA isn't qualified to speak on the public interest. Even if it were (which is isn't) qualifed, VADA has taken more than its share of the time for this hearing and it is clear that its sole objective is to stifle the public for its own self-interest.

Since this hearing is about the public interest, the public needs to be heard. "Hear from the public." "Hear from the public." Etc. in a rousing chorus.

If you get into more detail mention that:

Section 46.2-1572 states: It is permissible for a manufacturer to own a dealer after a hearing "the Commissioner determines that there is no dealer independent of the manufacturer . . . available in the community or trade area to own and operate the franchise in a manner consistent with the public interest;" This hearing should be about the public interest referred to in the law. VADA is attempting stifle testimony from the public about its own interest.



Section 46.2-1573 states: "The hearing officer will set the hearing on a date or dates consistent with the rights of due process of the parties." The public requires that its due process rights be respected despite VADA's efforts to deny them.



See Operation of dealership by manufacturer. (§ 46.2-1572)—Virginia Decoded—Virginia Decoded

Hearings and other remedies; civil penalties. (§ 46.2-1573)—Virginia Decoded—Virginia Decoded

 

[tinm]

Any live updates? Anyone there?

 

[bonnie]

Owners have started testifying - Hodginator went first, sharing his experience buying a Volt vs. a Tesla.

 

[WABarb]

Afternoon update : vada rep is being interviewed. Tesla attorney is questioning and VADA attorney just went off on him about questions and procedures. "I don't know what you do in California but we don't do it that way in VA". Hearing officer just watched.
Consultant with Anderson economic group is up next. Called by VADA.

 

[WABarb]

Anderson consulting expert posed that "teslas can be sold at a profit by franchises because.... Wait for it.... Many other electric cars (he included hybrids in this) are sold by franchise dealers." Well I guess so if you raise the prices and make the consumer foot the bill. That's clearly not in consumer's best interest. He also started to go into how great franchise dealers are because they do charitable work. Fortunately this is not in front of a jury that may be distracted by shallow emotional ploys.

 

[WABarb]

VADA lawyer arguing with own witness who said that any existing dealer has enough experience and knowledge to figure out how much it would cost to host a tesla dealership. Lawyer is positioning that they would need info from tesla. Can you say backtrack.

 

[WABarb]

Regarding attempts to shut down public testimony: Be very polite and very calm and state (even interiupt at the right time if you can -- preferably when VADA moves to do something tiresome) -- say something like:


"Point of order: Under Virginia Code Section 46.2-1572 this hearing is supposed to be about the public interest. VADA is a trade association whose stated purpose is to further the interests of its dealer industry. VADA isn't qualified to speak on the public interest. Even if it were (which is isn't) qualifed, VADA has taken more than its share of the time for this hearing and it is clear that its sole objective is to stifle the public for its own self-interest.

Since this hearing is about the public interest, the public needs to be heard. "Hear from the public." "Hear from the public." Etc. in a rousing chorus.

If you get into more detail mention that:

Section 46.2-1572 states: It is permissible for a manufacturer to own a dealer after a hearing "the Commissioner determines that there is no dealer independent of the manufacturer . . . available in the community or trade area to own and operate the franchise in a manner consistent with the public interest;" This hearing should be about the public interest referred to in the law. VADA is attempting stifle testimony from the public about its own interest.



Section 46.2-1573 states: "The hearing officer will set the hearing on a date or dates consistent with the rights of due process of the parties." The public requires that its due process rights be respected despite VADA's efforts to deny them.



See Operation of dealership by manufacturer. (§ 46.2-1572)—Virginia Decoded—Virginia Decoded

Hearings and other remedies; civil penalties. (§ 46.2-1573)—Virginia Decoded—Virginia Decoded

It was particularly interesting when VADA lawyer threatened to bring in VA dealers, family and employees if the public is allowed to testify!!! To your point -what do they think public interests are? Oh yeah a method to bring money to franchise pockets...

 

[WABarb]

Tesla just backed expert into box quoting expert's own book that says sales via franchise system require franchise getting car at wholesale price. Otherwise they would not be successful.

 

[WABarb]

Continuing to third day to be determined.

 

[bhzmark]

Great. Please share any notes and thpughts re what information might be most helpful for the hearing officer to hear from additional public attendees at the third session.

 

[WABarb]

The third day will be finishing up VADA expert x exam by Tesla team. Then I think they are done and Tesla brings their witnesses. Great attendance, several media and energy/ consumer advocacy reps there.
VADA did attempt to minimize public attendees testimony because these people are 1) not mainstream because they have 100K cars, 2) have several more cars than drivers and the ultimate evidence that they are out of the norm some even have ... gasp,, motorcycles... which would be considered luxury purchase. 3) they made a point to ask what folks did for a living and how they paid for their vehicles (finance, cash, lease) 4) big deal made - did they know what the document fee was. Group was well behaved and no interruptions to process. Others that were there for both times could better speak to how the VADA behaved both times.

 

[bonnie]

Is a date set for the third day?

 

[WABarb]

Is a date set for the third day?

no they are going to let us know... I gave my email to a DMV rep and she will email me with the date... I will share it here as soon as I know.

 

[GaryREM]

Was there and think Tesla's in trouble. VADA's interpretation of the interim agreement may very well win out and at the end of that time the Tyco Road facility will shut down if not taken over by a dealer. Was disappointed in the Tesla team, BUT did not see the first session and, of course, don't know what they have left in their bag of tricks.

Kudos to those Tesla owners who spoke. They were actually sworn in and subjected to cross examination by the VADA lawyer.

 

[bhzmark]

VADA's interpretation of the agreement as it relates to its bearing on a second sales location flies in the face of the plain language of the agreement:

Namely:

The reference to Section 8 wasn't updated in the drafting to the renumbered relevant section which is now 9. (Actual section 8 is irrelevant to this point). Section 9 reads:

VADA's wish that the agreement bars in anyway Tesla's application for an additional location under the statute is contradicted by the plain language above.

VADA loses on that.

 

[bhzmark]

Regarding what happens to Tyco Road. The agreement says:

The statute section cited is the same at issue for this Richmond hearing and is summarized in the agreement itself. Some dealer (or someone with standing -- I would say VADA does NOT have standing, but that is fight that they could have) has to bring and WIN a case on this issue.
Namely, they would have to show that it is in the public interest to shut down the Tesla owned and operated location and it better serves the public interest for Jim Bob & Sons Rustproofing and Pinstriping Auto Emporium to sell and service Teslas. Ain't gonna happen is my bet.

 

[bonnie]

The statute section cited is the same at issue for this Richmond hearing and is summarized in the agreement itself. Some dealer (or someone with standing -- I would say VADA does NOT have standing, but that is fight that they could have) has to bring and WIN a case on this issue.
Namely, they would have to show that it is in the public interest to shut down the Tesla owned and operated location and it better serves the public interest for Jim Bob & Sons Rustproofing and Pinstriping Auto Emporium to sell and service Teslas. Ain't gonna happen is my bet.

Exactly.

 

[GaryREM]

Another comment (which I don't appreciate not being a lawyer) is that this was NOT a public hearing but a judicial proceeding (per the VADA lawyer). Also a comment from him about whether people understood what "the public interest" really meant and the case law around it.

 

[bhzmark]

I think it is an administrative hearing but the subject matter is what is in the public interest, so the public is relevant in that sense.

Whatever "public interest" means it doesn't mean the interests of VADA and its members!

This case is basically the car buying public vs VADA and its members.

The public wants the choice to buy their cars from anyone. VADA wants to limit that choice.

VADA and its members will soon go the way of the Horse and Buggy Makers Trade Association and its members. Their life support is to hide behind protective legislation. Luckily the VA legislature provided a way for the DMV (not subject to election and lobbying pressures) to determine that the public is better served by manufacturer owned sales and service -- at least on a case by case basis. That is cumbersome, but still workable way to manage this issue. It is all about the DMV, through its hearing officer, getting the right result to understand that what is in the public interest is to give them the choice to buy direct from Tesla.

 

[bonnie]

Another comment (which I don't appreciate not being a lawyer) is that this was NOT a public hearing but a judicial proceeding (per the VADA lawyer). Also a comment from him about whether people understood what "the public interest" really meant and the case law around it.

I'm sure the hearing officer totally appreciated being educated by VADA. -smirk-