Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

[gora321]

Here is visualisation of my long logic as simple as I could.
We all noticed that SP didn't move much for almost 2 years.
Boy I can't say that for the value of the company.
We all know what progress Tesla made in last 2 years.
So the difference is actual my opportunity.
As long as Market illusion last I can buy shares of awesome company for very low price.
I'm not complaining to much about BS. Maybe I should say thx.
Ideal for me would be if such situation would last for some 10 years.
One day market will wake up and the share price will be launched far above the Value.
Then my logic would be under reconsideration.
Today is another day where I'm having fun on this long term journey with everything around what is happening.
If you are not to much focused on SP movement you will notice a life around. You have to love it! <3
BtW I'm winning each day because Value is increasing and SP do not!

 

[Dan Detweiler]

I am amused to see the argument that it is too hard to start a new car brand being dragged out here on this forum to be used against Rivian. It was the argument that early shorts used blindly against Tesla. Rivian may or may not make it, but it has what I consider a very saleable product, if the price is right, and with enough financing in a timely manner it is plausible that it could succeed and survive. There is plenty of room in the market for more EV players. Time will tell.

Just my take. I don't think anyone here was stating that Rivian could not, or should not succeed, with or without GM money. I think people were just pointing out that the odds are VERY long and it will be a long hard uphill battle. I think most here would love to see Rivian and others make it. More manufacturers producing EVs equals fewer ICE cars on the road. I think we are all on the same team.

Dan

 

[Fact Checking]

Well, that's a strategy but not a core belief. I suppose you could say that many of the big $TSLAQs see Tesla as a threat to the status quo that must be vanquished. So maybe we add to the list "Fossil fuels are superior".

Either you subscribe to one or more of those core beliefs and hang all your bear theses on them, or you're intellectually dishonest (and/or lazy) and stand to gain materially from Tesla's demise.

The "core beliefs" of the $TSLAQ ringleaders is to take money from others, via any means possible, with a low chance of jail time.

The "$TSLAQ" Twitter crowd amplifying their message: impressionable useful fools, just like most global warming deniers.

Tesla is easier to lie about, because it's one of the most complex businesses in existence.

Tesla is:

• a (foundry less) chip designer and maker firm,
• a software company making:
  • industrial automation software,
  • consumer electronics software,
  • power management software,
  • factory management software,
• a battery maker,
• a factory automation specialist firm,
• a consumer electronics firm, including board design an manufacturing,
• electric power generation equipment making firm, both consumer and utility scale,
• electricity storage firm, both consumer and utility scale,
• autonomous driving software and hardware firm,
• ... and Tesla is also a carmaker.

Tesla could literally be split up into two dozen separate firms and each could go public with billions of dollars of valuation.

That's the flip side of aggressive vertical integration: the price discovery of Tesla's fair valuation slows down.

 

[MartinAustin]

I am amused to see the argument that it is too hard to start a new car brand being dragged out here on this forum to be used against Rivian. It was the argument that early shorts used blindly against Tesla. Rivian may or may not make it, but it has what I consider a very saleable product, if the price is right, and with enough financing in a timely manner it is plausible that it could succeed and survive. There is plenty of room in the market for more EV players. Time will tell.

Totally agree and I would piggyback on the sentiment by saying that the conundrum legacy automakers face - transitioning to BEV - is extremely difficult and potentially Impossible for some. All the while, BEV manufacturers can start up without any of the legacy problems. Those problems being:
* having to advertise and sell ICE during the transition. Kind of disingenuous to be advertising both... the viewing public will notice
* existing dealerships live off the economics of replacing brake parts, exhaust, oil, and all the other parts involved with ICE... and don't want the transition
* existing under-the-table partnerships with entrenched players in oil & dealerships get broken or weakened by the transition
* media entities freaking out over reduced ad revenue. (BEVs do not need to be advertised... and ICE might be unprofitable if great amounts of money are spent on advertising)
* existing relationships with union workforce who will want to stick around through the transition, even though this may be difficult or unprofitable to manage

This kinda reminds me of the rise of the mammals as the dinosaurs were wiped out. There is plenty of room for new BEV manufacturers. It's an automotive Oklahoma Land Rush.

 

[Driver Dave]

Bill Gates shares insights on Tesla and all-electric trucks in MKBHD interview — Teslarati

Bill Gates: “There will be a lot of great electric cars to choose from”

Sad when Bill has such a simplistic point of view on Tesla and EVs.

Companies just don’t start making “a lot fo great electric cars”

There is battery cost.

There is tech with over the air updates.

There is a network of superchargers and cars that know about when to go to them.

There is fun, like Easter eggs.

There is no dealers, to skim money from the deal.

There is investing smartly so you can do all this, profitably.

There is the mind set of saying “Let’s do this” and then making it happen.


Ford, GM, VW, Toyota, BMW, Mercedes are all very very far away from making things work.

Tesla has done it.


Yes, there will be a lot of great electric cars to choose from.

And they will all be from Tesla, for quite some time.

 

[Nocturnal]

"EVs aren't workable and nobody wants them so Tesla will fail"
some time later
"GM and Amazon both want to invest in EVs. This means Tesla will fail."

sigh.

 

[Joe F]

No.. What he describes has been illegal for years... For anyone/everyone...

Please google "naked short-selling loophole"... There's a few links to it discussed from back in 2008/2009....
It's been illegal ever since...

Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the 2019 Investors' Roundtable

So in your enlightened view, if it's illegal it not being exploited I guess. Got it.

And I guess LIBOR manipulation is a fairy tale...

 

[justobuf]

I see an article on ameritrade that fidelity 13f shows they trimmed tesla shares by 45% through 2/13/19. PREV had 16m now 9m. I could see how some would take this negative after Trowe also reduced in latest filing.

 

[Tslynk67]

I am amused to see the argument that it is too hard to start a new car brand being dragged out here on this forum to be used against Rivian. It was the argument that early shorts used blindly against Tesla. Rivian may or may not make it, but it has what I consider a very saleable product, if the price is right, and with enough financing in a timely manner it is plausible that it could succeed and survive. There is plenty of room in the market for more EV players. Time will tell.

It's because this is a fact and we've seen it playing out the last 15 years with Tesla. It's hard to succeed, especially with so many vested interests piled-up against you. I'm not aware that anyone here wishes Rivian doesn't succeed, we want them to do well, this is the Mission of Tesla, not to make us millionaires.

Is the "ValueAnalyst" on SA a bear or a bull?

They just published a blog entry on TSLA that would appear to be fact-based and positive re: declining short interest.

SA - she's very bullish.

A new SC 13G/A form filed: SEC Filing | Tesla, Inc.

 

[Opus BC fan]

Received today:


"10:33 AM (23 minutes ago)

to me

Dear Dr. Rxxxx:

Thank you for contacting the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC) regarding your concerns about Tesla, Canaccord Genuity, and Needham & Company.

The SEC’s Office of Investor Education and Advocacy processes many comments from individual investors and others. We keep records of the correspondence we receive in a searchable database that SEC staff may make use of in inspections, examinations, and investigations. In addition, some of the correspondence we receive is referred to other SEC offices and divisions for their review. If they have any questions or wish to respond directly to your comments, they will contact you.

Thank you for communicating your views.

Sincerely,

Katherine Shiu
Attorney
Office of Investor Education and Advocacy
U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission "

 

[EVNow]

I am amused to see the argument that it is too hard to start a new car brand being dragged out here on this forum to be used against Rivian.

I don't know much abut Rivian - all I'm saying is it is weird to assume Rivian is a potent threat to Tesla that should make anyone sell TSLA. That makes zero sense at this stage. BTW, if it is even somewhat successful, I'd expect them to be taken over by GM or one of the other large OEMs.

 

[UncaNed]

Not irrelevant of course, but subdued. Naked short selling is like a cancer dragging down a patient's health, vigor, and vitality.

FCF is TSLA's Gamma Knife. Good-bye, cancerous shorts. Ttheir time will come to an end as Wall St. becomes irrelevant to Tesla's growth and success. Enjoy it while it lasts, boyz.

Inevitably, Tesla will soar and Wall St Market Makers will sore.

Cheers!

So back when TSLA was more regularly in the $340's - high $360+ range... Did that happen while were climbing the same greased pole we are now? Or has it gotten worse with TSLA more easily manipulated by shorts in the last few months?

 

[thanar]

We think its just the Rivian rumour. But who bloody knows these days? :Þ

Time to get the facts out that Rivian will get the batteries from Tesla!

 

[Unpilot]

It's because it's a fact and we've seen it playing out the last 15 years with Tesla, it's hard to succeed, especially with many vested interest piled-up against you. I'm not aware that anyone here wishes Rivian don't succeed, we want them to do well, this is the Mission of Tesla, not to make is all rich.



She's very bullish.

A new SC 13G/A form filed: SEC Filing | Tesla, Inc.

Can you translate?

 

[Tslynk67]

Can you translate?

F***, what a mess

Edit: edited...

 

[madodel]

I am amused to see the argument that it is too hard to start a new car brand being dragged out here on this forum to be used against Rivian. It was the argument that early shorts used blindly against Tesla. Rivian may or may not make it, but it has what I consider a very saleable product, if the price is right, and with enough financing in a timely manner it is plausible that it could succeed and survive. There is plenty of room in the market for more EV players. Time will tell.

I agree but if this is GM's plan for a supplier for EV powertrains then they are not serious, at least not for any short to medium timeframe. But I'm sure "it's coming".

 

[dc_h]

No, I believe it was the other Wired article that caused the drop:

"Watch Out, Tesla, Audi's e-Tron Is Coming"​

You tell that etron who’s the boss!

 

[dc_h]

You tell that etron who’s the boss!

Maybe toilet Mark consulted with Audi on the name?

Can someone replace Mike Myers face with Mark? Asking for a friend.

 

[Curt Renz]

I see an article on ameritrade that fidelity 13f shows they trimmed tesla shares by 45% through 2/13/19. PREV had 16m now 9m. I could see how some would take this negative after Trowe also reduced in latest filing.

In my TD Ameritrade and Thinkorswim news feeds it simply reads:

Tesla Amended 13G Filing From FMR Shows Cut Stake To ~5.29% Stake
Benzinga

Benzinga: Tesla Motors, Inc. (NASDAQ:TSLA) - Tesla Amended 13G Filing From FMR Shows Cut Stake To ~5.29% Stake
Tesla: SEC Filing | Tesla, Inc.
Yahoo: TSLA Major Holders | TESLA INC Stock - Yahoo Finance

This implies that during the fourth quarter the FMR stake in Tesla was only reduced to 9,092,952 shares (5.29%) from 9,094,405 shares (5.33%) and no further change this year.

The 45% trim to which you referred appears to have occurred during 2018 before the fourth quarter began.

EDIT: Fidelity raises its Tesla stake

 

[gene]

Anyone notice Electrameccanica stock today? Ticker SOLO. 3 days ago on a whim, I bought 1500 shares at $1.25. It is up 113% this morning!