Who has had/having their roadster deposit refunded

[Zer0t]

I was going to out a deposit on a Roadster quite some time ago (early 2018) and thought better of the 50k interest free loano especially after getting opinions here. Given the roadster was being built in 2017 (we‘re building them now quote) and it’s now mid-2021 with no relief insight. Has anyone changed their mind and gotten, or in the process of getting, their deposit back? The missed market returns over the few years would’ve frustrated me and while I’d like to own one some day I’m very glad I didn’t cough up 5ok for what is starting to grim as far as delivery dates.

I was thinking this over because of the lack of info on Cybertruck which I think is a low priced and potentially high volume seller. Giving up 100 bucks on an option to own one is easy but the wait isn’t.

 

[Ostrichsak]

I find it difficult to take somebody serious who is citing the opportunity cost of $50,000 over a few years worth of investment when they're end goal for that money is to buy a $200,000+ brand new vehicle that will be worth half of that in three to four years. This never was an investment opportunity so acting like you're out something when you don't get your massive depreciating asset in a timely manner is a bit counterintuitive.

 

[HankLloydRight]

(we‘re building them now quote)

Link?

 

[Zer0t]

I find it difficult to take somebody serious who is citing the opportunity cost of $50,000 over a few years worth of investment when they're end goal for that money is to buy a $200,000+ brand new vehicle that will be worth half of that in three to four years. This never was an investment opportunity so acting like you're out something when you don't get your massive depreciating asset in a timely manner is a bit counterintuitive.

Really? So giving out an interest free loan isn’t significant? Yes, I can buy a car for 250,000 but that doesn’t mean I’m willing to float Tesla 50k for nearly four years. The asset will depreciate but that will be amplified by missing returns on the deposit for something that’s nowhere in sight at this point. Just owning the ETF for the Dow would’ve returned nearly 50%, 25 grand or 10% of the value of the car. You don’t have to take me seriously, you don’t have to insult me either. I’m just here to enjoy some discourse wrt to Tesla products. However, as someone who’s been managing funds for over 30 years I always consider returns. It’s one thing to buy a car for 250,000 but it’s another thing to float 50,000 and not have the product.

 

[Zer0t]

Link?

28:39 of the launch video. We are making it now.

 

[Ostrichsak]

Really? So giving out an interest free loan isn’t significant? Yes, I can buy a car for 250,000 but that doesn’t mean I’m willing to float Tesla 50k for nearly four years. The asset will depreciate but that will be amplified by missing returns on the deposit for something that’s nowhere in sight at this point. Just owning the ETF for the Dow would’ve returned nearly 50%, 25 grand or 10% of the value of the car. You don’t have to take me seriously, you don’t have to insult me either. I’m just here to enjoy some discourse wrt to Tesla products. However, as someone who’s been managing funds for over 30 years I always consider returns. It’s one thing to buy a car for 250,000 but it’s another thing to float 50,000 and not have the product.

Ohh... I see now. You didn't realize you were putting a deposit on something that wasn't yet created from a company with a track record of delays. Got it. It super sucks that Tesla forced you to make such a decision and took advantage of your lack of knowledge on money related topics.

Meanwhile, I'm over here looking at that on the front end like "I'll be damned if I'm going to give anyone a $50k interest free loan for any reason, let alone to have the privilege if losing $125k over the span of 4-5 years to beta test something. I think I'll stick with my 4-year-old cars that someone else has taken that hit on and sell them for a profit." but hey, I'm not a fancy fund manager like you so what do I know about finances?

 

[Zer0t]

Ohh... I see now. You didn't realize you were putting a deposit on something that wasn't yet created from a company with a track record of delays. Got it. It super sucks that Tesla forced you to make such a decision and took advantage of your lack of knowledge on money related topics.

Meanwhile, I'm over here looking at that on the front end like "I'll be damned if I'm going to give anyone a $50k interest free loan for any reason, let alone to have the privilege if losing $125k over the span of 4-5 years to beta test something. I think I'll stick with my 4-year-old cars that someone else has taken that hit on and sell them for a profit." but hey, I'm not a fancy fund manager like you so what do I know about finances?

your anger is odd. I asked a question as to whether or not people were tired of waiting on a car while sitting on an interest free loan to Tesla. Then we had a discussion that the smart money would stay invested. Regardless of the depreciation putting that money out when it could generate substantial returns is a poor decision. I’m not getting your point other than anger.

I don’t think I was assertive as I’ll be damned if I give anyone an interest free loan. I didn’t say it and didn’t infer it. I’d certainly do it in the right case but to an incredibly valuable car manufacturer? Uh, no I don’t think they’re deserving of an interest free loan. Would they be so kind to me? Of course not. Don’t exaggerate my comment.

I didn’t declare myself anything other than someone who makes his living investing money thus the lack of desire to give up returns for vapor ware. I said experienced and nothing else. The rest is your projection.
I’m sorry for, and equally puzzled by, your anger over this question. But I’m happy you’re buying cars, enjoying them and turning a profit. So why post in the thread that doesn’t interest you?

I think you’re best off muting me because I obviously trigger you. In summary I’m puzzled by your reaction that I’m questioning to see if people are tired of holding on to these deposits for so long.

In the end the simple answer to your comment about depreciation is it’s better to lose 100k than 125k.

 

[Ostrichsak]

your anger is odd. I asked a question as to whether or not people were tired of waiting on a car while sitting on an interest free loan to Tesla. Then we had a discussion that the smart money would stay invested. Regardless of the depreciation putting that money out when it could generate substantial returns is a poor decision. I’m not getting your point other than anger.

I don’t think I was assertive as I’ll be damned if I give anyone an interest free loan. I didn’t say it and didn’t infer. I’d certainly do it in the right case but to an incredibly valuable car manufacturer? Uh, no I don’t think they’re deserving of an interest free loan. Would they be so kind to me? Of course not. Don’t exaggerate my comment.

I didn’t declare myself anything other than someone who makes his living investing money thus the lack of desire to give up returns for vapor ware. I said experienced and nothing else. The rest is your projection.
I’m sorry for, and equally puzzled by, your anger over this question. But I’m happy you’re buying cars, enjoying them and turning a profit. So why post in the thread that doesn’t interest you?

I think you’re best off muting me because I obviously trigger you. In summary I’m puzzled by your reaction that I’m questioning to see if people are tired of holding on to these deposits for so long.

Who's angry? Talk about projecting.

 

[Zer0t]

Who's angry? Talk about protecting.

I’m not disturbed by this at all but your hurling insults to someone you know nothing about. That projects a certain anger or insecurity. I chose anger. Again your Better hitting the ignore button on me.

 

[Ostrichsak]

I’m not disturbed by this at all but your hurling insults to someone you know nothing about. That projects a certain anger or insecurity. I chose anger. Again your Better hitting the ignore button on me.

Even more projecting; who am I "hurling insults at" specifically? These bots sure are getting good at stirring an empty pot these days.

 

[Orosie]

Who's angry? Talk about projecting.

Right....you are so innocent in this waste of a thread. What a great preview of this board.

 

[Ostrichsak]

Right....you are so innocent in this waste of a thread. What a great preview of this board.

You do know what the word "projecting" means, right? The guy said I was "projecting" and then called me angry in the same breath. I wasn't angry. Seems more than one person here doesn't know what that word means.

 

[HankLloydRight]

28:39 of the launch video. We are making it now.

FFS, what he said and what you heard are completely different things. He didn’t say “we are building them now”

 

[Zer0t]

Even more projecting; who am I "hurling insults at" specifically? These bots sure are getting good at stirring an empty pot these days.

I'll point the insults, etc out for you.

You wrote:
I find it difficult to take somebody serious who is citing the opportunity cost of $50,000 over a few years worth of investment....

That's insulting to assume someone isn't serious because you disagree with their opinion. I would take someone serious who was thoughtful on how to deploy 50,000 of their hard earned money.

You wrote:
Ohh... I see now. You didn't realize you were putting a deposit on something that wasn't yet created from a company with a track record of delays. Got it. It super sucks that Tesla forced you to make such a decision and took advantage of your lack of knowledge on money related topics.

Insulting, patronizing and antagonizing. Tesla didn't force me, or anyone else, to put a deposit on the car. It was clearly a willful decision by any who did so. Then you insult me further when you say, "...took advantage of your lack of knowledge on money related topics."

I wasn't taken advantage because I didn't apply the deposit. Also you are insulting my intelligence, kind of just period, but at least specifically as it relates to money management.

Then at the end of the same post your wrote:
I think I'll stick with my 4-year-old cars that someone else has taken that hit on and sell them for a profit.

This way we know how smart your are after insulting my intelligence earlier in the post.

I wrote:
"However, as someone who’s been managing funds for over 30 years I always consider returns."

You wrote in response:
"...but hey, I'm not a fancy fund manager like you so what do I know about finances?"

Did I use any words like fancy? Just staying that my 30 years of practice at something causes me to think about things a certain way. It's providing context. I see no grand claims associated with my statement, you added that. I'd rate this as antagonizing at best.

You wrote:
"Meanwhile, I'm over here looking at that on the front end like "I'll be damned if I'm going to give anyone a $50k interest free loan for any reason,"

Looking at what? I didn't get righteous in my portrayal. I simply stated that it's not a smart financial move to provide an interest free loan. I am carefully weighing the outlay of 50,000 bucks. Yes I don't give interest free loans to for profit entities. Friend or family member, different story. Antagonizing.

You wrote:
"These bots sure are getting good at stirring an empty pot these days."

Insulting.

I wasn't projecting when I said these posts came across as angry. Actually, assuming you were angry was wrong on my part and I take it back. I feel as though you were attacking and antagonizing me and I'll leave it that. Writing makes it hard to read intent, so you are correct, I do not know the context under which you were posting. I retract the angry statements. However, if after reading this you don't see how someone could insulted then I guess we just see things very differently and you know what? That's ok.

More than happy to understand the items that I wrote that may have insulted you and reconsider them.

 

[Ostrichsak]

I'll point the insults, etc out for you.

You wrote:
I find it difficult to take somebody serious who is citing the opportunity cost of $50,000 over a few years worth of investment....

That's insulting to assume someone isn't serious because you disagree with their opinion. I would take someone serious who was thoughtful on how to deploy 50,000 of their hard earned money.

You wrote:
Ohh... I see now. You didn't realize you were putting a deposit on something that wasn't yet created from a company with a track record of delays. Got it. It super sucks that Tesla forced you to make such a decision and took advantage of your lack of knowledge on money related topics.

Insulting, patronizing and antagonizing. Tesla didn't force me, or anyone else, to put a deposit on the car. It was clearly a willful decision by any who did so. Then you insult me further when you say, "...took advantage of your lack of knowledge on money related topics."

I wasn't taken advantage because I didn't apply the deposit. Also you are insulting my intelligence, kind of just period, but at least specifically as it relates to money management.

Then at the end of the same post your wrote:
I think I'll stick with my 4-year-old cars that someone else has taken that hit on and sell them for a profit.

This way we know how smart your are after insulting my intelligence earlier in the post.

I wrote:
"However, as someone who’s been managing funds for over 30 years I always consider returns."

You wrote in response:
"...but hey, I'm not a fancy fund manager like you so what do I know about finances?"

Did I use any words like fancy? Just staying that my 30 years of practice at something causes me to think about things a certain way. It's providing context. I see no grand claims associated with my statement, you added that. I'd rate this as antagonizing at best.

You wrote:
"Meanwhile, I'm over here looking at that on the front end like "I'll be damned if I'm going to give anyone a $50k interest free loan for any reason,"

Looking at what? I didn't get righteous in my portrayal. I simply stated that it's not a smart financial move to provide an interest free loan. I am carefully weighing the outlay of 50,000 bucks. Yes I don't give interest free loans to for profit entities. Friend or family member, different story. Antagonizing.

You wrote:
"These bots sure are getting good at stirring an empty pot these days."

Insulting.

I wasn't projecting when I said these posts came across as angry. Actually, assuming you were angry was wrong on my part and I take it back. I feel as though you were attacking and antagonizing me and I'll leave it that. Writing makes it hard to read intent, so you are correct, I do not know the context under which you were posting. I retract the angry statements. However, if after reading this you don't see how someone could insulted then I guess we just see things very differently and you know what? That's ok.

More than happy to understand the items that I wrote that may have insulted you and reconsider them.

They very basis for creating your thread is flawed. You state the opportunity cost of giving Tesla a free loan is the problem. Your logic is that if the person didn't put the deposit down they could use the same money to invest. As if they're concerned about the piddly little returns on $50k over a few years. If they were, they wouldn't be putting down a $50k deposit on something they knew didn't yet exist and was years and they sure has hell wouldn't be buying a $250,000 depreciating asset if they cared about finances. Stop trying to turn this into some argument about "missing out" that it isn't. It never was. For someone who has worked for 30 years in the industry you state you work in you should know better. You also should have a thicker skin if you intend on being on the world wide web if you took ANYTHING I said as insulting or inflammatory. I may not sugar coat the words but I certainly didn't say anything dishonest or hurtful. You just may not have wanted to hear the words that were said. Get over yourself.

 

[Zer0t]

They very basis for creating your thread is flawed. You state the opportunity cost of giving Tesla a free loan is the problem. Your logic is that if the person didn't put the deposit down they could use the same money to invest. As if they're concerned about the piddly little returns on $50k over a few years. If they were, they wouldn't be putting down a $50k deposit on something they knew didn't yet exist and was years and they sure has hell wouldn't be buying a $250,000 depreciating asset if they cared about finances. Stop trying to turn this into some argument about "missing out" that it isn't. It never was. For someone who has worked for 30 years in the industry you state you work in you should know better. You also should have a thicker skin if you intend on being on the world wide web if you took ANYTHING I said as insulting or inflammatory. I may not sugar coat the words but I certainly didn't say anything dishonest or hurtful. You just may not have wanted to hear the words that were said. Get over yourself.

I don't mind hearing I'm wrong...ever. I do take exception with being insulted and antagonized regardless of the forum. I won't get into the flaws with the rest of your comments on how people think. My skin is think enough and you're gonna have to trust that me pointing out that you are insulting and antagonizing isn't ruining my day. If 50k is piddly why don't you make a charitable donation for 50k while we wait. The people buying the cars that are mass affluent don't think 50k is piddly.

And you are correct the deposits went down knowning the product didn't exist. I am curious that after 4 years if people are fatigued by waiting so long for product that they put a substantial amount of money down on with no end really in sight. I've worked for a long time and saved to be comfortable, can buy this car comfortably but still consider 50k a lot of money. We are obviously in different places on what is a lot of money.

 

[Zer0t]

I wonder how many people have cancel their reservation at this point?

Due to the Covid-19, the Tesla Roadster 2020 has definitely been pushed back. I could have invested my $50,000 in stock at the end of March this year and would have easily make $250,000. We'll 20/20 hind site right??? Anyway, Tesla still has my $50,000. This is what I get for wanting to be...

teslamotorsclub.com

To deposit or not deposit, that is the question.

So...looking over the threads here I would assume the answer is "hell no, don't give them $50k, I'm still trying to get mine back". But, I figured I'd ask just in case there's any other argument I'm not seeing. I'd likely be shaving off some TSLA to pay for it. Has anyone received any special...

teslamotorsclub.com

Visited Tesla Regarding Status of 2020+ Roadster

Greetings, fellow Roadster fans and Tesla enthusiasts. For those of you interested in the Tesla Roadster, I felt compelled to set up a Tesla Motors Club forum account to share my experience going into Tesla and speaking with them about the Tesla Roadster today. At first, let me emphasize that...

teslamotorsclub.com

Here's just a few quick threads where people consider laying out deposit or investing. I should've done a better job with the search function.

 

[Ostrichsak]

I don't mind hearing I'm wrong...ever. I do take exception with being insulted and antagonized regardless of the forum. I won't get into the flaws with the rest of your comments on how people think. My skin is think enough and you're gonna have to trust that me pointing out that you are insulting and antagonizing isn't ruining my day. If 50k is piddly why don't you make a charitable donation for 50k while we wait. The people buying the cars that are mass affluent don't think 50k is piddly.

And you are correct the deposits went down knowning the product didn't exist. I am curious that after 4 years if people are fatigued by waiting so long for product that they put a substantial amount of money down on with no end really in sight. I've worked for a long time and saved to be comfortable, can buy this car comfortably but still consider 50k a lot of money. We are obviously in different places on what is a lot of money.

Just because you keep saying I'm insulting and antagonizing doesn't make it so. I have a differing opinion and I present it factually and clearly. If you can't handle that then the world wide web isn't for you. Not sure why you would start a thread like this to discuss this topic unless all you wanted was for people who share your opinion to create an echo chamber of reassuring agreement. Nobody would do something like that though, right?

If someone doesn't think $50k is piddly this is EXACTLY why they shouldn't be putting a $50k deposit on a $250,000 rapidly depreciating asset that will be worth half of that in ~4 years. This is roughly $125k in loss over 4 years which equates to roughly $30k per year in loss. This isn't a difficult concept to grasp for anyone let alone someone who is in the industry. Oh, am I being insulting again? Stop insulting all of us by acting like you understand finance and then coming on here trying to stir up a pot that is empty.

We must be at different places on what a lot of money is because you keep glossing over the first sentence of that last paragraph like it's irrelevant. Someone's net work should be DEEP into the millions before taking such a hit to their net worth wouldn't be a big deal. That or they're just ignorant to finances and how they work but they wouldn't be deep into the millions for a net worth then, would they? Or it was a windfall of some sort and they won't have it for long making money moves like that.

 

[Zer0t]

I have a differing opinion and I present it factually and clearly.

I agree you have an opinion and it differs, but you support with more subjective opinion.

 

[Ostrichsak]

I agree you have an opinion and it differs, but you support with more subjective opinion.

More baseless claims. Got some examples to support your statement?