Z wave light bulbs and Powerwalls

[Alto Nimbus]

Powerwall in backup only mode. Storm guard is on. I had my first power outage early this am. The change from grid powered to Powerwall powered, resulted in all my lights turning on. I’m using a Wink 2 hub and both Zigbee and Z wave devices.

The hub is on a UPS backup power supply, but that’s not practical for all the light fixtures. The Powerwalls provide whole house power.

Anyone using smart home systems dealing with this too?

 

[ewoodrick]

It's not uncommon for computers (which the bulbs effectively are) to do some weird things during power switch overs. Need to try to determine if it is the lights that reset or the hub. And since the hub is on a UPS, which I'm guessing is on the Powerwall, it may be possible that the UPS didn't like the Powerwall.

 

[destructure00]

Powerwall in backup only mode. Storm guard is on. I had my first power outage early this am. The change from grid powered to Powerwall powered, resulted in all my lights turning on. I’m using a Wink 2 hub and both Zigbee and Z wave devices.

The hub is on a UPS backup power supply, but that’s not practical for all the light fixtures. The Powerwalls provide whole house power.

Anyone using smart home systems dealing with this too?

Not sure what brand your switches or bulbs are, but I believe many brands default to on when power is connected. My semi-educated guess is that you are dealing with a device firmware issue, not a hub/controller issue. If that's the case, you're probably out of luck as far as changing the behavior. I've seen many similar complaints on both the SmartThings and Hubitat forums.

 

[doghousePVD]

All z-wave bulbs I know always go to full white on if they are switched off then on. It's a feature, not a bug. You can write a script to sense if power outage, then set lights to ....

This has nothing to do with the controller. I use Homeseer and Vera, same characteristics on both.

 

[Alto Nimbus]

All z-wave bulbs I know always go to full white on if they are switched off then on. It's a feature, not a bug. You can write a script to sense if power outage, then set lights to ....

This has nothing to do with the controller. I use Homeseer and Vera, same characteristics on both.

Thanks. I’ve got more observing to do, but I think you’re right. I’m wondering how to avoid the flicker that it looks like the devices are reading as a commanded power cycle. Would use Of the the Powerwalls in self powered mode result in a more continuous power transfer between grid, battery, solar?

 

[Dan123]

I have a similar issue with "dumb" ceiling fan lights. They default to "on" when power is restored, and the powerwall switchover is not fast enough.

 

[Alto Nimbus]

Not sure what brand your switches or bulbs are, but I believe many brands default to on when power is connected. My semi-educated guess is that you are dealing with a device firmware issue, not a hub/controller issue. If that's the case, you're probably out of luck as far as changing the behavior. I've seen many similar complaints on both the SmartThings and Hubitat forums.

Thanks. I think you’re correct in your supposition. I’m not sure I’m willing to surrender defeat. Some how, some day, some way A solution might be discovered.

 

[Alto Nimbus]

It's not uncommon for computers (which the bulbs effectively are) to do some weird things during power switch overs. Need to try to determine if it is the lights that reset or the hub. And since the hub is on a UPS, which I'm guessing is on the Powerwall, it may be possible that the UPS didn't like the Powerwall.

Thanks, I’m going to need my data points, but I’m happy the grid is back up.

 

[doghousePVD]

Flicker is often because cheaper bulbs (and cheap/old dimmer switches) are built to use AC cycles (60 Hz), and not make their own kHz cycle. This should be consistent regardless of power source (AC mains or UPS/Powerwall).

If the Powerwall is out of spec, delivering low voltage or low frequency, that might be a reason. Measure the voltage and frequency WITH A LOAD at the outlet/socket. Measuring the voltage at the panel and/or inverter tells you almost nothing. Try to make sure these is a load on the circuit you are testing, eg, every lightbulb is on, fans on, hair dryer, etc.

Under voltage or under frequency (> 10%) could be a problem with the inverter/batteries. If the frequency is OK but the voltage is low, poor wiring (loose connections, under-size wiring, bad dimmer switches, etc.)

 

[Alto Nimbus]

I have a similar issue with "dumb" ceiling fan lights. They default to "on" when power is restored, and the powerwall switchover is not fast enough.

Thanks Dan. I agree with your conclusion.

 

[Alto Nimbus]

Flicker is often because cheaper bulbs (and cheap/old dimmer switches) are built to use AC cycles (60 Hz), and not make their own kHz cycle. This should be consistent regardless of power source (AC mains or UPS/Powerwall).

If the Powerwall is out of spec, delivering low voltage or low frequency, that might be a reason. Measure the voltage and frequency WITH A LOAD at the outlet/socket. Measuring the voltage at the panel and/or inverter tells you almost nothing. Try to make sure these is a load on the circuit you are testing, eg, every lightbulb is on, fans on, hair dryer, etc.

Under voltage or under frequency (> 10%) could be a problem with the inverter/batteries. If the frequency is OK but the voltage is low, poor wiring (loose connections, under-size wiring, bad dimmer switches, etc.)

Thanks, I’ve ruminations

 

[Alto Nimbus]

Thanks, I’ve ruminations

........on this. I have several UPSs that have display of some of this. Also an Envoy that records some more data. Unfortunately the Consumption CTs we’re reinstalled incorrectly by my Tesla install team, and I’ve yet to resolve that.

 

[gpez]

One thing to be aware of is that by default the Powerwall supplies power at 66hz during a grid outage and full state of charge (SoC). This is to keep your solar inverters offline as the battery cannot accept more charge and with the grid down there is no other place to excess power to flow - the Powerwall simply keeps the solar offline until the battery drains enough to accept a charge.

Since normal power in the US is 60hz the increase to 66hz makes all sorts things misbehave. Personally I've seen my LED lights on smart dimmers flicker like crazy, my garage door opener operates strangely ("herky jerky" as I heard it called), the microwave sounds weird (and I've heard some microwaves don't even work), and my UPS kick in and beep because the power supplied is out of spec. It wouldn't surprise me at all if this is happening that it is causing your smart devices to freak out as well.

Fortunately there is a fix to get the Powerwall to supply power at 62.5hz instead of 66hz: My grid outage frequency issue is resolved!

 

[ewoodrick]

One thing to be aware of is that by default the Powerwall supplies power at 66hz during a grid outage and full state of charge (SoC). This is to keep your solar inverters offline as the battery cannot accept more charge and with the grid down there is no other place to excess power to flow - the Powerwall simply keeps the solar offline until the battery drains enough to accept a charge.

Since normal power in the US is 60hz the increase to 66hz makes all sorts things misbehave. Personally I've seen my LED lights on smart dimmers flicker like crazy, my garage door opener operates strangely ("herky jerky" as I heard it called), the microwave sounds weird (and I've heard some microwaves don't even work), and my UPS kick in and beep because the power supplied is out of spec. It wouldn't surprise me at all if this is happening that it is causing your smart devices to freak out as well.

Fortunately there is a fix to get the Powerwall to supply power at 62.5hz instead of 66hz: My grid outage frequency issue is resolved!

I didn't know this and that will DEFINITELY cause a number of UPSs to go to and stay on battery. So not only do you have a single switch over, you have a series of unfortunate events downstream of a UPS. It sees the power drop, it switches to battery, it sees power come back as the Powerwall kicks in, it maybe enables, but in another 100 or so ms (long enough to measure the frequency) it then kicks back off.

Ugly!!!

 

[Alto Nimbus]

One thing to be aware of is that by default the Powerwall supplies power at 66hz during a grid outage and full state of charge (SoC). This is to keep your solar inverters offline as the battery cannot accept more charge and with the grid down there is no other place to excess power to flow - the Powerwall simply keeps the solar offline until the battery drains enough to accept a charge.

Since normal power in the US is 60hz the increase to 66hz makes all sorts things misbehave. Personally I've seen my LED lights on smart dimmers flicker like crazy, my garage door opener operates strangely ("herky jerky" as I heard it called), the microwave sounds weird (and I've heard some microwaves don't even work), and my UPS kick in and beep because the power supplied is out of spec. It wouldn't surprise me at all if this is happening that it is causing your smart devices to freak out as well.

Fortunately there is a fix to get the Powerwall to supply power at 62.5hz instead of 66hz: My grid outage frequency issue is resolved!

Thank you for this very interesting information.