16A Restriction in Private Household? (Europe)

[Y-Mode-L]

My apologies if this has been discussed before, but I could not find anything specifically for Europe.

My Model Y RWD charges fine at superchargers, 11kW pole-chargers are work etc.

At home, I have a single-phase, which the electrician confirmed can take 7.4kW.
However, the Model Y only takes in at 3.9kW maximum. The electrician mentioned that it seems the car is locked at 16A and only when I take it to 32A, it can reach 7.4kW.

Now, I am unable to go above 16A in my Tesla centre screen.
(I have an Alfen Single Proline 22kW charger installed at home)

As I contacted Tesla, they mentioned that households in Europe are limited to 16A for EV charging on single-phase.
They closed the case remotely saying, nothing is wrong with the car (which it could very well be!)

Is this really the case? (My apologies for the lack of knowledge in electrical systems).

Charging at 3.9kW is fine as it chargers almost completely at night, but I want to know if this is a genuine reason that Tesla gave.

Thank you in advance.

Cheers,
N

 

[tga]

In the US, the car's internal chargers consist of 2 or 3 16A modules, all wired to the same single phase input. The RWD 3 and Y have two (32A max), LR have 3 (48A max).

In European cars, I believe all cars get 3-module chargers, since residential 3 phase power is common (we don't have residential 3 phase in the US). Each module is connected to a separate phase, drawing 16A max/phase. So single phase charging can only pull 3.7kW (single phase, 16A @ 230V), as the other 2 modules are not connected to power. Three phase charging give you 11kW (3 x 16A x 240V).

 

[Y-Mode-L]

In the US, the car's internal chargers consist of 2 or 3 16A modules, all wired to the same single phase input. The RWD 3 and Y have two (32A max), LR have 3 (48A max).

In European cars, I believe all cars get 3-module chargers, since residential 3 phase power is common (we don't have residential 3 phase in the US). Each module is connected to a separate phase, drawing 16A max/phase. So single phase charging can only pull 3.7kW (single phase, 16A @ 230V), as the other 2 modules are not connected to power. Three phase charging give you 11kW (3 x 16A x 240V).

Thanks for the details feedback. So the "culprit" is the single-phase in my house!

 

[tga]

Thanks for the details feedback. So the "culprit" is the single-phase in my house!

Correct! One more thought - since you only use the one module at home, it's a good idea to try charging with 3-phase occasionally, just to make sure all three modules are working. You don't want to be in a situation where you want/need 11kW charging, only to find that one of the charging modules failed and you didn't know it.

My old S had dual (single phase) chargers, 40A each. If charging at 40A or less, it would only activate the primary charger. At 41A or more, it used both and split the load evenly. I only had 24A charging at home, but I used to try to charge >40A whenever possible to make sure both were working.

 

[Y-Mode-L]

Correct! One more thought - since you only use the one module at home, it's a good idea to try charging with 3-phase occasionally, just to make sure all three modules are working. You don't want to be in a situation where you want/need 11kW charging, only to find that one of the charging modules failed and you didn't know it.

My old S had dual (single phase) chargers, 40A each. If charging at 40A or less, it would only activate the primary charger. At 41A or more, it used both and split the load evenly. I only had 24A charging at home, but I used to try to charge >40A whenever possible to make sure both were working.

Every other week, I charge it at 11kw at my work place. I presume that should help. Also, I end up going to some fast chargers or Tesla supercharger when I am out for a coffee. Thanks for the great input.

Cheers,
N

 

[Jerry Ham]

Every other week, I charge it at 11kw at my work place. I presume that should help. Also, I end up going to some fast chargers or Tesla supercharger when I am out for a coffee. Thanks for the great input.

Cheers,
N

For the 11 kw at your work - that's a good test. The fast chargers and superchargers are not as they are not AC and they bypass the AC to DC converter (charger modules). You can end up with a failed charger module and still be able to supercharge, FYI.

 

[Y-Mode-L]

For the 11 kw at your work - that's a good test. The fast chargers and superchargers are not as they are not AC and they bypass the AC to DC converter (charger modules). You can end up with a failed charger module and still be able to supercharge, FYI.

Thanks. Good to know. As accepted, my knowledge in Electrical systems is quite scarce.

Cheers,
N

 

[cipman]

As I contacted Tesla, they mentioned that households in Europe are limited to 16A for EV charging on single-phase.

Not true.

The only limit is the circuit breakers in your breaker box, sized according to the approved power installed and the circuit function, AND the internal limit of your charger.
If your electrician confirmed the circuit the charger is connected to can supply 7 kW (actually 230 V * 32A = 7360 W which implies a 40A breaker) then the charger needs to be set to 32A.
Seems the factory default current of your charger is set to 16A so you need to set it to 32A using the control app - see https://knowledge.alfen.com/download/attachments/293634103/Manual-EveSingleProlineDE-English_0.pdf

Even the mobile charger supplied with your Tesla can charge with 32A if you buy the optional 32A blue adapter and have your electrician install a 32A blue socket - again if your circuit can take a 32A current (you have a 40A breaker).

On the other hand, I somehow doubt your circuit can take 32A (7.4kW) for the charger alone. In my neck of the woods max installed power on single phase in theory is 11kW but you'll never see more than 7.4kW (32A general breaker) - over this you get 3-phase. This means the separate circuit for the charger can't have more than 25A (your charger doesn't seem to have this setting).

So, make sure your charger is set 32A, charge, and if a breaker trips, you'll know your circuit can't take 32A.

I have 6kW single phase installed at one of my charging locations and I bought a 180€ chinese mobile charger - with a push of a button the charging current can be set according to what the charger's circuit (outlet) can take: 10A, 16A, 20A, 24A, 32A.

 

[jjrandorin]

My apologies if this has been discussed before, but I could not find anything specifically for Europe.

These kind of questions are usually best asked in the regional subforum for the specific country. Electrical power, codes, and even what the car is delivered with varies in multiple countries.

I suggest re creating the thread here, since you put that you are in Belgium under your user name:

Belgium and the Netherlands

teslamotorsclub.com

 

[tga]

Not true.

The only limit is the circuit breakers in your breaker box, sized according to the approved power installed and the circuit function, AND the internal limit of your charger.
If your electrician confirmed the circuit the charger is connected to can supply 7 kW (actually 230 V * 32A = 7360 W which implies a 40A breaker) then the charger needs to be set to 32A.
Seems the factory default current of your charger is set to 16A so you need to set it to 32A using the control app - see https://knowledge.alfen.com/download/attachments/293634103/Manual-EveSingleProlineDE-English_0.pdf

Even the mobile charger supplied with your Tesla can charge with 32A if you buy the optional 32A blue adapter and have your electrician install a 32A blue socket - again if your circuit can take a 32A current (you have a 40A breaker).

On the other hand, I somehow doubt your circuit can take 32A (7.4kW) for the charger alone. In my neck of the woods max installed power on single phase in theory is 11kW but you'll never see more than 7.4kW (32A general breaker) - over this you get 3-phase. This means the separate circuit for the charger can't have more than 25A (your charger doesn't seem to have this setting).

So, make sure your charger is set 32A, charge, and if a breaker trips, you'll know your circuit can't take 32A.

I have 6kW single phase installed at one of my charging locations and I bought a 180€ chinese mobile charger - with a push of a button the charging current can be set according to what the charger's circuit (outlet) can take: 10A, 16A, 20A, 24A, 32A.

It sounds like you’re talking about the capacity of the Alfen charging station and its installation.

It doesn’t matter if the Alfen can deliver 32A on a single phase if the Tesla can’t pull more than 16A.

Do you have first hand knowledge of a 3 phase European Tesla pulling more than 16A/3.7kW when charging on single phase AC?

 

[cipman]

Read the EU mobile charger manual pages 5-6: https://www.tesla.com/sites/default...ocs/gen_2_umc/Gen2_Mobile_Connector_en_EU.pdf
Here's a video:

- screenshot from 1:41 min attached.

 

[tga]

Read the EU mobile charger manual pages 5-6: https://www.tesla.com/sites/default...ocs/gen_2_umc/Gen2_Mobile_Connector_en_EU.pdf
Here's a video:

- screenshot from 1:41 min attached.
View attachment 988349

I stand corrected. Both the Type 2 Gen 2 UMC and Gen 3 wall connectors support 7.4 kW max, 32A@230V single phase charging:

UMC (see page 5 and 6) - https://www.tesla.com/sites/default...ocs/gen_2_umc/Gen2_Mobile_Connector_en_EU.pdf
WC (page 10) - https://www.tesla.com/sites/default/files/support/charging/Gen_3_Wall_Connector_Manual_UK.pdf

On page 10, the WC manual clearly says 7.4kW max on single phase, 32A@230V and 22.1kW max on 3 phase, 32A@400V (wye/star - I'm ignoring 3 phase delta connections), BUT, the max draw of any European Tesla is 7.4kW single phase, 11kW 3 phase:

https://www.tesla.com/en_eu/support/charging/wall-connector

I don't know enough about EU charging standards to know what is going on here. I'm assuming Tesla isn't creating a European only charger that has a 32A capable module and 2 16A's. Is the WC/UMC sending power from the same single phase phase down 2 wires of the charging cable, or does the car detect a single phase input and internally connect it to two charging modules? I'm guessing the later, since that more closely what happens with North American charging (single phase input, connected to multiple 16A@240V, 3.8kW modules). That would also imply that the Alfen should work at 32A.

As an aside, it looks like the old Gen 1 UMC could do 3 phase, 16A@230V (page 5): https://www.tesla.com/sites/default..._Connector_Touchscreen_EU_R20160317_en_UK.pdf

 

[cipman]

The UMC sends single phase down the port. Don't know what the car does with it.
This is the type 2 plug pin config on it (checked on my charger):

 

[cipman]

P.S. It seems the single phase input is split between all 3 modules in the onboard charger.

 

[tga]

P.S. It seems the single phase input is split between all 3 modules in the onboard charger.

That's what NA cars do, and seems like the most logical way to do it (common design). Although I wonder why the car and wall connector have a 32A limit for single phase and not 48A, since it looks like the Type 2 connector supports 80A single phase.

Type 2 connector - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[cipman]

The max current a single phase circuit can take is 40A as there are no bigger 1-phase MCBs. Also, there are no 1-phase sockets/plugs to carry more than 32A. Maybe the car could take more than 32A but perhaps it's limited to what's considered to be safe for a 1-phase circuit

 

[McMetric]

My last M3 charged fine with 7.4kW 1 phase here in Germany. I used the Tesla CEE32 blue adapter plug for the Tesla UMC
Some external chargers just do not allow more than 16A 1 phase, the cars onboard charger is not the problem.

 

[Francro]

Now, I am unable to go above 16A in my Tesla centre screen.
(I have an Alfen Single Proline 22kW charger installed at home)

Charging at 3.9kW is fine as it chargers almost completely at night, but I want to know if this is a genuine reason that Tesla gave.

Did the electrician who installed the home charger pull an adequate wire from the fuse box to the charger? You most likely have a standard 3x2.5mm wire, and a 16A fuse is placed on it to prevent it from melting. 3x2,5mm wire can take more Amps, but it's better to be safe (especially with all-night charging).

 

[Lumos]

I have a 2023 MYP and I installed a Tesla wall connector to my house in the UK and my house in France. In the UK it is on a 40A breaker and the car charges at 32A, 7KW (although the default I recall was 16A and you have to move the slider all the way to 32A). In France I have three phase and the Tesla app reports 16A 415V and charges at 11 KW.