I'm sorry to hear all the unpleasant experiences people have had with dealers. I've never paid over MSRP for a car. I've never had a dealer do unsatisfactory repair work, and I've had all service and repair done by dealerships. I've had salesmen treat me badly, and I just walked away and never went back. Obviously, there will be inconsistency, and I can see how people with a Tesla service center nearby would prefer that. I'd prefer that too, if there was one. I'm hoping that with or soon after the release of the S they'll open one here. Or at the latest, with the release of Bluestar. It's a better model, but only if you have coverage. I'd drive a couple of hours to a service center. But not more.
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How long will Tesla's current retail model be feasible?
- Thread starter Teslawisher
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- Tesla Inc.
Are you not a fan of the Ranger service? The Rangers exist is so they do not have to open a bunch of service centers.
stopcrazypp
Well-Known Member
I think the biggest opposition to the Ranger service is the cost. If the service center was an available option, I think most people would pick that instead given that consideration.
Based on forum comments in various car groups, I'd say good dealer experiences are rare exceptions. If you're very lucky you live near one of those exceptions. As far as I'm concerned the dealer model is a failure and needs to be done away with.
I really think Tesla should include maintenance for the duration of the warranty period in the purchase price (at least for the 85 kwh models?)....At the very least they should give people the option to pre-pay for maintenance. Tesla has touted electric vehicles as being cheaper to maintain than ICE cars but if the Model S and future models require yearly maintenance, it would be hard for Tesla to corroborate this assertion. Even Fisker "includes" maintenance for the duration of the warranty.
Do you think people who have to use the ranger service, would be more apt to accept the ranger mileage fee if the actual service was free?
I think so. If it's included in the price, then it 'disappears' once you make the purchase. It really should be included as long as the car is under basic 4 year warranty. They may not have factored the service price into all the models or at least the 40 kWh model and still protect the margins they're looking for.
We haven't gotten warranty info yet, but it would be cool if they did something similar to Audi care where your services are 100% covered for a period (or mileage)
The VW I had cost 22 cents per mile for dealer maintenance over the 95,000 miles I kept it--and that was with the first three year bumper to bumper. I can understand why Audi (part of VW) needs to do this. I'm really hoping that the Model S will be far less expensive than the POS VW.
I'm not a fan of having to pay $600 and schedule a month ahead for any non-warranty service. I see Ranger service as the best way to deal with buying a unique car from a distant store. I'm not complaining because I knew up front this was a price I'd have to pay if I wanted this car.
But I accepted it only after the electric Porsche conversion flopped, and after Nissan spent six months figuratively spitting in my face over my Leaf order. I only considered the Tesla after I had waited six months for the Leaf, and no car in sight, and I could not get any information about them other than promises, broken time after time, and I finally got so angry at Nissan that I swore an oath that I'd never buy a car from them.
Only after that did I accept, reluctantly, a service model that would cost me $600 per non-warranty visit, and likely long waits to schedule service.
As for including maintenance and ranger fees in the price of the car, that will not fool anyone who can count, though admittedly there are many Americans who cannot.
So I'm not complaining. I'm just saying they won't sell Bluestar in Spokane without a local service center, or at least a ranger stationed here, and they will sell far fewer Model S cars here without a service center than they would with one. People will not buy a $30,000 car if they know they'll have to pay over a thousand dollars every year in required maintenance and $600 for any non-warranty service call, plus shop time. The Roadster is a unique car. There's literally nothing else like it. The Model S is a very special car that stands out. The Bluestar will compete directly with the Leaf, even if there is a performance version, and people will choose the Leaf (which by all accounts is an excellent car) if Tesla keeps the present service model and does not have local service.
Maybe their attitude is that they cannot meet the demand for cars nation-wide, so they don't care if they lose Spokane and similar-sized cities. That's a legitimate attitude. They'll remain a niche car maker, while Nissan and Mitsubishi and Ford become the principal suppliers of electric cars. Or maybe they're just going to expand slowly and wait for the public charging network to reach places like Spokane before opening a store and service center here. I hope they do that soon.
My Prius cost me about 3 cents per mile for oil changes when I was driving it around 5,000 miles a year and getting two oil changes. Plus about 100 gallons of gas. Now that I only drive it 1,000 miles a year I only get an oil change once a year, so 7.5 cents per mile. I expect a high-performance sports car to cost more.
Assume the Bluestar only needs $300 of maintenance, plus $600 ranger mileage fee, per year, the prius will be cheaper to drive (maintenance + fuel). To make the EV economically competitive you've got to eliminate that $600, which means having a local service center. I think Tesla's model is great. But only for drivers who are near a service center.
I think it's way too soon to either lionize or vilify them. 2000 Roadsters can support only so many Rangers. With 20,000 Model S, there should be a big increase in both Rangers and service centres by the end of the first year (If there isn't then that's a big concern). By the time Bluestar comes out, three or four years from now, there should be between 50,000 and 80,000 Model S and Model X on the road. That should support a reasonably large service network. Toyota, Nissan, and VW all started with limited service networks in a few cities. None of them started out as automotive giants either and all had to compete against the existing Big Three dealers (and the other three North American car companies).
I agree. They can't afford to start off with a service center in every city but do need a much more extensive network. They can grow over time to support the much larger Model S and Model X base and work to getting ready for Gen III launch.
NigelM
Recovering Member
The Tesla Store/Service Center network is getting bigger already and at quite a rapid pace. Personally having the store 3.5 hrs away did bug me, but now there will be a service center less than 1 hour away I'll be very happy. Tesla's challenge will be to keep up the network expansion rate.
Yes, my Prius costs $0.12 per mile which includes fuel and tires. The government thinks cars cost $0.555 per mile which also includes the cost of the car and insurance. If my 2004 Prius was totaled today and I got nothing for it, the car cost would be $0.222 per mile, insurance is about $0.042 per mile, making a combined total of $0.384 per mile. DIY would take about $0.06 off of that.
For the VW. $0.06 fuel, $0.06 insurance, $0.015 tires, $0.22 maintenance, $0.26 car cost total to $0.615 cents per mile.
WAG for the Model S. $0.025 fuel ($0.09 kWh), $0.08 insurance, $0.03 tires, $0.063 maintenance*, $0.0475 car cost* total to $0.673 cents per mile.
* Maintenance = $1000 per year and 16,000 miles traveled per year (about the amount I drive. Of course, miles driven may go up with the Model S).
* Car cost = $95,000 and 200,000 miles total with zero resale value included. Not that I think the Model S will have zero resale value, but any number you put in before you actually sell the car has no meaning, so it's best to put in the worst case.
I of course share Nigel's feelings on this subject. The new service center will save us over $400 in Ranger charges. Is it true that failure to pay for annual maintenance might void the warranty? What is the current policy for Roadsters? My understanding is that Tesla charges $600 for annual maintenane for Roadsters. It will be interesting to see if Tesla continues to charge $600 for the Model S.
Larry
I thought someone relayed word from a ranger that it should be cheaper since the S is easier to work on #1 and many diagnostics can now be done remotely? Either way, it would be great if any work required to remain under warranty was done free of charge.
The entire state of Texas was serviced by Chicago until recently. We still don't technically have a service center but they're counting Houston as the starting point for the Ranger that lives in Houston now. Hopefully they can get Texas law changed.
