Hydrogen Fueling Stations

[vfx]

Here is what I want to know.

How much to build a 8 pump gasoline station?
How much to build an 8 pump Hydrogen station?

All legal requirement costs must be included.

Trying to put together another "Hydrogen is not feasible" argument.

 

[Sgee]

I have already looked at the feasability and the such. Even as a kid I could easily realize that it is just not meant for the average consumer. Where hydrogen will probably play a bigger part is in Airplanes and other things like that.

 

[stopcrazypp]

Here is what I want to know.

How much to build a 8 pump gasoline station?
How much to build an 8 pump Hydrogen station?

All legal requirement costs must be included.

Trying to put together another "Hydrogen is not feasible" argument.

$1 million to $4 million for a hydrogen station according to this article:
Cost of Hydrogen Fueling Infrastructure | Hydrogen Cars and Vehicles
This is according to Larry Burns of GM and from a pro-hydrogen site, so you can assume this is the lower estimate, and there is no mention of how many pumps.

I googled a little and sale prices of gas stations tend to be from the $100,000s to the millions.
Mart for Sale
Gas Stations and Convenience Stores For Sale

I think you will have a hard time finding the exact numbers though.
Related to this "Hydrogen is not feasible" argument is vehicle cost, so far it has been hidden, but this news gives a glimpse:
Toyota to start leasing fuel cell vehicle in Japan - AutoblogGreen
Toyota is leasing their FCHV-adv (basically a hydrogen Highlander) for $7700 per month (yes $7700 not $770) for a 30 month lease. That puts it at $231,000 at end of lease and you don't keep the car. The 470 mile range on the Japanese cycle is pretty good though.

 

[graham]

I think the cost of a hydrogen station varies significantly as well depending on if they ship in the hydrogen, or create it on the spot.

 

[doug]

This article might be relevant here:

Pumping Hydrogen - NYTimes.com

The National Research Council said that the total cost of deploying a national hydrogen network could be as high as $200 billion, including $55 billion in government aid through 2023. Some experts, like Mr. Hwang, expect the cost to be more than twice that.

“Hydrogen was forever 20 years away, but now, for the first time, you see some of the milestones moving closer, not away anymore,” said Mike McGowan, the chairman of the National Hydrogen Association, the industry’s trade group. “There is now almost a sense of urgency about the infrastructure.”

I half expected the guy to continue by saying, "This time, it really is only 20 more years away!!"

 

[vfx]

I half expected the guy to continue by saying, "This time, it really is only 20 more years away!!"

:biggrin:

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[doug]

Talk about green washing...

Saw this a few days ago. TTAC's picked it up, thought I'd pass it along:

At Least He Didn’t Take a Private Jet - Wheels Blog - NYTimes.com

There were more than 50 new members of Congress sworn in during the session, including Eric Massa, Democrat of the 29th District in New York, who rolled up to the Capitol in a Chevrolet Equinox Fuel Cell vehicle.

Mr. Massa had driven the Equinox from his hometown, Corning, down to Washington without using a drop of gasoline or producing any emissions — at least that was supposed to be the message. General Motors builds the fuel-cell stacks that go into the Equinox in Honeoye Falls, right in his district. And it was during a tour of the facility that he came up with the idea of taking a fuel-cell vehicle to Capitol Hill.

“I have asked to drive this vehicle to Washington to demonstrate that this technology is real, it’s here and we are going to work to make sure it’s ready for the American people within a decade,” he said in a news release.
But was the trip as green as the photo suggests?

Not really...

Fuel Cell Pols Gone Bad Vol. 1 | The Truth About Cars

 

[graham]

Ha! The punch line for those who didn't read the article:

Carolyn Markey, a G.M. spokeswoman, said Mr. Massa drove one Equinox from Corning to Harrisburg, Pa., where a second Equinox was waiting for him. He then drove it to Washington, where the above photo was snapped.

In order to deliver and retrieve the Equinox Fuel Cell vehicles, Ms. Markey said, two Chevrolet Tahoe Hybrid S.U.V.’s were used as tow vehicles: one to tow the first Equinox back up to Honeoye Falls, and another to tow the second Equinox, which originated in Washington, up to Harrisburg for the trip back down.

 

[vfx]

I half expected the guy to continue by saying, "This time, it really is only 20 more years away!!"

Or:

"These Battery powered cars are skarin' the bejeezes out of us!"

 

[TEG]

In order to deliver and retrieve the Equinox Fuel Cell vehicles, Ms. Markey said, two Chevrolet Tahoe Hybrid S.U.V.’s were used as tow vehicles

Remember this?:
Hastert's short, hydrogen drive - On Deadline - USATODAY.com

 

[doug]

Fuel Cell: Congressman's Fuel Cell Road Trip Was Horrifically Inefficient

So basically, one SUV traveled 400 miles and one SUV traveled 600 miles for a total of 1000 miles on a 300 mile trip. That's not even counting the mileage on the fuel cell car. Nice work there Captain Planet.

 

[vfx]

This bites.

Especially when compared to this.

edit:
Bad math. I think ABG needs a new calulator...
(still bites though )

 

[stopcrazypp]

This bites.

Especially when compared to this.

edit:
Bad math. I think ABG needs a new calulator...
(still bites though )

Yes definitely a typo, should be $6.8 million. If it was $6.8 billion I think a lot of people would be outraged, we don't exactly have that kind of money to spend to support infrastructure for cars which are nowhere near ready.