Saw my first Ioniq and Bolt on the road yesterday

[T34ME]

I was cruising the Los Angeles freeways yesterday (by necessity and not by choice). As luck would have it, I saw both the Ioniq and Bolt for the first time. Here are my general impressions:

Ioniq - a pleasant looking hatchback car the takes its styling cues from the 2010 - 2015 Prius. The styling is starting to look a bit dated. I checked the specs for the Ioniq Electric and it has a 120 mile range! That's going to work for some people but that range is hardly cutting edge. Price is similar to TM3.

Bolt - WOW, I first thought it was a Honda Fit! It looks very small on the road but I understand it has a lot of interior space. The styling is typical of many hatchback compact cars on the road today from Honda, Toyota, Ford, Nissan, Kia, and others. It tries to look very much like an ICE car with a non-functional grill. And look at the way that back seat folds down! Price is similar to TM3.

My conclusion and opinion is that these two cars will have a very limited appeal to a niche market. I predict they will never sell in large numbers. The cars do not scream "car of the future" with significantly different front end and an interior that feels like a space ship. These two cars will not provide any significant competition for the TM3.

 

[TampaRich]

Without a fast charging network, these cars are stuck being nothing more than commuter cars.

 

[McRat]

...
My conclusion and opinion is that these two cars will have a very limited appeal to a niche market. I predict they will never sell in large numbers. The cars do not scream "car of the future" with significantly different front end and an interior that feels like a space ship. These two cars will not provide any significant competition for the TM3.

So far, no electric or hybrid car in the USA sells well, not even the Prius. Certainly not the Teslas offered so far.

In the last 12 months, US auto sales were 18+ million. 1.5 million new vehicles a month sold in the US alone. There have only been 1.2 million BEVs in sold in the entire world so far, mostly short range. How many are still on the road is not reported, this is total raw sales since 2000 of all prices and top speeds, many not highway capable.

Number cars sold in the world? Over 88 million in the last 12 months.
Number of cars in the world? Guessimate = 1,300 million. EVs are 0.1% of them.

 

[Electroman]

so whats your point? are you saying Tesla M3 will also sell in the same range as Bolt and ioniq?

 

[jsmay311]

The Ioniq EV starts at

Ioniq [...] Price is similar to TM3.

That's a bit of a stretch.

The Ioniq Electric's MSRP is $29,500. And typically buyers get discounts below MSRP. So you're looking at a $6k-$9k (or greater) difference.

And then once Tesla's federal tax credits run out, it'll be a $14k-$17k+ difference.

Just sayin.

 

[alseTrick]

All that's required to be a "car of the future" is to remove the grille and have a barren "spaceship" interior? I hope the criteria are better than that.

 

[McRat]

Without a fast charging network, these cars are stuck being nothing more than commuter cars.

Most cars in the world are commuter cars. EVs are not different in that regard.

 

[McRat]

...
Bolt - WOW, I first thought it was a Honda Fit! ...

Drive the Fit and Bolt the same day. It's free. Drive the Hyundai Ioniq Hybrid too. But i don't believe you saw an Ioniq EV. They are not here yet unless it had an MFR plate on it.

There are more than 40 models of car still on the road today which mimic the CUV shape. Even Mercedes Benz and Porsche make one. Please shoot me if Ferrari does.

There are 4 basic reasons for buying cars.

1) Appliance buyers. This is the majority. The car is a device to move humans and goods, nothing else.
2) Jewelry buyers. These are people who buy cars to be noticed.
3) Sport buyers. These are people who buy vehicles to entertain themselves with. Sports cars, off-road vehicles, drag vehicles, etc.
4) Political buyers. Green movement, Buy American, Buy Imports, Buy Small, etc.

The success that Tesla has enjoyed is due to their cars filling all four categories.

 

[Jeff N]

"The styling is typical of many hatchback compact cars on the road today".... and so, it "will have a very limited appeal to a niche market.

Huhwah?

It looks like all those other cars ... so nobody will buy a car that looks like that....?

 

[eye.surgeon]

So far, no electric or hybrid car in the USA sells well, not even the Prius. Certainly not the Teslas offered so far.

Prius is the 3rd best selling car in California. They've sold almost 2 million of them worldwide.

 

[McRat]

Prius is the 3rd best selling car in California. They've sold almost 2 million of them worldwide.

The Prius is the 3rd best selling Toyota Sedan in the US.

Total 2016 sales of all Prius Variants in all of North America did not hit even reach near 150,000. What does that compare to?

The Ford F series sold 965,000 last year. (GM sold over 1 million pickups though)
The Honda Civic sold 430,000 last year.
The Toyota Camry sold 404,000 last year. 401k RAV4's
The Hyundai Elantra (WTF is that?) sold 256,000
The Chevy Cruze sold 216,000

You have to go really, really far down the list to find the #1 selling hybrid. There were over 18 million new vehicles sales in the US alone in the last 12 months. 150k ain't on the radar.

Over 88 million cars were sold worldwide on the books last year.

 

[TampaRich]

Most cars in the world are commuter cars. EVs are not different in that regard.

Even commuters take road trips now and then. That's just not a reasonable option for the Bolt or Ioniq without fast charging.

 

[David29]

Drove a Bolt yesterday at an EV event. Short drive so my conclusions are only preliminary, but I quite liked it. Spacious (much more headroom than a Model S, back set looked as if it had better legroom than my S), very peppy, good outward visibility, very powerful regen braking, handled well. Drove only at low speeds (35 or 40 mph, max) so I can't speak to highway performance, noise, etc. Certainly worth a look for commuting, but as others say, the tricky part is long distance travel.

 

[McRat]

Even commuters take road trips now and then. That's just not a reasonable option for the Bolt or Ioniq without fast charging.

Go to Plugshare.com set options to CCS Payment Req'd. Now look.

 

[T34ME]

Huhwah?

It looks like all those other cars ... so nobody will buy a car that looks like that....?

You have just illustrated the technique of taking two independent statements out of context to support some conviction you may have. One statement is not related to the other as you have tried to convey. Nice try though.

 

[T34ME]

Prius is the 3rd best selling car in California. They've sold almost 2 million of them worldwide.

Actually the current generation of Prii 2016/17 are not selling well (styling is just too cartoonish) but I will presume that your statistics are correct but the Prius is a hybrid (even the Plug-In like I own) and the topic of my thread was comparing totally electric vehicles.

 

[McRat]

Actually the current generation of Prii 2016/17 are not selling well (styling is just too cartoonish) but I will presume that your statistics are correct but the Prius is a hybrid (even the Plug-In like I own) and the topic of my thread was comparing totally electric vehicles.

You probably did not see a Hyundai BEV, and I doubt you've driven a Fit or Bolt EV.