Sentry Mode without DashCam turned on?

[TimothyHW3]

Is there a way for me to run sentry mode when the dash camera is disabled? Doesn't seem like it?

Whenever I try to save sentry mode videos when the dashcam is not red(running) it doesn't save anything.

I turn it off by long pressing the camera icon or then unplug and plug without turning it on.

But for whatever reason sentry is not saving videos when the dashcam is off.

I think the dashcam is using too much energy as it runs 24/7 as opposed to only when sentry is on, fills up my recents and I think it adds a bunch of random saves in saved clips. In those random saves I don't see sentry front lights which means sentry did not activate itself.

So is there a way to run only sentry mode without the dash cam ON or is my software bugged and it can?

 

[TimothyHW3]

I have 2019.20.4.2 by the way

 

[MP3Mike]

I think the dashcam is using too much energy as it runs 24/7 as opposed to only when sentry is on, fills up my recents and I think it adds a bunch of random saves in saved clips. In those random saves I don't see sentry front lights which means sentry did not activate itself.

Sentry mode is what uses the power not the Dashcam. The Dashcam only records while you are driving. Sentry mode records while you are parked, and automatically saves 10 minute chunks when it thinks something interesting happened.

Dashcam only has the last 60 minutes of activity unless you tap the icon to put the last 10 minutes into the folder to be saved.

And yes, you can figure that Sentry mode uses ~ 1 mile or range per hour if I recall correctly.

 

[sceptic]

If you don't have a usable usb then sentry mode has nothing to "save" to. If the camera is not "on" it means the usb is not being read as available (not properly formatted or.....)

 

[TimothyHW3]

If you don't have a usable usb then sentry mode has nothing to "save" to. If the camera is not "on" it means the usb is not being read as available (not properly formatted or.....)

Well, not quite 100%. I think when the USB is plugged in when I start the car it is mounted, but dashcam needs to be started with the red icon showing up. So in effect it should be available to the sentry mode.

Also dashcam is recording in the recent so it is writing the usb stick, which is not ideal...

So you guys always have dashcam running when sentry is on and when dashcam is off(not unmounted, but after car start or just the usb plugged in) sentry doesn't save anything?

 

[Knightshade]

Sentry can be turned out with no USB in the car at all.

It won't save any video of course, because there isn't any- but it'll do the HAL message and the classical music alarm and whatnot anyway.

If DOES have USB media/cameras are working then all it does video-wise is, when it enter alert state, it copies the last 10 minutes of video in the "recent clips" folder from the cameras to a folder in the saved clips directory.

 

[Resist]

The Dashcam only records while you are driving.

That's not true. I have plenty of Dashcam video from when I was messing around inside the car while in my garage. If the red light is on, on the Dashcam icon then it's recording, whether you are driving or not.

 

[lowcarbon]

If Sentry mode is ON but DashCam OFF (no red icon) then nothing gets saved to USB?
This is what I'm observing but seems a bit idiotic...
eg you plug USB into console, leave car and switch Sentry mode ON... you'd expect alerts to then be saved to USB but they aren't - not unless you remember to first press the Dashcam icon to show red dot before leaving car!

Several times I thought I'd left the car with Sentry mode on only to discover plenty of Alerts but NOTHING saved to USB.

 

[Knightshade]

If Sentry mode is ON but DashCam OFF (no red icon) then nothing gets saved to USB?
This is what I'm observing but seems a bit idiotic...

Why?

Sentry doesn't record video. Ever. That's what dashcam does. So if you turn dashcam off you get no video. Very straightforward.

All sentry does is the alerts, and moving the last 10 minutes of dashcam video to a saved folder automatically if it alerts.

You can still use its alerting feature without any video (indeed older Model Ses without dashcam that's ALL they can do with it)

If
eg you plug USB into console, leave car and switch Sentry mode ON... you'd expect alerts to then be saved to USB but they aren't - not unless you remember to first press the Dashcam icon to show red dot before leaving car!

Several times I thought I'd left the car with Sentry mode on only to discover plenty of Alerts but NOTHING saved to USB.

Dashcam is on by default- it'll only be off if you don't have USB media, or you intentionally turned it off (and why would you other than when removing the drive to pull things off it)?

 

[VMich]

Very straightforward.

except it doesn't so anywhere in the manual. It specifically says the Sentry Mode will save video footage to USB drive if it is available, without ever mentioning anything about Dascam.

 

[Knightshade]

except it doesn't so anywhere in the manual. It specifically says the Sentry Mode will save video footage to USB drive if it is available, without ever mentioning anything about Dascam.

That's not correct.

Page 76 of the manual mentions, among other things, that dashcam will record when the car is powered on (ie awake) and that it will automatically begin doing so when you insert a properly configured USB drive into one of the front ports.

That explains how it's dashcam that is always recording if the car is awake- regardless of the state of sentry mode.

Then on the next page explains how to find any given footage- including in the sentry folder.

Then on page 144 it explains if the alert or alarm state of sentry mode is triggered, it saves the recent 10 minutes of footage (which obviously could only BE saved because it already exists- and it only exists because dashcam already had recorded it)... and we already know it does so by moving it to the sentry folder (because that, too, is mentioned back on page 76/77 where it tells you how to find any given footage that dashcam had recorded-and then mentioned again on page 145/146)


It then goes on (again page 144) to point out Sentry still works fine without a flash drive- except that video recordings are not available of the event that alerted it.

 

[VMich]

That's not correct.
It then goes on (again page 144) to point out Sentry still works fine without a flash drive- except that video recordings are not available of the event that alerted it.

The manual says:

When in the Alert or Alarm state, Sentry Mode saves the most recent ten minutes of footage prior to the event that triggered either state, provided that a properly configured USB flash drive is inserted into one of the USB ports (See USB Flash Drive Requirements ..... where it doesn't mention Dash Cam at all.)

Note: When the Alarm state is triggered, the most recent six seconds prior to the security event may be sent to Tesla for temporary backup for approximately 72 hours. You can enable or disable the collection of this video at any time......
Note: Sentry Mode can operate without a flash drive installed. If you vehicle enters the Alarm state, the security alarm activates and you will receive a notification on your phone. However, video recordings of the event are not available.

My point is that the flash drive is installed and nowhere does it say anything about having to tap the Dashcam icon. Hell even the fact that you have the Dashcam icon visible means that the car KNOWS it has the USB drive available.

When you create two FAT32 partitions on one physical drive, you can have the music from one partition available for the media player, second partition with TeslaCam directory shows as ready/paused, but because you didn't tap the stupid Dashcam icon, your Sentry Alarms won't produce any video. And by the way, since you have no video produced locally, nothing will be uploaded to Tesla for backup. This quite certain, I've tried to get the footage from them but there was none.

This is clearly a programming design error. They should have recent video footage stored in RAM and upload it to Tesla regardless of the USB state.

 

[Knightshade]

The manual says:

When in the Alert or Alarm state, Sentry Mode saves the most recent ten minutes of footage prior to the event that triggered either state, provided that a properly configured USB flash drive is inserted into one of the USB ports (See USB Flash Drive Requirements ..... where it doesn't mention Dash Cam at all.)

What footage, exactly, do you think it's "saving"?

Because since Sentry itself doesn't record anything- there's nothing to save without dashcam.

Note: When the Alarm state is triggered, the most recent six seconds prior to the security event may be sent to Tesla for temporary backup for approximately 72 hours. You can enable or disable the collection of this video at any time......
Note: Sentry Mode can operate without a flash drive installed. If you vehicle enters the Alarm state, the security alarm activates and you will receive a notification on your phone. However, video recordings of the event are not available.

Yes, I already mentioned it works without a flash drive- just no video saved...

Why? Because without a flash drive- no dashcam feature. Which, again, is the ONLY feature that RECORDS the video.

Not sure why you're quoting the bit I specifically already mentioned?

My point is that the flash drive is installed and nowhere does it say anything about having to tap the Dashcam icon.

Except the part describing dashcam that tells you that's what records video ANY time the car is on/awake.

Versus Sentry which doesn't do that, because that's not a feature of Sentry mode. Saving dashcam video (if it exists) is though.

And again, dashcam is ON BY DEFAULT- so the only reason you need to press anything is if you want to turn it OFF intentionally.... (and then back on later if you did so).

When you create two FAT32 partitions on one physical drive, you can have the music from one partition available for the media player, second partition with TeslaCam directory shows as ready/paused, but because you didn't tap the stupid Dashcam icon, your Sentry Alarms won't produce any video.

That's the same way it works WITHOUT the music partition- so unsure why you even bring that up?

If dashcam is paused- it won't record. That, too, is explained under Dashcam in the manual.

By default- when you insert the key, Dashcam is ON. So you have to INTENTIONALLY turn it off for it to stop recording.

(above is still true as of at least 2020.8.2 BTW since I just did some unrelated testing involving USB devices this past weekend- every time I inserted a properly set up storage device, dashcam turned on, with red dot for recording, a few seconds after the storage was inserted)

And by the way, since you have no video produced locally, nothing will be uploaded to Tesla for backup. This quite certain, I've tried to get the footage from them but there was none.

Which is why the manual says footage "may" be uploaded. It has to exist to be uploaded.

This is clearly a programming design error. They should have recent video footage stored in RAM and upload it to Tesla regardless of the USB state.

The system appears to have a very very small amount of memory available for this (remember- none of these features was actually in the original design of the car- they were added years later as software updates by user suggestion) so it's possible there's a hardware reason it can only upload any footage if it exists on the key, rather than doing it from the apparently tiny bit of ram buffer available... (could even be security reasons around not directly exposing certain areas of memory to external network connections but it's all speculation for most of us)

We'd probably need one of the "access to root" guys like Green or maybe Jason Hughes to comment on that.

 

[VMich]

That's the same way it works WITHOUT the music partition- so unsure why you even bring that up?

to demonstrate that the car knows about the presence of the USB drive. Also a fun fact, I haven't seen it mentioned by the usual youtube and forum stars.

what footage, exactly, do you think it's "saving"?

From the cameras, as the first line describing Sentry Mode is : In Sentry Mode, cameras and sensors remain powered on and ready to record suspicious activity when the vehicle is locked and in Park. (ok, it says "ready to", I give you that).

Except the part describing dashcam that tells you that's what records video ANY time the car is on/awake.
Versus Sentry which doesn't do that, because that's not a feature of Sentry mode.

That "that's what records video here and nothing else" is just your conjecture and I even though I accept that how it works now, I still claim it's either a bug or serious documentation issue.

Dashcam description doesn't say it's a prerequisite for Sentry Mode. The manual is strictly separating these two functions everywhere, they even have separate USB formatting chapters. Everywhere these two are mentioned, it's in the form of "USB ... used to ... save videos when using features such as Sentry Mode or Dashcam" - it's all written as if these two are totally independent except of the common USB drive.

The manual stresses obvious truths like "exceeding maximum weight the Model 3 hitch is designed to support can cause significant damage" but fails to mention a critical requirement affecting a security function? Please...

If I may throw in my conjecture... they will fix it by using exFat and getting rid of the "pause Dashcam for USB removal" requirement. We'll see in couple of months.

 

[Knightshade]

to demonstrate that the car knows about the presence of the USB drive. Also a fun fact, I haven't seen it mentioned by the usual youtube and forum stars.

... ok... and regardless of the music parittion being there or not- if there's a properly set up teslacam partition and folder- the dashcam feature works (and is on by default) so still not seeing how that matters?

From the cameras, as the first line describing Sentry Mode is : In Sentry Mode, cameras and sensors remain powered on and ready to record suspicious activity when the vehicle is locked and in Park. (ok, it says "ready to", I give you that).

Right. Ready to- as in Sentry keeps the car "on" so that Dashcam, which in the Dashcam part of the manual, explictly tells you IT is what is ALWAYS recording if the car is on and you have proper storage attached... (unless you manually turn it off)

That "that's what records video here and nothing else" is just your conjecture

Except, it's demonstrably not, and I quoted the user manual telling you the same thing I am.

If the car is awake and you have the storage there- Dashcam is always recording.

Nothing else does (or even claims it does)

and I even though I accept that how it works now

And it's how it has always worked since before Sentry even existed.

None of this has changed.

, I still claim it's either a bug

...what is? The fact Dashcam is what does the recording?

How or why is that a bug?

or serious documentation issue.

Again- the manual explicitly tells you it's always dashcam recording if the car is awake.

The manual is already pretty long and complex, not sure going even further into the weeds here makes sense.

Dashcam description doesn't say it's a prerequisite for Sentry Mode.

Again- not only does it absoluely say it's the feature that records... it even tells you in the SAME SECTION how to look at all the footage DASHCAM recorded... including sentry stuff

I cited the pages to you earlier on this.

Why would it tell you in the dashcam section how to view the dashcam footage in the sentry folder if the two were not related at all?

The manual is strictly separating these two functions everywhere,

Yeah- it's not though. Again go re-read the dashcam section where they tell you how to view video including sentry folder

If I may throw in my conjecture... they will fix it by using exFat and getting rid of the "pause Dashcam for USB removal" requirement. We'll see in couple of months.

...what?

How does exfat fix the fact Sentry doesn't ever record video- only video related thing it does is moves the dashcam recorded video to the sentry folder (and maybe uploads 6 seconds worth to Tesla if it goes to alarm state)

 

[VMich]

Dashcam is on by default only until you pause it to check the footage - then you return the USB drive, but Daschcam stays paused until you manually re-start it.

The rest of this discussion became irrelevant yesterday when (after I've expressed my surprise to Tesla support about the missing footage) they've sent me the uploaded 10 second video from Sentry Mode Alarm which were recorded while Dashcam has been paused.

In conclusion: beware about the Dashcam being paused. If you have Sentry Alarm while Dashcam is unavailable or paused, the footage might be uploaded to Tesla - request it on Tesla SSO – Login as Data Privacy Request / Obtain copy of my data, instead of offered time period choose Other and ask for the Sentry Alarm video footage in the text. Later you'll receive an email with link to download a zip.