What's Still Killing the Electric Car?

[Norbert]

Been away for a little while... sorry.

Eberhard responded to the article on that same 20min.ch website.

One has to click "Alle Kommentare" first...

 

[Larry Chanin]

Killing the Electric Car ... Again!

Perverse policy signals are pitting utilities against the EV revolution. Will regulators give utilities the incentives they need to pave the way for electric transportation?

With all the risk and no reward for utility companies, economic incentives don't support innovation.

If the utility suddenly starts making more profits by selling electricity overnight for EVs, regulators will force the utility to return to ratepayers any excess income.

If EVs win 1 percent of the market share for ground transportation, it will eliminate more than $5 billion from the U.S. trade deficit.

Larry

 

[Norbert]

Killing the Electric Car ... Again!

Interesting article, thanks for posting!

It seems to confirm my impression about which I wrote here long ago: utilities aren't pushing this development enough with proposals, offers, and initiatives, which indicates that either they don't see the potential, or that current regulations keep them from being able to take advantage, of something which should be to their advantage. Utilities need to be in a position where it is obvious to them that a strong EV market will mean more customers, and more business to them. As the article seems to imply, that business advantage could be shared by the utilities for a larger profit/business, and by rate payers, as a part of it can be used to reduce rates in general. But also, a part needs to go to the utilities such that it will be in their interest to support EVs as much as they can.

 

[Larry Chanin]

H

Interesting article, thanks for posting!

It seems to confirm my impression about which I wrote here long ago: utilities aren't pushing this development enough with proposals, offers, and initiatives, which indicates that either they don't see the potential, or that current regulations keep them from being able to take advantage, of something which should be to their advantage. Utilities need to be in a position where it is obvious to them that a strong EV market will mean more customers, and more business to them. As the article seems to imply, that business advantage could be shared by the utilities for a larger profit/business, and by rate payers, as a part of it can be used to reduce rates in general. But also, a part needs to go to the utilities such that it will be in their interest to support EVs as much as they can.

Hi Norbert,

I found the following excerpt from a comment very instructive.

John

This article oversimplifies many things. First, most utilities do have Time Of Use rates and many others have EV rates designed explicitly to encourage off-peak charging of EVs. This varies widely by state and even by utility. Second, the problem is not the regulatory framework; the problem is rate design. If utilities recover all of their fixed costs (e.g. cost of building a power plant) in the monthly customer charge, and all of their variable costs (e.g. fuel) in the $/kWh energy charge, then the issue of "lost margins with TOU rates" can be avoided. If, however, a utility has fixed costs embedded in the per unit energy charge, then TOU rates are harmful to them. Some states encourage proper rate design; others do not.

Larry

 

[neroden]

So the answer to the earlier question "What rare metals are used for the battery?" is most likely Aluminium and Copper.

This actually makes perfect sense. Not exactly rare, but expensive and energy-intensive to refine, and in high demand.

 

[vfx]

An ICE car uses similar materials. to build the frame and shell as an Electric Car.

A look at the Model S drivetrain an it appear physically much smaller than most engine-transmission combos. Add in a driveshaft, differential, catalytic converter, exhaust/muffler system, fuel filling and tank and overall they seem not so equal. Though maybe the electric drive motor has more copper than an ICE starter motor, alternator, and generator.

Tesla's giant battery box is filled withe different materials but are they so rare?

Just askin'

 

[mgemmell]

...A look at the Model S drivetrain an it appear physically much smaller than most engine-transmission combos. Add in a driveshaft, differential, catalytic converter, exhaust/muffler system, fuel filling and tank and overall they seem not so equal. Though maybe the electric drive motor has more copper that an ICE starter motor, alternator, and generator.

Tesla's giant battery box is filled withe different materials but are they so rare?

Just askin'

Yeah. I trust that these studies take into account the large amount of aluminium, steel, copper and such that go into the ICE engine block, gearbox, drivetrain, exhaust (including catalyst) etc.? I suppose I'll just have to read the thing in detail! Dang

 

[Zythryn]

Interesting article, thanks for posting!

It seems to confirm my impression about which I wrote here long ago: utilities aren't pushing this development enough with proposals, offers, and initiatives, which indicates that either they don't see the potential, or that current regulations keep them from being able to take advantage, of something which should be to their advantage...

Not all utilities are the same.
My utility is currently running a proto type plan where they install a second meter for EV/PHEVs which is about half the rate than their regular rate. I currently pay just under 5 cents/kwh between midnight and 7am.