I was wondering the same thing...couldn’t figure out what the heck he was talking about.
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Who needs a roadster when you have model s plaid?
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felixtb
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the premise of this thread is absurd. It’s the same thing as saying who needs an Audi R8 when there is already the Audi RS6.... or who needs a Mercedes AMG GTR when there is already the AMG E63....... Because simply they are completely different driving experiences and visual experiences. Either you are more interested in a highway super cruiser or you want a real sports/super car...... my 2 cents. 
I totally agree with you. I ordered Roadster in 2018 and plunked down $50000 deposit. Once Plaid was announced I ordered Plaid with just $1000 down. The trick now is trying to get my $50000 deposit back. For the last 3 weeks I have been getting the run around (there is no cancel icon). Now I know what Fisker customers must have felt like.
It's a sad day when car Dynamics and Driving Experience is reduced to numbers like 0 to 60 and quarter mile times. If the new Roadster has essentially the same chassis as the Plaid, it will be the greatest rip off of all time, and it simply won't sell, and it will be trashed in the automotive press. Since I think those things are highly unlikely, I suspect that the Roadster will show significantly higher limits both in relationship to braking and handling, have significantly if not dramatically better vehicle Dynamics, and have other improvements as well, yet unknown. Otherwise, it would make little sense that anybody would want to pay an extra $60,000 for nothing. Styling simply isn't enough of a reason.
Not to be too hard on you guys, but I think you guys are conflating simple acceleration numbers and performance. They're not the same. And for sure there is a huge gap between a car that goes really fast and a car that's really enjoyable to drive anywhere near its limits. See the early generation Corvettes which were great 'numbers cars' but were really not much fun to drive and were simply unpleasant at the limit.
Ask anybody who's ever driven a car around Nurburgring, and where the new plaid Model S looks like it's going to undercut the Porsche Taycan time (7 minutes and 42 seconds) significantly, the new Roadster is more likely to shatter it and potentially better the current Benchmarks which are the Porsche GT2RS and the Lamborghini Aventador svj, both coming in around 6 minutes and 40 + seconds.
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100% this.
I love true drivers cars. My mother-in-law has a Model S P100DL. I have an acceleration boosted Model 3 AWD. I would not want to swap cars with her. I found the S to be a large bore but very fast. The 3 is literally thrilling to drive and fast enough. That said, I did put a refundable deposit on the Plaid for two reasons. 1. To lock in FSD price. 2. I 100% expect an inside/outside redesign of the S before Plaid comes out. Considering they're building it on the new architecture it's kind of a no brainer. Tesla has learned a lot since the original Model S design and maybe, just maybe, they can get it to drive at least as good as the Model 3.
However, if the Plaid S is essentially the current Performance car, but faster and with some aero bits, I'm a hard pass. I'll go for the Roadster, finance it, and peel off TSLA shares to make payment if need be. I'll keep the thing for a decade, snow tires in the winter, drive it a ton, and it'll still lose less value than the Model S Plaid will over time. I hope the Plaid S is really really good as I'd rather get a sick car for $140k than $200k, but there's no way I'm driving a fast/boring $140k car. I'd rather get a track oriented Model 3 P for $80k.
Here's the car I had before my Model 3. A C7Z06/7. I put 50k miles on it daily driving it in NY for two years. It looked sick, super fast, was less fun dynamically than the Model 3.
Carbon ceramics love road salt.
Ah yes! My sentiments exactly!! I love that picture of your Corvette. It looks like it's moonlighting as a snowplow!!
I much prefer my tuned-up model 3 with its MPP Coilover set, wider tires, lighter wheels, front lower control arm bushing swap, and other tweaks to any Model S I have ever driven. The Model S is brutal in its acceleration but it's just ponderous in its transitions and dynamics. Perhaps that's unfair because I've never driven a Model S with anything like the level of suspension tweaking and refinements that I have on my daily driver DMP. But the S still seems just too big and too heavy in my experience to be really that enjoyable. My Model 3 feels like it weighs about 3200 pounds and is tossable and dynamically playful in a way that a heavier car like the model S could never be. Like you say, it's more than fast enough, and I bet around most tracks (esp. short ones) would trash most performance Model Ss, not outfitted with the plaid drivetrain.
I guess that's my other concern – the model 3 feels like it weighs less than its actual weight whereas the model S feels like ~ 4800-5000 pounds (just about what It weighs)! Earlier on this thread I think I posted something about all this – a design goal if they do redo the suspension on the Plaid Model S would be to make it feel much lighter than it is. Like Colin Chapman famously said, "do your best design and then "add lightness"." If you can't add lightness, at least add a light feel.
Dynamics over numbers. Of course there are numbers that reflect dynamics, but most car guys don't know about that stuff.
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Oh jeez. This Model 3 refresh throws a wrench into the situation. lol
They're offering me $35k on my 37k mile 2018 AWD+ with bald Supersport tires. lol
They increased the acceleration 0.1 while also throwing those 80lbs beautiful weights on all four corners. I'm sure throwing lightweight wheels would make a huge difference.
Do I..
1. Sit tight with my AWD hoping that the Plaid S is awesome to drive and, if not, go for Roadster eventually.
2. Pick up the new Model 3 Performance with a fresh warranty and better resale value, enjoy it and get into light track driving/autocross, and pick up the Roadster in a few years also giving TSLA shares more time to grow.
If I wasn't married to a gorgeous woman who's smarter than me I'd just get the Model 3 P and then swap it out right away when the new hotness comes out in 10 months. lol
I'd probably sit tight and wait for the Roadster but that's just me. I don't know about the Model 3 refresh being all that significant although you do get to upgrade potentially to the performance model which is significant. But you'll still need to put coilovers and other upgrades on it if you want to do light tracking. For me half the fun is the upgrade process. We are disincentivized from buying a new model 3 because we have the last of the unlimited free supercharging DMP cars. I suppose if they came out with a significantly upgraded battery pack with an extra 50 horsepower I might be tempted. We enjoy going everywhere on Tesla's nickel. Well okay it's not really Tesla's nickel but it feels like it's so it's fun. Just curious what have you done to your car other than put Michelin Pilot Super Sports on it?
PS I guess one possibility would be get the new dual motor performance model 3, keep that as your daily driver and use the new Roadster on the weekends. That way you could keep the miles low but it would be a shame almost not to drive that thing everyday.
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0-6 in 1.5s sounds almost like collision force!!! could be dangerous.....
We have a two car garage and will stick with "his" and "hers". Right now it's Y and 3. The goal, like many of us I'm sure, is Cybertruck [she loves it] and Roadster. Also, I'd honestly daily drive a McLaren F1 if I could afford the car. <-only gas car I remotely like. lol
I haven't done any real mods to the car. I did get second set of wheels with PSS as I put them on everything, then put snow tires on the stock aero wheels. I always envisioned trading up at some point and didn't want to throw a bunch of mod money into the not performance model.
In NY there's not a ton of Tesla modding going on. Frankly I've considered taking some of my TSLA profits and opening up a TSLA tuner shop. lol
I may just have an open convo with my wife and see what she suggests. I'll walk away with either a soft "yes" on the Roadster or getting the new P3 today. lol
@dfwatt Just spoke with my wife. She's a 10 in every way and so kind but I was nervous to explain for some childish reason. lol
She agrees with you. I'm getting a Roadster! AAAAAAAAA!!!!
She agrees with you. I'm getting a Roadster! AAAAAAAAA!!!!
Way to go!
Her mom has the Ludicrous S. She's like "The Model S sucks...you don't want that." Take that OP of this thread.
Her mom has the Ludicrous S. She's like "The Model S sucks...you don't want that." Take that OP of this thread.
I'm jealous. I'm sure I'm not the only one who will be jealous when you get a new Roadster. I could probably take the plunge and liquidate some savings but it seems like an enormous Indulgence to the toy budget. My other concern about it is frankly that is hard to stay out of trouble sometimes with the Model 3. How much harder will it be with the Roadster? I mean realistically I can't get anywhere near exploring my car's 1 G+ cornering anywhere on the street without risking a major ticket or even worse.
With the Roadster you've got 1 G+ acceleration to worry about too. Even just in the model 3, if you're pulling away from a stop light with Brio as the Italians would say even though you're not making any noise and not spinning any Wheels you're leaving all the other cars in the dust so to speak and if a cop sees that you're possibly going to get a ticket even if you didn't exceed the speed limit. You could contest that of course but I guess my point is performance past a certain amount becomes really unusable except on track.
The 64000 dollar question is if I had a roadster would I be brave enough to track it? I don't know about that one. That thing is so fast and you could get into so much trouble because you're up over 130 very quickly. It would be a wonderful Dilemma to have for sure
I'm jealous. I'm sure I'm not the only one who will be jealous when you get a new Roadster. I could probably take the plunge and liquidate some savings but it seems like an enormous Indulgence to the toy budget. My other concern about it is frankly that is hard to stay out of trouble sometimes with the Model 3. How much harder will it be with the Roadster? I mean realistically I can't get anywhere near exploring my car's 1 G+ cornering anywhere on the street without risking a major ticket or even worse.
With the Roadster you've got 1 G+ acceleration to worry about too. Even just in the model 3, if you're pulling away from a stop light with Brio as the Italians would say even though you're not making any noise and not spinning any Wheels you're leaving all the other cars in the dust so to speak and if a cop sees that you're possibly going to get a ticket even if you didn't exceed the speed limit. You could contest that of course but I guess my point is performance past a certain amount becomes really unusable except on track.
The 64000 dollar question is if I had a roadster would I be brave enough to track it? I don't know about that one. That thing is so fast and you could get into so much trouble because you're up over 130 very quickly. It would be a wonderful Dilemma to have for sure
Totally understood and agree. This is a worry, but yeah, a good worry to have. I’ve long swung between JCW mini coopers and Z06s for this issue. “I want something fun to drive on the street” and get/tune a manual JCW. New Z06 comes out I’m like “**** I want that. Power!!!!” I get it. Love it. Too much for the street. The Model 3 is the perfect balance I’ve always been looking for.
My most fun Z06 was the C5. Crap car but soooo enjoyable. The C7 looked so sick. So much power. Too much for the street. It was a little better once I got the Cup 2s off and tuned the mag suspension but still. For me, fun comes in driving a car near its limit. My most favorite car I ever had was a Geek Squad beetle when they first came out. Best job ever. I’d take the same highway ramps again and again for work. I got that little POS four wheel drifting around all the ramps in the area. Such joy!!! Maybe there will be a “chill” or “not superhero” mode that will lower the limits to make it more usable. Maybe it’ll put the camber in a bad position to limit grip. Insane but you never know with Elon. I’ll start stacking up on tires now. lol
I have faith that somehow it’ll be fun. Worst case I’ll also get a cheap totaled title Model 3 P, strip it, hack it for max power, and that’ll be my track toy. lol
How could you compare two unreleased cars? And second thing for Roadster2 - the price after few years maybe be near the same as new, when model s playd can lose more than half of price in 5 years!
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Put it in CHILL mode, strap on the helmet, drive within your skillset, enjoy!The 64000 dollar question is if I had a roadster would I be brave enough to track it? I don't know about that one. That thing is so fast and you could get into so much trouble because you're up over 130 very quickly. It would be a wonderful Dilemma to have for sure
Put it in CHILL mode, strap on the helmet, drive within your skillset, enjoy!
Yeah. I wonder if we could even see a power slider. They're going to know people will want to take this to the track. They also know not everyone is Lewis Hamilton. Hell, even Elon crashed his McLaren F1 because it was above his skill level. He gets it. I have faith they'll figure it out.
The model S is a grand tourer, which is practical but it isn't a sports car. For purists a sports car has two doors/seats, is light weight and handles very well, none of which qualify any of the current Tesla models (I think the Model 3 almost gets there in handling but not quite).
Me I would absolutely go for the Model S plaid because I can still chauffeur my 3 kids around in a pinch, and I've owned enough true sports cars to regret the compromises they present in terms of comfort and utility. But alas I am not rich so I'll stick with my M3P which is still pretty freaking awesome.
Me I would absolutely go for the Model S plaid because I can still chauffeur my 3 kids around in a pinch, and I've owned enough true sports cars to regret the compromises they present in terms of comfort and utility. But alas I am not rich so I'll stick with my M3P which is still pretty freaking awesome.
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