Another audio upgrade thread for UHFS (2016)

[siamnet]

I do not I have a rock ford fosgate sound Processor and a nvx amp. But the bass sounds so good. I wish I could get other channels to work

I think you need someone not on this forum but on the DIYMOBILE AUDIO forum (or high end sound shop) that have audio experience and knows how balanced input/output works. I have no idea how they work.

This user on this forum (vcor) seems to know what he is talking about and you might ask an audio shop how to convert a "balanced" line output to a signal that your Rockford Fosgate DSP or whatever DSP to work.

Hell, I should probably ask around since I don't like using my current method since my balance/fader/position is all of out of wack. I will be redoing my audio next summer since I'm going full active (bought another amplifier) on my front 3 way. So, I might do some research later (not this year) on this topic while I'm "hibernating" in the winter.

However, if you are able to figure this out, PLEASE PLEASE share with us/me because I want to be able to utilize the line outs !!!

 

[siamnet]

I do not I have a rock ford fosgate sound Processor and a nvx amp. But the bass sounds so good. I wish I could get other channels to work

Were you able to get other channels working via LINE OUT?

 

[Romand]

Were you able to get other channels working via LINE OUT?

no

 

[siamnet]

no

Which Rockford fosgate sound Processor did you use to hook up for the subwoofer output.

 

[siamnet]

Update since I mentioned that I was going full active and have a shop redo all the wiring for me and do a proper tune on my Helix processor in 2023.

So, I found a shop close to me (Radioactive Burlington, Canada) where I dropped off my car for a few weeks (I left on vacation which worked out great).

I asked them to perform the following:
1)redo my power wire
2)build me a new amp rack (rear lower trunk) to accommodate the new Arc Audio amp for going full active front stage.
3)install and tune a Helix DSP Pro Mk2 - requires new signal wiring
4)install my new sub (custom box built by a shop in Florida).

Final audio equipment list:
(There are some crazy expensive build like Matt Schaffer's than mine but this was "affordable")

1. Focal K2 tweeter (from my previous car)
2. Focal K2 3inch midrange
3. Stereo Integrity TM8 (replaced the Audiofrog GS8ND2)
4. Helix DSP Pro MK2 w/ USB Hec card (replaced the Helix DSP.3s) - needed 10 channel inputs for 6 speaker level front (tweet, mid and midbass)
5. Arc Audio XDI 1100.5 (powers the sub and 8inch midbass)
6. Arc Audio XDI 450.4 (powers the tweets and 3inch midrange)
7. Custom 10 inch sub with Audiomobile Evo

What I bought new for the 2023 upgrade was the Arc Audio 450.4 amp, SI TM8, Helix DSP Pro Mk2 and Custom 10inch Audiomobile Evo sub & enclosure. I would recommend finding a competent shop that knows how to tune the Helix or any DSP of your choice.

I'm able to listen from the Tesla head unit or straight from my Android phone (high res music from Apple Music and/or hi res files on my phone) via USB cable (into Helix USB). My URC.3 knob is used for volume control for both methods. However, the URC.3 knob is a must for listening from USB source since you can't use your steering wheel volume control.

 

[TonyT]

I did this 8 years ago and used option 1. Re-reading it, I'm very doubtful my ideas for options 2/3/4 will work and I didn't try them. I'll update the article. A balanced line level really needs to be converted to an unbalanced line when going to vehicle audio amps that also have unbalanced inputs. I'd guess 99% of vehicle audio amps use unbalanced input. Perhaps some very esoteric (i.e. expensive) amps might support balanced inputs with XLR connectors. RCA connectors are not normal for balanced signals, but the JL Audio converter used them and they worked fine.

I only used these line-level connections for the subwoofer, but I did not test if these were full frequency. My subwoofer amplifier had a built-in frequency cutoff. I don't see why Tesla would filter them as they were intended to be connected to the optional amp with full bandwidth, or in your case, the UHFS amplifier.

Anyway, I hope that helps!

Actually, you and siamnet were both so close... Option 4 should still be good. Originally, I tried your posted method of using the wire and shield. But the part that didn't work was using the shield, and connecting to the ground of the amp. When I tried this I could not see any signal on my JL VXi input. I also did not hear anything on the amp output. I gave up after a while... Then one morning I decided I should just ask JL about how to use the balanced line out from the Tesla into the VXi. I was amazed that by the time I finished making my coffee they already responded! The solution was so SIMPLE! You can use Pin 5 and 15 on X427, 5 is the + that goes to the Line input, 15 is the - that goes into the Line Input on your amp or LOC. If your using the other side of the wires, 25 and 30 on the amp connector purchased from Arrow, Digikey, or Mouser. I hooked everything in this morning and now I'm seeing the signal! I also hooked in the Left and Right woofer output from MCU into my DSP amp, and the signals are also showing. The remote, Pin 4 or 11 depending on which side is being use also works perfect for turning on the amp. Now if I remember correctly the cars premium amp has a 20A power line, 12 guage. If you only need 20A for a small amp, the factory wiring can be used to supply the aftermarket amp 20A of power, ground and remote. Make sure there is a fuse if the car did not come with premium amp. You will need to look up the fuse location, depending on when the car was built, the fuse can be in a few locations.

I'm glad I saw this post showing the line outputs were used, and inspired me to take a second stab at it. Now I just need to run out and grab some speaker wire so I can completely confirm the outputs are working. I do need to take some measurements. JL support warned me that if the voltage output from the Tesla is too high I will need to get an adapter so I can lower the voltage. My VXI has a limit of 15V on the input.

 

[TonyT]

Confirmed! Time to start building!! Will be summing all the front. For now I will likely loose balance to rear from MCU. I'll test the front 3 output to see if they are full signal and if sub is needed. But if I need to use sub out then I will need at least a 10 channel in DSP.... My wallet is going to cry. Might be time to get the VXi1000/1 too.....

 

[maximizese]

I've got a base audio system in our 2013 S85 and having a been thinking about an upgrade. Not sure if 3-way or 2-way components are the way to go but I'm learning towards the former either using a set of Alpine R2-S653 or Focal 165AS3 (around $500-$600) which would be powered by a class D amp. Then I'm not sure if I could go active with powering each to a separate channel for tuning or just trust the passive crossover and use just 2 channels for the front. Also planning on a 10" Kicker shallow sub to fit in the right side of the trunk.

What's the consensus on rear door speakers? Should I even bother with them or leave them stock and keep them powered by the MCU? I don't mind swapping in a decent cheap set of coaxial back there but folks have been saying the rear door speakers don't do all to much. Not looking to spend too much on this but I'm also planning on sound deadening the doors with SoundSkins Pro kit.

 

[siamnet]

Actually, you and siamnet were both so close... Option 4 should still be good. Originally, I tried your posted method of using the wire and shield. But the part that didn't work was using the shield, and connecting to the ground of the amp. When I tried this I could not see any signal on my JL VXi input. I also did not hear anything on the amp output. I gave up after a while... Then one morning I decided I should just ask JL about how to use the balanced line out from the Tesla into the VXi. I was amazed that by the time I finished making my coffee they already responded! The solution was so SIMPLE! You can use Pin 5 and 15 on X427, 5 is the + that goes to the Line input, 15 is the - that goes into the Line Input on your amp or LOC. If your using the other side of the wires, 25 and 30 on the amp connector purchased from Arrow, Digikey, or Mouser. I hooked everything in this morning and now I'm seeing the signal! I also hooked in the Left and Right woofer output from MCU into my DSP amp, and the signals are also showing. The remote, Pin 4 or 11 depending on which side is being use also works perfect for turning on the amp. Now if I remember correctly the cars premium amp has a 20A power line, 12 guage. If you only need 20A for a small amp, the factory wiring can be used to supply the aftermarket amp 20A of power, ground and remote. Make sure there is a fuse if the car did not come with premium amp. You will need to look up the fuse location, depending on when the car was built, the fuse can be in a few locations.

I'm glad I saw this post showing the line outputs were used, and inspired me to take a second stab at it. Now I just need to run out and grab some speaker wire so I can completely confirm the outputs are working. I do need to take some measurements. JL support warned me that if the voltage output from the Tesla is too high I will need to get an adapter so I can lower the voltage. My VXI has a limit of 15V on the input.

Awesome and hope this will help someone else in the future !!!

 

[siamnet]

I've got a base audio system in our 2013 S85 and having a been thinking about an upgrade. Not sure if 3-way or 2-way components are the way to go but I'm learning towards the former either using a set of Alpine R2-S653 or Focal 165AS3 (around $500-$600) which would be powered by a class D amp. Then I'm not sure if I could go active with powering each to a separate channel for tuning or just trust the passive crossover and use just 2 channels for the front. Also planning on a 10" Kicker shallow sub to fit in the right side of the trunk.

What's the consensus on rear door speakers? Should I even bother with them or leave them stock and keep them powered by the MCU? I don't mind swapping in a decent cheap set of coaxial back there but folks have been saying the rear door speakers don't do all to much. Not looking to spend too much on this but I'm also planning on sound deadening the doors with SoundSkins Pro kit.

Depending on your sound goal. If you want SQ then do a front stage 3 way active. I have my factory amp powering the rear OEM speakers still.
At a minimum, sound deaden the front door if you plan on going full active since either a 6.5 or 8inch midbass driver will be installed there.
I would chose the the Focal over the Alpine. The specs of the Focal is a bit better over the Alpine in your post.

I kinda went crazy with my audio setup since it's a slippery slope. It has gone through 3 iterations and my wife has told me to stop upgrading. Since my last post from August 2023, I've changed out my every audio components except the Helix DSP and 8inch midbass. This 3rd upgrade is my last final build. I'll post pictures but again, depends on your build, you can still have a "decent" sound with front 2 way setup and a 10 or 12 inch sub in the rear.

Subwoofer:
Depends on how much of a bass head you are or what type of music, I am not sure if a 10 inch shallow mount will do the trick for you. The 10 inch shallow mount Audiombile EVO did not satisfy me and I sold it for a 12inch Stereo Integrity SQL 12 in a prefab 1 cubic foot enclosure (doesn't take much room in the trunk but it's ~55 lbs should I need to lift it out).

Active vs passive:
Most audiophile will say that go full 3 way active if you can. However, that just depends on budget, time and your sound goal. Initially (in 2022), I had 3 way but tweeters & midrange was on a passive crossover. Then last year, I went full 3 way active. Honestly, my old ears can at least tell a difference between same components on passive versus active. However, my ears cannot tell a difference between hi-res (Apple Music) vs Tidal hi-res MQA or streaming from Android phone vs Iphone.
I think running the Focals in passive would be fine (a good start) since it seems to have setting to adjust the listening position with a switch on the passive crossover.

 

[maximizese]

Depending on your sound goal. If you want SQ then do a front stage 3 way active. I have my factory amp powering the rear OEM speakers still.
At a minimum, sound deaden the front door if you plan on going full active since either a 6.5 or 8inch midbass driver will be installed there.
I would chose the the Focal over the Alpine. The specs of the Focal is a bit better over the Alpine in your post.

I kinda went crazy with my audio setup since it's a slippery slope. It has gone through 3 iterations and my wife has told me to stop upgrading. Since my last post from August 2023, I've changed out my every audio components except the Helix DSP and 8inch midbass. This 3rd upgrade is my last final build. I'll post pictures but again, depends on your build, you can still have a "decent" sound with front 2 way setup and a 10 or 12 inch sub in the rear.

Subwoofer:
Depends on how much of a bass head you are or what type of music, I am not sure if a 10 inch shallow mount will do the trick for you. The 10 inch shallow mount Audiombile EVO did not satisfy me and I sold it for a 12inch Stereo Integrity SQL 12 in a prefab 1 cubic foot enclosure (doesn't take much room in the trunk but it's ~55 lbs should I need to lift it out).

Active vs passive:
Most audiophile will say that go full 3 way active if you can. However, that just depends on budget, time and your sound goal. Initially (in 2022), I had 3 way but tweeters & midrange was on a passive crossover. Then last year, I went full 3 way active. Honestly, my old ears can at least tell a difference between same components on passive versus active. However, my ears cannot tell a difference between hi-res (Apple Music) vs Tidal hi-res MQA or streaming from Android phone vs Iphone.
I think running the Focals in passive would be fine (a good start) since it seems to have setting to adjust the listening position with a switch on the passive crossover.

I reached out Reus (they're a few exits down the freeway from me) to see what their opinion is regarding 2-way vs 3-way front components on a base system upgrade, passive vs active, and what kind of audio solutions they could offer. A lot of Tesla folks seem happy with their work and I'm not sure whether they do a proprietary mix of speakers, amps, and tuning or if they use and tune a DSP, add sound deadening materials, or advise and do custom builds.

I'm aiming towards SQ and don't mind a weaker sub. My wife and only turn up the volume when we're on a road-trip or waiting at a Supercharger, otherwise we keep the volume low enough to hold a conversation and still be able to hear emergency vehicles around us. 65% of our music preference is classical/instrumental, 10% rock/pop, 10% hip-hop, 10% talk/podcasts, and 5% EDM.

We listen to a lot of John Williams composed music (Olympic theme, E.T, Superman, Indiana Jones, Harry Potter, Jurassic Park, etc)...coincidentally John Williams was seated next to my wife at last Friday's concert at the Walt Disney Concert Hall and his music will be featured this Friday.

 

[TonyT]

One more thing I want to post of note. Base audio cars can use the remote wire to turn on aftermarket amps. However Base audio can not use any of the line outs, and can only use the speaker outs, Front Left, Front RIght, Rear Left, Rear Right. Center if you want. Per original post, the front mids do not output, and the tweeter and woofer are actually parallel so you can use whichever speaker level output you want.

 

[siamnet]

I reached out Reus (they're a few exits down the freeway from me) to see what their opinion is regarding 2-way vs 3-way front components on a base system upgrade, passive vs active, and what kind of audio solutions they could offer. A lot of Tesla folks seem happy with their work and I'm not sure whether they do a proprietary mix of speakers, amps, and tuning or if they use and tune a DSP, add sound deadening materials, or advise and do custom builds.

I'm aiming towards SQ and don't mind a weaker sub. My wife and only turn up the volume when we're on a road-trip or waiting at a Supercharger, otherwise we keep the volume low enough to hold a conversation and still be able to hear emergency vehicles around us. 65% of our music preference is classical/instrumental, 10% rock/pop, 10% hip-hop, 10% talk/podcasts, and 5% EDM.

We listen to a lot of John Williams composed music (Olympic theme, E.T, Superman, Indiana Jones, Harry Potter, Jurassic Park, etc)...coincidentally John Williams was seated next to my wife at last Friday's concert at the Walt Disney Concert Hall and his music will be featured this Friday.

I think based on your musical listening preference, it would take $$ to replicate that SQ sound (home audio) in the car. But considering amount of time spent in the car, it might not be worth it. If you're able to listen to a demo of Reus in a base audio car then do that since many people are happy with that drop in replacement speaker upgrade. However, I think the Focal components that you picked out and a class D amp would do wonders over the OEM base audio system (might be good bang for the buck over Reus if you are DIY'er).

I think there are other threads of people comparing a full blown Reus system (speakers & amp) against a custom system. Again, it comes down to $$ and how bad you want that SQ in the car.

Although, I work from home but I went all out with a sound system in my car since that's my zen away from my kid. I typically drive back and forth across the US/Can border every weekend (2 hours each way), so a good sound system was important for me. I don't listen to classical music unless I'm studying for an exam/license/working from my desk.
In my car, I listen to mostly, 90's alternative/rock and old school rap/hip-hop with explicit lyrics since I can't play my kind of music in the house with a 8 year old with precocious ears listening. However, I do use a few classical jazz tracks and Norah Jones to test my car audio system to make sure I'm getting my money's worth. LOL.

Good luck and let us know.

 

[maximizese]

I think based on your musical listening preference, it would take $$ to replicate that SQ sound (home audio) in the car. But considering amount of time spent in the car, it might not be worth it. If you're able to listen to a demo of Reus in a base audio car then do that since many people are happy with that drop in replacement speaker upgrade. However, I think the Focal components that you picked out and a class D amp would do wonders over the OEM base audio system (might be good bang for the buck over Reus if you are DIY'er).

I think there are other threads of people comparing a full blown Reus system (speakers & amp) against a custom system. Again, it comes down to $$ and how bad you want that SQ in the car.

Although, I work from home but I went all out with a sound system in my car since that's my zen away from my kid. I typically drive back and forth across the US/Can border every weekend (2 hours each way), so a good sound system was important for me. I don't listen to classical music unless I'm studying for an exam/license/working from my desk.
In my car, I listen to mostly, 90's alternative/rock and old school rap/hip-hop with explicit lyrics since I can't play my kind of music in the house with a 8 year old with precocious ears listening. However, I do use a few classical jazz tracks and Norah Jones to test my car audio system to make sure I'm getting my money's worth. LOL.

Good luck and let us know.

I'm hoping to keep things below $3K...afterall apparently my S is only worth about $6K should the HV battery fail. We have about 136K miles on our car so we do spend a good amount of time driving around (consider both my wife and I have been working from home over the last 8 years). I heard back from Reus and it looks as though they use a proprietary mix of equipment and tune it with their Reus module (assuming an adjustable amp/dsp). I'm tempted to maybe do the install myself and hire a pro for tuning, but I haven't installed a system in over 20 year when I stripped out everything out of a 1997 Nissan Maxima to lay in acoustic mastic and installed 2 amps using a rear strut tower bar as an amp rack (it was the 90s!). I'm reminded how much I hate trying to snake a 4 gauge wire through the firewall and dash.

I guess my next step would be to listen and compare a Reus Tesla with a custom build so perhaps I'll check out a local car meetup before I continue, but first I gotta get my hearing back from an annoying sinus congestion over the last 10 days.