SByer
'08 #383
I don't know - how much of the tooling for steel-body gassers applies? The workforce would definitely be a plus. And it would be cool to keep more of Tesla in the Bay Area.
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tdelta1000
Active Member
tdelta1000
Active Member
Serge,
The older thread is focusing on the politics and the reasoning why the plant should be build in a particular area.
I'm concerned with the final location and the time frame to bring it online. It seems that the longer Tesla waits to finalize the plant location the longer it will take to bring the Model S to come market.
BTW,thanks for the link.
As of Spring '09
The older thread is focusing on the politics and the reasoning why the plant should be build in a particular area.
I'm concerned with the final location and the time frame to bring it online. It seems that the longer Tesla waits to finalize the plant location the longer it will take to bring the Model S to come market.
BTW,thanks for the link.
Actually, things can change...
After getting the Daimler investment and the gov't loans, the fact that Tesla has yet to announce a factory location likely means things are still being worked out. Also the Long Beach Boeing plant deal fell through a couple months ago.
Electric Car Maker’s Shifting Factory Plans a Real Buzz Kill
Los Angeles Business Journal: 6/1/2009
Tesla’s plan for a SoCal electric-car plant seems to have short-circuited.
Reprinted for free here:
Electric car maker's shifting factory plans a real buzz kill: Tesla seems to have passed on location in Long Beach. - Free Online Library
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So who knows... maybe they could use a piece of the NUMMI plant. That would be cool for those of us in the Bay Area. :smile:
Last edited:
tdelta1000
Active Member
Hey Doug,
Thanks for the information. It seems that Tesla is looking for a situation that would best serve its needs but the wait is nerver racking.
Thanks for the information. It seems that Tesla is looking for a situation that would best serve its needs but the wait is nerver racking.
So when do they need to be in a plant to get the Model S in production by mid-2011?
a)If they build a plant from scratch when would groundbreaking need to occur?
b)If using an existing structure but one that would need to be outfitted for a vehicle assembly line when would they need to start outfitting?
c)If using an existing plant already outfitted with a vehicle assembly line when would they need to be in in order to customize it for the Model S?
It would seem to me that the deadline for "a" is getting pretty close. I would think they have maybe another year for "b", and probably wouldn't need to be in "c" until early 2011. But those are pure guesses as I know ZERO about automotive assembly plants.
a)If they build a plant from scratch when would groundbreaking need to occur?
b)If using an existing structure but one that would need to be outfitted for a vehicle assembly line when would they need to start outfitting?
c)If using an existing plant already outfitted with a vehicle assembly line when would they need to be in in order to customize it for the Model S?
It would seem to me that the deadline for "a" is getting pretty close. I would think they have maybe another year for "b", and probably wouldn't need to be in "c" until early 2011. But those are pure guesses as I know ZERO about automotive assembly plants.
I would think that time is extremely short for any of those options. But I thought they were not allowed to do "a" as a condition for the DOE loans.
Really? I really haven't looked at the conditions of the loan so you are probably correct. Makes more sense, financially, to use an existing facility anyway. So maybe they have until the end of the year?
EV_de
Model SP10/XP9 EU ZOE#47
can TM buy the Model S carbody ? like the Roadster from Lotus ?,
or do they have to build it from a sheet of metal ? aluminium ? composit stuff ... ?
If TM need's more then "just" an assembling Line, they are already over the deadline ...
Building a automotive plant from the scratch take at least 3 Years, with a lot of expert knowledge and experience (not shure if TM have that..) ... an automated assembling Line might be done in a Year.
( I have just experiences doing (being just a Part of it, of course) this for Company's like Audi / BMW / DaimlerChrysler, for a StartUp like TM it's a huge challenge and a big chance to fail ... )
I think the best way for TM is the well knowing way they do with the Roadster.
Buying as much they can - painted carbody / Parts a.s.o.
1- Assembling the Model S by hand / partially automated at one Line ... for Startup's and VP's
2- Building a second parallel Line, automated as much as possible..
3- Start building more and more Parts by them selve.
or do they have to build it from a sheet of metal ? aluminium ? composit stuff ... ?
If TM need's more then "just" an assembling Line, they are already over the deadline ...
Building a automotive plant from the scratch take at least 3 Years, with a lot of expert knowledge and experience (not shure if TM have that..) ... an automated assembling Line might be done in a Year.
( I have just experiences doing (being just a Part of it, of course) this for Company's like Audi / BMW / DaimlerChrysler, for a StartUp like TM it's a huge challenge and a big chance to fail ... )
I think the best way for TM is the well knowing way they do with the Roadster.
Buying as much they can - painted carbody / Parts a.s.o.
1- Assembling the Model S by hand / partially automated at one Line ... for Startup's and VP's
2- Building a second parallel Line, automated as much as possible..
3- Start building more and more Parts by them selve.
Then there's still the option of outsourcing production to another plant while they get their own set up. Maybe with Daimler?
Yea, I guess there is that...but I have to believe that Elon wants his own place all under his control and oversite.
I agree that is desirable, but I think time to market is critical now - especially if this is a stepping stone to Bluestar. It could be a good temporary compromise. The rest of the pack is gaining.
I remember a year or two ago Elon mentioned NUMMI (New United Motors, in Fremont, CA) as a possible site.
I have read various stories about Toyota pulling out of NUMMI because the cost of building cars in California is higher than elsewhere. Plus Toyota tries to avoid unions, where possible.
The NUMMI Plant provides Tesla with a unique opportunity to jump to their Blue Star model.
At the NUMMI plant the Pontiac Vibe, a Toyota Matrix with a Pontiac badge, was produced.
If Toyota were willing to allow Tesla to take over the Vibe/Matrix assembly line and place the Tesla battery/drive train technology in it, you could have an under $30K Blue Star ( after $7,500 rebate) with the ability to produce over 100,000 vehicles per year Maybe Toyota would consider just the a drive train contract and sell it as a Toyota brand.
Pure speculation. There are probably too many obstacles unless the Governator gets involved with incentives for Toyota.
I have read various stories about Toyota pulling out of NUMMI because the cost of building cars in California is higher than elsewhere. Plus Toyota tries to avoid unions, where possible.
The NUMMI Plant provides Tesla with a unique opportunity to jump to their Blue Star model.
At the NUMMI plant the Pontiac Vibe, a Toyota Matrix with a Pontiac badge, was produced.
If Toyota were willing to allow Tesla to take over the Vibe/Matrix assembly line and place the Tesla battery/drive train technology in it, you could have an under $30K Blue Star ( after $7,500 rebate) with the ability to produce over 100,000 vehicles per year Maybe Toyota would consider just the a drive train contract and sell it as a Toyota brand.
Pure speculation. There are probably too many obstacles unless the Governator gets involved with incentives for Toyota.
EV_de
Model SP10/XP9 EU ZOE#47
beside the speculations 'IF' and 'HOW' TM gonna make it,
I'am curious about the actual status of the 'WhiteStar' , do someone have heard, seen or read something new?
- VP's ?
- driveable Prototype's ?
I'am curious about the actual status of the 'WhiteStar' , do someone have heard, seen or read something new?
- VP's ?
- driveable Prototype's ?
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