Change to the TM website - Model S - Charging page

[chickensevil]

I did a quick search and didn't see anyone else post this, nor a thread tracking this, so thought I would post it here. If you look over on the TM website for the Model S and the Charging page, they appear to have added a new section.

Looking at archive.org, the change hit sometime between Jan 7 and Jan 16. I like that they are pushing their link to SolarCity a bit more than before, since Tesla owners (prospective buyers) are more likely to be SolarCity customers, so the free cross advertising is a great idea. I would do it, except I live in a townhouse style condo. Which means, while I can get away with modifying my garage with no major issues, getting them to let me install solar panels on my roof??? That is a little much.

(Edited out those extra images for you. Next time use Advanced edit and Manage Attachments. - Mod)

 

[digitaltim]

If your state/market allows it, you can do it with no cash outlay by structuring it as a power purchase agreement (PPA). SolarCity keeps title to solar array and you agree to a fixed priced kWh rate and term.

 

[chickensevil]

If your state/market allows it, you can do it with no cash outlay by structuring it as a power purchase agreement (PPA). SolarCity keeps title to solar array and you agree to a fixed priced kWh rate and term.

Yeah it really is a cool business model where everyone seems to win! Power company gets more power during the day (where it is most needed), SolarCity makes money on the transaction, and you get to have a rather expensive power purchase without any out of pocket cost (it's ONLY going to lower your electricity bill). It's so genius I don't know why someone didn't think of it sooner!

 

[SteveG3]

interesting chicken. this seems tied in to Elon's talk today in Munich. in Germany he explained that Tesla wants as clear and strong a rebuttal to the "long tail pipe" argument as possible. in Germany they are actually going to tie into the leasing program a 250 euro bonus if you switch your electricity to a renewable source. it seems as though in Germany for a higher usage charge you can elect to source the electricity for your home from a renewable source.

so, while they are already working with solar city, we may be seeing the start of Tesla more directly highlighting their response to the "long tailpipe" objection to EVs.

 

[100thMonkey]

... it seems as though in Germany for a higher usage charge you can elect to source the electricity for your home from a renewable source...

I have read that there are some 800 utilities across the US that offer such "green up" programs, where your usage is offset by renewables and the utilities you pay help fund more of them. I highly recommend folks look into this in your respective area, we did this here in WA until we got solar installed and now we are actually thinking of doing both, continuing the $10 a month to help subsidize renewables by the utility.

 

[Mario Kadastik]

In Estonia there are two components by the utility. First one is a renewable energy tax that is applied to EVERY kWh used in the country by everyone. This goes towards a subsidy to build renewable power plants i.e. solar farms, wind turbines etc. That tax is right now 0.87 c / kWh. As an example on the ~1200 kWh that I used last month I paid 10.37€ as this tax.

The second is consumer choice, you can elect to buy only green power, which is at a small premium. For example I'm currently using market price utility package which is the actual market price of electricity (weighed to average consumption) + 0.3 c/kWh. If I wanted green energy it would be +0.2c / kWh extra on top. It's not really much so I am contemplating to swap over to claim that I'm 100% green with no tailpipe at all

 

[Mario Kadastik]

In fact I felt compelled to go greener and went to my utility online system and asked the system to give me a new pricing (I had been on it for a year already). The new price it offered for standard electricity was 24c markup instead of 26c and for the green electricity 42c markup instead of the 26c I have now. Quick math determined that I'd spend ~€2 per month more and that's peanuts. So I confirmed the change and starting from March 1st will be going 100% green (the effective date is always the month after the next). So no tailpipe starting from that date.

To be honest, that's kind of odd ... going from a petrolhead (Evo X with average consumption 13l / 100km of premium fuel) to a 100% green situation. Am even contemplating solar panels, but will probably hold out a bit more to get the prices down further or for the incentives to come back. There used to be a government incentive to install solar panels where the government would subsidize 70%. The applications that came in on the first day filled the allocated budget 2x over I'll have to really time it right when the next round of subsidy for this happens.

Edit: oh and I think Estonia might be relatively green from organizational point of view There's almost no paper trail of anything as in physical paper. Everything is done digitally. All the bills come through e-bill environment directly to your bank and you can make the bank automatically pay them (never again forget a bill). You can sign over utility contracts, phone, anything digitally over online systems with the digital signature being by law equal to your written signature. Doing taxes takes 3 minutes, on your phone, at a bar, drunk. Though that's a recently coined phrase it's not far from truth as I've really done my taxes by just clicking through the pre-filled tax forms online validating that everything is there (even donations you make to the dog shelter show up there) and after confirming I had my excess taxes refunded to me the next day.

Now if we could get past the shale oil burning for electricity, that'd make us a really really green country But being so far north it'll be hard to replace it with something decent. I guess a nuclear plant really is the only option and being a nuclear scientist I consider that to be relatively green too assuming a good plant with proper disposal mechanisms as the total amount of fuel needed is relatively small...

 

[chickensevil]

I guess a nuclear plant really is the only option and being a nuclear scientist I consider that to be relatively green too assuming a good plant with proper disposal mechanisms as the total amount of fuel needed is relatively small...

I have stated my argument on these forums before that I feel like nuclear is the better path. Solar, Wind, and Hydro are all pulling power from the byproducts of our local natural nuclear power source (namely the sun and the core of the earth). But these are not nearly as efficient as they could be if you could tap into the power source directly. Nuclear attempts to do this.

What we need to get away from, is heavy water reactors... which were mostly designed to accomplish one thing... building bombs... and are not efficient at all at making power. But that's just me. Anything that pushes us away from coal, natural gas, and oil is a win in my book because it just isn't sustainable for much longer.

 

[ggies07]

Yeah it really is a cool business model where everyone seems to win! Power company gets more power during the day (where it is most needed), SolarCity makes money on the transaction, and you get to have a rather expensive power purchase without any out of pocket cost (it's ONLY going to lower your electricity bill). It's so genius I don't know why someone didn't think of it sooner!

I totally agree with this, but then there is the long, 25 year contract. My wife is scared of that due to not really knowing if we will live in the house that long, if we sell would the new owners want to keep the panels, and what if one of us loses our job? I'm sure there are other people out there that won't do it because it's too long of a contract, but I get why it is.

 

[SteveG3]

In Estonia there are two components by the utility. First one is a renewable energy tax that is applied to EVERY kWh used in the country by everyone. This goes towards a subsidy to build renewable power plants i.e. solar farms, wind turbines etc. That tax is right now 0.87 c / kWh. As an example on the ~1200 kWh that I used last month I paid 10.37€ as this tax.

The second is consumer choice, you can elect to buy only green power, which is at a small premium. For example I'm currently using market price utility package which is the actual market price of electricity (weighed to average consumption) + 0.3 c/kWh. If I wanted green energy it would be +0.2c / kWh extra on top. It's not really much so I am contemplating to swap over to claim that I'm 100% green with no tailpipe at all

Mario, nice to hear re your new energy sourcing... Elon's talk in Munich has quick and far reaching impact

as to process of paying taxes... wow, you guys have it good!

 

[chickensevil]

I totally agree with this, but then there is the long, 25 year contract. My wife is scared of that due to not really knowing if we will live in the house that long, if we sell would the new owners want to keep the panels, and what if one of us loses our job? I'm sure there are other people out there that won't do it because it's too long of a contract, but I get why it is.

I thought the point of it was that it comes out to being a positive expensive for you (as in you are generally making money on the deal - or at the least lowering your electric bill). Also, very few people stay in their house for 25 years. At least, of all the people I work with and talk to. 10 years at the most. I would think that something like this would also be something they get and deal with all the time. If you own your house, it would not hurt to ask them about these questions and see what they say. Worst case: You stick with what you are doing right now.

edit: especially with you being in TX, that is like, prime sun line for solar.

 

[Lloyd]

interesting chicken. this seems tied in to Elon's talk today in Munich. in Germany he explained that Tesla wants as clear and strong a rebuttal to the "long tail pipe" argument as possible. in Germany they are actually going to tie into the leasing program a 250 euro bonus if you switch your electricity to a renewable source. it seems as though in Germany for a higher usage charge you can elect to source the electricity for your home from a renewable source.

so, while they are already working with solar city, we may be seeing the start of Tesla more directly highlighting their response to the "long tailpipe" objection to EVs.

I make this statement of countering the "long tailpipe argument" with my wife's license frame on the Rav 4. Tesla should make a frame like this once the Solar canopies are being constructed at the Superchargers.