Federal EV coming this budget 2019

[Funkmobile]

That just makes no sense, here some facts from Journal De Montréal about it:

“ The government has not given any details as to the effective date of these rebates, which could mean that they could start in May, June … or later, potentially putting a brake on electric vehicle sales. for several weeks or months as consumers wait before making their purchase. Serious errors. Dealers are likely to see their inventory of electric vehicles pick up dust by then.

I do not know of any hydrogen vehicles available for less than $45,000.

If we do a quick calculation, we can already say that $300 million over three years, we will be limited to about 20,000 electric vehicles per year. Considering that nearly 2 million new vehicles were purchased by Canadians in 2018, we are talking about 1% of sales for the next three years. Canada is targeting 100% zero-emission vehicle sales by 2040, with 10% by 2025 and 30% by 2030 en route. This is called not having the means of its ambitions.

In addition, these targets will be voluntary, that is to say that manufacturers will have no obligation to achieve them. Having already witnessed the total ineffectiveness of the voluntary vehicle emission targets set up by former Environment Minister Stéphane Dion more than 10 years ago, we cannot expect any miracles.

By limiting $5,000 rebates to vehicles under $45,000, the federal government is de facto eliminating all electric vehicles at 300 kilometers of range and over: Hyundai Kona Electric, Kia Niro Electric, Tesla Model 3, Nissan Leaf PLUS etc. In addition, for a potential Bolt EV buyer who is offered a $44,800 + $1,795 transportation and preparation fee + $100 tax for air conditioning, this leads to a total MSRP of $46,695. As the MSRP in Quebec must include, will the Bolt be eligible for the $5,000 rebate in Quebec, while in other provinces, the MSRP includes only the price of the vehicle? Thus, all those who have been reassured by the possibility of obtaining a long-range electric car, but who found them a little expensive are discouraged from switching to 100% electric vehicles. ”

Source: Rabais pour véhicules électriques: un retour raté

Put it another way, if the government was really serious about switching Canadians over to electric vehicles, they wouldn't have purposely excluded the best selling electric vehicle.

 

[Icenick]

Budget 2019: Chapter 2

Keep in mind:
- This not law yet so the actual details aren't written down yet.
- If this is just a limit increase, this just increases amount of CCA you deduct against your business income and half year rule still applies. You can take the whole $55,000 against your business income in the year you purchased your car.

Neat thanks. Ill have to talk to my accountant, I was planning to get a Tesla regardless but at least this will help.

She found that a suitable electric vehicle has a cost of $48,000. With measures announced in this Budget, she could deduct the $48,000 purchase price of the electric vehicle in full in the year she starts using it. This is in addition to the fact that she would be refunded the GST or HST paid.

Not sure how that works but can be pretty significant. I dont know why they don't just refund the taxes paid instead of this "incentive".

 

[Funkmobile]

Neat thanks. Ill have to talk to my accountant, I was planning to get a Tesla regardless but at least this will help.


Not sure how that works but can be pretty significant. I dont know why they don't just refund the taxes paid instead of this "incentive".

Sorry i made a typo and it should read: you CAN'T take the whole $55,000 deduction in the year of purchase.

 

[Buggle]

Ok, I'm gonna say it.

This policy really fuccking sucks. It really does. I'm as Liberal as they come, but what the hell.. this is a do nothing pure optics policy. Damn. And I thought Trudeau actually had ideals.

 

[dj_gon]

Sorry i made a typo and it should read: you CAN'T take the whole $55,000 deduction in the year of purchase.

If I'm reading the budget correctly, you CAN take 100% of CCA in the first year but so what? Say you're self-employed, you can't claim more than 70% of vehicle expenditure under business anyways without risking an audit. It doesn't matter, we are not gaining anything but merely being able to get all the CCA in the 1st year given that you have that much revenue.

We can claim all the HST in cars anyways under the business unless you are using the quick method which doesn't matter since there is a fixed amount of HST being paid back.

In conclusion, the EV incentive the Liberals is offering is simply pathetic, but I kind of know where they are coming from. They don't want to fall so hard like the Ontario Liberals did last year.

 

[Funkmobile]

If I'm reading the budget correctly, you CAN take 100% of CCA in the first year but so what? Say you're self-employed, you can't claim more than 70% of vehicle expenditure under business anyways without risking an audit. It doesn't matter, we are not gaining anything but merely being able to get all the CCA in the 1st year given that you have that much revenue.

We can claim all the HST in cars anyways under the business unless you are using the quick method which doesn't matter since there is a fixed amount of HST being paid back.

In conclusion, the EV incentive the Liberals is offering is simply pathetic, but I kind of know where they are coming from. They don't want to fall so hard like the Ontario Liberals did last year.

The exact wording is:

Immediate expensing will apply to eligible vehicles purchased on or after March 19, 2019 and before January 1, 2024. Capital costs for eligible zero-emission passenger vehicles will be deductible up to a limit of $55,000 plus sales tax. This is higher than the capital cost limit of $30,000 plus sales tax that currently applies to passenger vehicles. This new $55,000 capital cost limit reflects the comparably higher cost of zero-emission vehicles and will be reviewed annually to ensure that it remains appropriate as market prices evolve over time.

So what the minister is referring to here is CCA Class 10 which traditionally has a limit of $30,000 that can capitalized and be eligible for CCA deduction. So if you bought a Ferrari for a "company car" for $500K, you can only declare $30,000 of that cost to be a capital asset. (and technically the Ferrari would go into a special CCA Class 10.1 because the total cost of the car is greater than $30,000) .

You also get a GST/HST rebate on the cost of the car up to $30,000 which is part of your normal GST/HST filed return.

With CCA Class 10/10.1, the half year rule applies, which means in the 1st year of purchase of the car, you can only take a half deduction of the normal rate. For CCA Class 10/10.1 the normal rate is 30%. So if you bought your Model 3 in 2019, you can only claim a 15% CCA deduction for 2019 tax year regardless if you bought it on January 1, 2019 or December 31, 2019.

Now the budget proposes that the limits be raised on EV's from $30,000 to $55,000 which means a P100D would be capitalized at $55,000 and you would also get a GST/HST rebate up to the cost of $55,000.

I also suspect they will create a new special CCA class called 10.2.

 

[pcons]

I'm actually interested in finding out more about the workplace charging part of this announcement. With the previous program the government refunded something like 80% of the cost to install workplace charging, but then the program was scrapped before my workplace had a chance to put it in budget for this year. Actually, we were flat out denied chargers (we did ask), but I think if there was an incentive for installing them there's a chance we would put them in.

Not that I need them personally since the model 3 range is huge, but having chargers at work does incentivise others to adopt EVs. It happened at my workplace before this one. We had 4 stationss and within a year there were 3 EVs in addition to me there.

At my current workplace some folks are interested in EVs, but wary of the price so I've recommended looking at a used leaf for example. But then the range is too low for some of them. Having workplace charging effectively doubles the range of your EV during the week. It just makes sense.

 

[duanra]

By limiting the money to cars with less range, they are actually privileging the households with more than 1 car. One car for commuting and the other for road tripping. So in fact it might help people with more money...

 

[Icenick]

The exact wording is:



So what the minister is referring to here is CCA Class 10 which traditionally has a limit of $30,000 that can capitalized and be eligible for CCA deduction. So if you bought a Ferrari for a "company car" for $500K, you can only declare $30,000 of that cost to be a capital asset. (and technically the Ferrari would go into a special CCA Class 10.1 because the total cost of the car is greater than $30,000) .

You also get a GST/HST rebate on the cost of the car up to $30,000 which is part of your normal GST/HST filed return.

With CCA Class 10/10.1, the half year rule applies, which means in the 1st year of purchase of the car, you can only take a half deduction of the normal rate. For CCA Class 10/10.1 the normal rate is 30%. So if you bought your Model 3 in 2019, you can only claim a 15% CCA deduction for 2019 tax year regardless if you bought it on January 1, 2019 or December 31, 2019.

Now the budget proposes that the limits be raised on EV's from $30,000 to $55,000 which means a P100D would be capitalized at $55,000 and you would also get a GST/HST rebate up to the cost of $55,000.

I also suspect they will create a new special CCA class called 10.2.

Forgive my ignorance I'm no expert on this but I still feel this is somewhat significant not a game changer by any means but...
I live in Quebec were we pay more taxes but at 15%:
30,000 > 4,500$
55,000 > 8,250$
I use my car for between 75-80% business and what I do is I depreciate the CCA by 30% per year. This translates into a few thousand dollars back when it comes to taxes.
Overall I do agree this plan is a joke seems bought and paid for but it's the Liberals I didn't expect much from the trudeau government. Hopefully this opens a door and come election time EV incentives will be more of a campaign promise.

 

[RiverBrick]

Put it another way, if the government was really serious about switching Canadians over to electric vehicles, they wouldn't have purposely excluded the best selling electric vehicle.

You hit the nail on the head. They only want to protect the two things :

1) Canadian manufacturers like Ford, Toyota, Honda, Chrysler and GM.
2) Canadian dealer lobbies.

Any sensible plan to increase adoption of EVs would mean Tesla sales eating even more into the interests of the above groups, so they came up with this half-baked plan. Behind closed doors, they are patting themselves on the back for having excluded Tesla.

 

[duanra]

It also looks good meanwhile not spending to much money...

 

[5_+JqckQttqck]

Politics over actual climate action once again. However, it's still a rebate to move urbanites towards EVs which is good - most of the pollution in our cities occur at rush hour idling and cars inching along.

A small step is a step, even if it's targeted to exclude the most popular EV maker. I'm sure Elon will drop the MSRP with a SR-TTS = The Treudeau Special.

 

[dj_gon]

Politics over actual climate action once again. However, it's still a rebate to move urbanites towards EVs which is good - most of the pollution in our cities occur at rush hour idling and cars inching along.

A small step is a step, even if it's targeted to exclude the most popular EV maker. I'm sure Elon will drop the MSRP with a SR-TTS = The Treudeau Special.

He has to - knowing that he needs almost a miracle to win this election with his recent scandals, demonized carbon tax, and the emerging far-right movement. Sigh...

 

[Applemann01]

It also looks good meanwhile not spending to much money...

Yup I can understand putting a cap on it for appearance sake but 45K.... This is all about optics

 

[S'toon]

I think we complain by voting NDP? As much as I think the NDP are more or less a bunch of pansies, this move by the Liberals really is offputting.

The thing is, the image of the NDP is of a bunch of pie in the sky socialists. The thing is, that hasn't been true in decades. The NDP is a not a left wing party. It's a party with different wings. The Tony Blair "Third Way" Margaret Thatcher Lite wing has been in the party since the early '90s. They've moved so far right that the last federal election they ran as the second-most right wing party in modern Canadian history.

 

[Buggle]

The thing is, the image of the NDP is of a bunch of pie in the sky socialists. The thing is, that hasn't been true in decades. The NDP is a not a left wing party. It's a party with different wings. The Tony Blair "Third Way" Margaret Thatcher Lite wing has been in the party since the early '90s. They've moved so far right that the last federal election they ran as the second-most right wing party in modern Canadian history.

Well I don't know if I'd go that far. I'd say it was more that the Liberals moved to the left and the two became indistinguishable. The thing about the NDP is they've always been the part of "other". What that means really depends on where you are. In Toronto it's women's rights and progressive social policies. In Northern Ontario & Manitoba it's unions and Native issues advocacy. In Quebec it's the federalist party that's in tune with Quebecois values, in BC it's the environmental and labour party. Oh and in Alberta they don't exist outside Edmonton. So I'd agree with you generally, it's far from a cohesive party, but not so much your final conclusion.

 

[S'toon]

Well I don't know if I'd go that far. I'd say it was more that the Liberals moved to the left and the two became indistinguishable. The thing about the NDP is they've always been the part of "other". What that means really depends on where you are. In Toronto it's women's rights and progressive social policies. In Northern Ontario & Manitoba it's unions and Native issues advocacy. In Quebec it's the federalist party that's in tune with Quebecois values, in BC it's the environmental and labour party. Oh and in Alberta they don't exist outside Edmonton. So I'd agree with you generally, it's far from a cohesive party, but not so much your final conclusion.

The last election the NDP ran on:
Cutting taxes to business to reward "job creators." Job creators is RW code for rich people.
Building more oil refineries, something even Harper didn't espouse.
Abandoned the tradition solve crime by solving the root causes, and instead espoused hiring more cops.
Buying the F-35s.
Giving subsidies to aerospace, automotive, forestry and mining sectors
The same rhetoric on how young people are in gangs and we need to crack down on them.

 

[phigment]

Sigh... So the Canadian EV incentive is cut off at 45k. Except for some cars: Pacifica Hybrid now qualifies for federal rebate program — minister

We recognize as a government, we want Canadians to have access to Canadian vehicles, clean vehicles at affordable prices

 

[BigD0g]

Holy off topic folks, maybe create a separate thread”

 

[RiverBrick]

Sigh... So the Canadian EV incentive is cut off at 45k. Except for some cars:

So, the intent of the program is to buy votes in Windsor and indirectly grant more money to Chrysler. Nothing to do with the environment.