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HW2.0 to 3.0 upgrade - are Tesla in big legal & financial trouble?

Discussion in 'Model X' started by Nuclear Fusion, Feb 21, 2020.

  1. gangzoom

    gangzoom Member

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    Tesla are working on something go and follow Green's Twitter account.

    Right now HW 2/2.5/3 all do the same thing, and none are remotely close to FSD.

    AP on our car stopped working last week during some really bad storms, at exactly the time when I could have done with some help not getting fatigued on a long drive.

    Currently FSD features are like a chocolate tea pot, useless regardless of which AP HW version you have.
     
  2. cwerdna

    cwerdna Active Member

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    Yep. There are numerous places with horizontal traffic lights and some with weird stuff like double left red arrows:.
    Google Maps

    https://streets.mn/2015/07/24/traffic-signals-abroad/ has some unusual traffic lights like 5 in vertical row + some other examples from outside the US.

    https://www.japantimes.co.jp/life/2013/02/25/language/the-japanese-traffic-light-blues-stop-on-red-go-on-what/ shows how Japanese traffic lights have red on the right and green/blue on the left. But, they also drive on the left side of the road.
     
  3. Nuclear Fusion

    Nuclear Fusion Active Member

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    Cheers for the facts. It’s why I said “for starters”
     
  4. jbcarioca

    jbcarioca Active Member

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    I had the identical experience. I did physically go to the SC to confirm. Mine is scheduled for the 25th. The SC told me that the instrument panel had to. E removed to make the Model 3 upgrade.
     
  5. mxnym

    mxnym Member

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    This is correct, but early HW2.5 didn't come out until mid 2017, so the real question is did his friend get upgraded from 2.0 to 3.0 (which seems even more unlikely than a 2.5 to 3.0 upgrade that, AFAIK, we're not sure are happening yet), or does his friend actually have MCU2 and simply not understand how to enable recording to begin with?
     
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  6. trekkie

    trekkie Supporting Member

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    Except, they won't. By design, and by law, the lights are in mandated positions. You can not put a red light at the bottom in the US for example...

    We've had color blind people for a lot longer than color blind cameras, and laws were put in place to determine the position of the light. So all the FSD needs to know is 'top light red' regardless of what it sees color wise.
     
  7. M3BlueGeorgia

    M3BlueGeorgia Active Member

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    Better example: You are approaching a junction with a flashing light. If red, you have to stop before proceeding. If orange, you have right of way, but proceed with care.
     
    • Like x 1
  8. mxnym

    mxnym Member

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    If red, there should be a stop line on the pavement and most often there is even a stop sign. Also, AFAIK, the HW2.0 cameras aren't actually black and white, they are 2 color, allowing them to differentiate between traffic light colors, making the whole argument moot.
     
  9. webfootguy

    webfootguy Member

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  10. S4WRXTTCS

    S4WRXTTCS Active Member

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    "It is said that the residents successfully persuaded the installation of an upside down stoplight."

    This is pretty much why we any self-driving car needs to be geofenced. There is always the chance that some community decided to do something weird or non-standard.
     
    • Disagree x 1
  11. mxnym

    mxnym Member

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    No, self driving cars don't need to be geofenced. Standards need to be followed. Who gets sued the first time someone dies when a colorblind person blows that light?

    ETA: Not to mention this:
    Nor to mention the fact that 2.5+ CAN see color and 2.0 cameras MAY be upgraded regardless.
     
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  12. Yinn

    Yinn Active Member

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    @mxnym hit it right on the head. Either there's a misunderstanding somewhere, or your friend has a rare AP2.0/MCU1 to AP3.0 upgrade that we all understand to be impossible at this point in time. We'd love to get more info on it.
     
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  13. S4WRXTTCS

    S4WRXTTCS Active Member

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    I completely agree that standards should be followed, and that we should go through a process of harmonizing our road rules across all 50 states.

    But, what are you going to do while that's taking place? It's not just stop lights, but there are all sorts of crazy things. Like ridiculous signage or extremely ambiguous roads.

    What could help accelerate improve the infrastructure?

    Geofencing.

    Sure I know that's not the holy grail of L5, but I think we need to be a bit more realistic and focus on L4.

    L4 by definition is geofenced.
     
  14. brkaus

    brkaus Well-Known Member

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    You will be wasting everyones time. There is no upgrade for the AP2.0 cars yet.
     
  15. brkaus

    brkaus Well-Known Member

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    Turn and ask wife.

    But seriously, I have never seen a flashing red light that was not either - above a stop sign OR in a standard traffic light that can be identified by position.
     
  16. M3BlueGeorgia

    M3BlueGeorgia Active Member

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    Outside a fire station, for one.

    Yes normally above stop signs

    But also a fallback on traffic lights with a system failure.
     
  17. Nuclear Fusion

    Nuclear Fusion Active Member

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  18. M3BlueGeorgia

    M3BlueGeorgia Active Member

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    An interesting upgrade option.

    Any other automobile company out there allowing people with 6 year old vehicles to swap it's old main computer for a current one?

    It appears that even AP1 vehicles can get MCU2.
     
  19. dgatwood

    dgatwood Member

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    Position doesn't matter anyway.

    Red channel == Grey channel : Light is red
    Red channel < grey channel : Light is yellow
    Red channel nearly black, grey channel lit: Light is green or blue

    So as long as the stop and yield lights are red and yellow, you're fine.
     
    • Informative x 1
  20. cwerdna

    cwerdna Active Member

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    #40 cwerdna, Mar 3, 2020
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2020
    Besides some of the boundary cases of traffic lights already mentioned there are others like:
    - traffic light totally out due to malfunction or power outage (so treat like a stop sign/4 way stop) vs.
    - traffic light covered up (not operational yet)
    - weird pedestrian signals like https://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/article/Santa-Clara-County-new-pedestrian-traffic-light-11240773.php - Yes, I've seen these and their normal state is no lights lit.
    - https://mocktheorytest.com/resources/traffic-lights-uk/ has slight differences from the US (if correct)
    - I'd heard of Traffic lights: why yellow before green? in the UK.
    - And, in the US we don't have flashing green lights but they do in Canada, with different at least two different meanings depending on the province: Why B.C.'s flashing green lights don't mean the same thing as those in Ontario.
    I have driven in BC a bunch of times but never in the other provinces. Flashing green to an American not knowing the above means nothing. Busted traffic light?

    I was told about both definitions by a Canadian when he asked another American about flashing green. This was LONG ago, likely before Google was even founded, which was back in 1998. The other American and myself didn't know. Other American guessed "busted traffic light?"

    Hopefully someone can chime in on current traffic light status in the UK.
     

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