Minimum compliant mirror

[TjckTock]

I was wondering if Tesla is unable to get the laws changed, what would the minimum compliant mirror be? Does it actually have to be useful or can it be a token mirror for compliance? Can it be inside the cabin looking back through the driver window? Can it be 1" square?

CA - Section 26709: "
) Every motor vehicle registered in a foreign jurisdiction and every motorcycle subject to registration in this state shall be equipped with a mirror so located as to reflect to the driver a view of the highway for a distance of at least 200 feet to the rear of such vehicle.

Every motor vehicle subject to registration in this state, except a motorcycle, shall be equipped with not less than two such mirrors, including one affixed to the left-hand side.
"

 

[AC-2-DC]

Adding these would work. They are small and meet all the requirements.
https://www.amazon.com/Ampper-Blind-Mirror-Frameless-Convex/dp/B01CV4ANCC

 

[mongo]

I was wondering if Tesla is unable to get the laws changed, what would the minimum compliant mirror be? Does it actually have to be useful or can it be a token mirror for compliance? Can it be inside the cabin looking back through the driver window? Can it be 1" square?

CA - Section 26709: "
) Every motor vehicle registered in a foreign jurisdiction and every motorcycle subject to registration in this state shall be equipped with a mirror so located as to reflect to the driver a view of the highway for a distance of at least 200 feet to the rear of such vehicle.

Every motor vehicle subject to registration in this state, except a motorcycle, shall be equipped with not less than two such mirrors, including one affixed to the left-hand side.
"

FMVSS 111 is what you are looking for:
Regulations: 49 CFR § 571.111 - Standard No. 111; Rear visibility.
Testing:https://www.nhtsa.gov/sites/nhtsa.dot.gov/files/documents/tp-111-v-01-final.pdf

 

[TjckTock]

Thanks @mongo after scanning those sources, I already see a few issues with the mirror inside the cabin (Ex: must see down the plane tangent with the widest point of the car). So doesn't look like we can cheese our way out of it.

 

[mongo]

Thanks @mongo after scanning those sources, I already see a few issues with the mirror inside the cabin (Ex: must see down the plane tangent with the widest point of the car). So doesn't look like we can cheese our way out of it.

Yeah, esp with closed vault it needs dual mirrors. Last time I read through it I wondered if the mirrors could auto fold in drive.

 

[MichaelP90DL]

Hmmm. Let's see. Fold-out mirrors that pop into position instantly. Camera inside the car that tracks eye and head motion. When the computer thinks you're gonna look at an outside mirror, they suddenly flip out. And as soon as you look away, they flip back in. Problem solved. Notify EMusk.

 

[mongo]

Hmmm. Let's see. Fold-out mirrors that pop into position instantly. Camera inside the car that tracks eye and head motion. When the computer thinks you're gonna look at an outside mirror, they suddenly flip out. And as soon as you look away, they flip back in. Problem solved. Notify EMusk.

The mirrors are there for rear visibility when backing up, not changing lanes.
From the test document:

Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standard (FMVSS) No. 111 establishes requirements for rear visibility devices and systems which includes requirements for rearview mirrors and a rearview image. The purpose of the rearview mirrors is to reduce the number of deaths and injuries that occur when the driver of a motor vehicle does not have a clear and reasonably unobstructed view to the rear. The purpose of a rearview image is to improve a driver’s ability to see areas to the rear of a motor vehicle in order to mitigate fatalities and injuries associated with back-over incidents.

Just like OEMs sell cars with manual foldable side mirrors and no software interlock, Tesla could make their power mirror autofold when moving forward.

 

[MichaelP90DL]

The mirrors are there for rear visibility when backing up, not changing lanes.

Did I say they are exclusively for lane changing?

 

[mongo]

Did I say they are exclusively for lane changing?

No, I just don't follow your point.
The eye position tracking does not make sense to me unless you were referring to lane changing. In which case, the regulation is not in play, so why toggle them, given Tesla has cameras available?
Areodynamic drag isn't a concern when stopped or reversing so no point in doing it there either.

 

[Cyber_Dav]

No, I just don't follow your point.
The eye position tracking does not make sense to me unless you were referring to lane changing. In which case, the regulation is not in play, so why toggle them, given Tesla has cameras available?
Areodynamic drag isn't a concern when stopped or reversing so no point in doing it there either.

You are missing that "and" in the regulations explanation. They think the mirrors are for lane changing AND prevention of backover accidents.

Which has nothing to do with his idea of eye movement activated mirrors. No matter WHY you were looking at the mirrors, they would be there.

Not feasible at this time, probably said mostly in jest, but come on!

 

[mongo]

You are missing that "and" in the regulations explanation. They think the mirrors are for lane changing AND prevention of backover accidents.

Which has nothing to do with his idea of eye movement activated mirrors. No matter WHY you were looking at the mirrors, they would be there.

Not feasible at this time, probably said mostly in jest, but come on!

What 'and'? I can't find 'lane' or 'chang*' in either document.
I wasn't sure if they were seriously razzing my idea or just joking originally, so I was explaining that eye tracking was not needed. It is feasible to retract mirrors above 10 MPH and go pure canera or pop then out via turn signal stalk (could add a quick tap for extend without signalling).