...what is the point of this?
The point is that today != tomorrow. Today, onboard PVs will only produce a few percent of an EV's consumption. Tomorrow will that number could be 20-30% or more.
I encourage you to read the discussion upthread.
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...what is the point of this?
The point is that today != tomorrow. Today, onboard PVs will only produce a few percent of an EV's consumption. Tomorrow will that number could be 20-30% or more.
I encourage you to read the discussion upthread.
That point is a little off topic from what I was saying.
You're forgetting, he's a great marketer too. And like other options on Tesla's and other cars that aren't at all necessary (0-60 in 2.3 seconds anyone?) They are there because they sell cars and increase profit margins, not because they make any sort of mathematical or economic sense.
Some people who aren't remotely as solar savvy as you are going to think:
1) Car runs on electricy
2) Car generates its own electricity with solar roof
3) "Free" fuel? Count me in!
Maybe his genius extends further than you think?
(Most marketing, at the end of the day, is just malarkey in one form or another.)
That is a possible reason for such a feature, but when you consider the engineering resources that have to be spent creating that feature and implementing it into the vehicle and balance that with the potential number of customers who would be willing to pay very likely thousands of dollars for that feature as an option, I doubt there is a rational basis for Tesla to do it.
If that is the reason for offering a solar roof option, basically Tesla is saying "EVs have this weakness that they drain the 12V battery faster than ICE vehicles so we are providing this expensive option for those who will leave their EV unplugged for many weeks at a time, something that we firmly advise not doing".
I think the potential market size for such an option would be minuscule. The fact that Fisker did supports my reasoning. Fisker did a lot of dumb stuff.
the increasing performance solar roofs will cross with decreasing price of solar roofs, at which point a significant portion of all our vehicles' energy consumption will be from self-production.
Nope. Current PV runs about 15% efficient
Anyone want a 24 mile range EV?
Put those panels on your house, or in a community solar farm.
Tomorrow will that number could be 20-30% or more.
As noted many times, not everyone has a house onto which they can put panels.
Can't have it both ways.
Interesting, so it can seems like you have a conflict of interest that should disqualify you from this debate?I calculate whether people should get home based or community based solar, for a living.
If they offered it as an option, I'm guessing they would do it for the same reason they hired Jeff Dahn, which is to improve their products.There isn't a problem with current MS and MX's. The batteries are obviously staying cool somehow. Sooooo..... why would this be an issue with the M3? So....if Tesla mistakenly makes this an option with the M3.....then the non-optioned M3's batteries will heat up? Really?
If Tesla's BMS is as optimized as can be, then yeah, it's a red herring. The same applies to range, acceleration, energy efficiency, and so on. With that said, my guess is that there's still room for improvement in battery reliability/durability, and Tesla will continue to improve that just like they continue to improve everything else. They may decide against it or for it based on all sorts of things, but I doubt it's a red herring.For me that's a red herring.
Thermal management requires energy. If it were important to battery longevity, that energy would come from the battery itself. (As it does already, to a degree).
A solar roof trade is all about total consumption vs total production. How that energy is consumed is somewhat irrelevant--battery management, cabin HVAC, vehicle range...at the end of the day (month, year) it's all the same thing. Calling it 'battery thermal management' or 'countering vampire drain' distracts from the point, which is that at some point the increasing performance solar roofs will cross with decreasing price of solar roofs, at which point a significant portion of all our vehicles' energy consumption will be from self-production.
Edit: And the post below proves the point. Opponents of solar roofs will use any argument possible to distract from the fact that it really is a simple consumption vs production vs cost trade.
Where do you propose to get a tenfold increase in efficiency?
Interesting, so it can seems like you have a conflict of interest that should disqualify you from this debate?
...my guess is that there's still room for improvement in battery reliability/durability, and Tesla will continue to improve that just like they continue to improve everything else.
Maybe so, and I agree that it substantiates that he could be knowledgeable on the subject, but at least I does now see his post in a different light then before knowing that he has an potential conflict of interest here. But yes, "disqualify" was perhaps to strong a word here.Nah. If anything it makes Topher's input more valid.
ah... the confusion is myfault.... I mistyped my post... I'll fix it... (*Note the last line)The point is that today != tomorrow. Today, onboard PVs will only produce a few percent of an EV's consumption. Tomorrow will that number could be 20-30% or more.
I encourage you to read the discussion upthread.
The point is still valid - put the panels either directly, or buy an investment in solar, and let them put them in a place with the proper angle to allow for maximum efficiency rather than on the roof of a car, which includes many efficiency losses and further complicates the vehicle. I'm not saying there won't be a point where it will make sense and add to flexibility, but I don't think the time is now or in the near future. (Near referring to the next 5 years)As noted many times, not everyone has a house onto which they can put panels.