Hello TMC HK group. This is my first post. I am very close to placing an order for my MS 60 but wanted to find out whether it is adequate for Hong Kong. We live in Repulse Bay and mainly use the MS for the weekend and maybe 2 or 3 times per week driving into CWB. Based on what I see on this forum, I don't see many S60 owners so I am wondering if I am missing a certain angle that should be considered regarding the MS60. However, I do understand that usage is a very individual equation but would appreciate any advice given.
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Welcome to TMC, vuskie,
There are a variety of opinions on the subject of "how much is enough". I lived in HK some years ago. We're I there I would probably choose a 60 kWh unless I planned to make long trips from time to time. The big question in HK is access to home charging, from all I understand. If you have access to home charging you'll probably have no issues. If for some reason you find you actually want more range you can simply buy the software upgrade to 75 kWh (assuming you're buying a new one.
Please don't minimise the need for home charging in HK. Public options are available but are really a pain, according to what I hear.
Other people will have direct knowledge of living with MS in HK. Still, I'm confident you'll have no problem given your driving plans.
There are a variety of opinions on the subject of "how much is enough". I lived in HK some years ago. We're I there I would probably choose a 60 kWh unless I planned to make long trips from time to time. The big question in HK is access to home charging, from all I understand. If you have access to home charging you'll probably have no issues. If for some reason you find you actually want more range you can simply buy the software upgrade to 75 kWh (assuming you're buying a new one.
Please don't minimise the need for home charging in HK. Public options are available but are really a pain, according to what I hear.
Other people will have direct knowledge of living with MS in HK. Still, I'm confident you'll have no problem given your driving plans.
vuskie,
I have not even visited Hong Kong, but I do enjoy keeping up with all of the HK EV activity here at TMC. HK seems to be a hot spot for EVs, with lots of Teslas sold there, and Tesla working with the HK government to "make HK the leading example in the world of how to provide charging for appartment and condo building dwellers."
Do you have a private parking spot at your residence, where it is possible to add a home charging station? If so, then the S60 is more likely to easily meet your driving needs.
If you are going to rely public charging and superchargers, perhaps the larger battery would be more convenient.
Good Luck with your decision.
GSP
I have not even visited Hong Kong, but I do enjoy keeping up with all of the HK EV activity here at TMC. HK seems to be a hot spot for EVs, with lots of Teslas sold there, and Tesla working with the HK government to "make HK the leading example in the world of how to provide charging for appartment and condo building dwellers."
Do you have a private parking spot at your residence, where it is possible to add a home charging station? If so, then the S60 is more likely to easily meet your driving needs.
If you are going to rely public charging and superchargers, perhaps the larger battery would be more convenient.
Good Luck with your decision.
GSP
Thank you all for your advice. I believe the home charging option would be the best option but its usually available if you are in a house/townhouse situation. I will check again to see if it's available for where I am planning to live (we are transitioning back to Hong Kong from Germany). Many thanks for the advice.
As others have said, availability of home charging will be of high importance to you. If you can get some sort of home charging arranged (anything that's capable of charging 25km of range or more per hour), then a MS60 will definitely do you fine.
I would add that:
1. The newer MS60 has a 75 battery, if you ever needs the extra, you can just pay to unlock
2. Instead of charging to 90% for long term battery care, 75kwh x 90% capacity = 67.5. This means you can just charge your 60kwh to 100% on a daily basis and not incur issues with your battery. If I didn't already have the 70D now I'd definite have gone for that.
3. In terms of distance, Hong Kong is tiny. Going from repulse bay to tin shui wai (very South East to very north west of the entire Hong Kong) is 50km. Your 60 has 350km of range and no range extending charge is needed at all
If you cannot get home charging, however, you'll be using supercharger etc like an inferior petrol station. It's still viable since many currently are stuck with that arrangement. In which case a bigger battery would be a big quality of life improvement.
The AWD version adds a tiny bit of range too, but the budget is better spent on battery size, I reckon.
I would add that:
1. The newer MS60 has a 75 battery, if you ever needs the extra, you can just pay to unlock
2. Instead of charging to 90% for long term battery care, 75kwh x 90% capacity = 67.5. This means you can just charge your 60kwh to 100% on a daily basis and not incur issues with your battery. If I didn't already have the 70D now I'd definite have gone for that.
3. In terms of distance, Hong Kong is tiny. Going from repulse bay to tin shui wai (very South East to very north west of the entire Hong Kong) is 50km. Your 60 has 350km of range and no range extending charge is needed at all
If you cannot get home charging, however, you'll be using supercharger etc like an inferior petrol station. It's still viable since many currently are stuck with that arrangement. In which case a bigger battery would be a big quality of life improvement.
The AWD version adds a tiny bit of range too, but the budget is better spent on battery size, I reckon.
I have a 70D and I would have got a 60 if that option was available at that time. I don't have home charging and live in repulse bay too. I use the supercharger at the pulse sometimes on weekends and I can usually get a charging parking space at star ferry car park or Citibank on way to work. Free charging too so I absolutely have no intention of installing home charger right now. Only need to charge once or twice a week really.
Battery size is not so important IF you have home charging. Apparently, you have not made a choice of the possible residence, do ask the estate agent to enquire the possibility of installing EV charger before you make a real estate commitment.
I am driving a 70D and have charging facilities in my office, so 60Kwhr would have been already good if I had the choice at that time of order.
If you are a light mileage user, even a properly installed 13A socket will be good enough. A 13A socket will give you 10km per hour charging rate. An overnight charging will probably give you 80-90km and is good enough for daily use.
If you usually get into work before 830 I'm almost guaranteed a fast charging spot (32km/h) at either star ferry or city hall car park. If I miss a spot, it's no dramas as I only need to charge it once or twice during weekdays. For weekends as I take the kids around I will do a charge either on the Friday at work or supercharge at the pulse on Sat morning or even at Lee Gardens on Sun morning. No real wait time at the pulse - just need to avoid the afternoon traffic to the beach. You can even call up the pulse before you get there to see how many spots are free. Absolutely no need for home charging for me as the pulse is v near me.
I am driving a S60 RWD. Back then there was no AWD and P85 was already top of the class
Charging to 90% gives around 276 km of range. You won't use up that amount in Hong Kong in a single day (unless you are working with Uber)
As you may have read from somewhere else on this forum, you don't want the charge to go below 30% (to "protect" the battery and help it "lives" longer), 30% charged is around 90 km
So if you don't have home charger like me, you have a total of 184 km range in between each charge (of course you can drive all the way and charge at 0%, that gives you 276 km). Mind you the current S60 is in fact a S75 with software limited to 60 kWh, so the 90% charged range may be a bit more than 276 km in the "new" S60
I talked to a Tesla staff before, he told me AWD is more efficient in places where you don't have to stop often. In Hong Kong, we are driving in stop-and-go traffic for "long" enough period every day, so he believes RWD is more efficient (gives more real life range for same amount of energy) and also cheaper
Few questions to answer before placing your order:
In fact destination charger (Tesla Wall Connector) and IEC 62196 are getting more common in hotels and shopping malls in HK, I manage to charge only once or not at all at supercharger nowadays by using these.
Superchargers are nice, cutting edge technology, but technology can't beat selfishness, there are more than enough Tesla owners parking their cars at supercharger slots in Hong Kong (staying for more than 2 hours). Although you will have to rely on supercharger, you should also plan something else (no matter you will be driving S60 or 90D)
Charging to 90% gives around 276 km of range. You won't use up that amount in Hong Kong in a single day (unless you are working with Uber)
As you may have read from somewhere else on this forum, you don't want the charge to go below 30% (to "protect" the battery and help it "lives" longer), 30% charged is around 90 km
So if you don't have home charger like me, you have a total of 184 km range in between each charge (of course you can drive all the way and charge at 0%, that gives you 276 km). Mind you the current S60 is in fact a S75 with software limited to 60 kWh, so the 90% charged range may be a bit more than 276 km in the "new" S60
I talked to a Tesla staff before, he told me AWD is more efficient in places where you don't have to stop often. In Hong Kong, we are driving in stop-and-go traffic for "long" enough period every day, so he believes RWD is more efficient (gives more real life range for same amount of energy) and also cheaper
Few questions to answer before placing your order:
- Do you have home charger? [No I assume]
- How many km you do per day? [I drive 120 km max during weekends, and with a S60, I don't have to charge more than twice per week]
- Do you feel comfortable waiting at supercharger or do you have chance to use other slower type charger (i.e. availability close to your home or office)? [If no, get a 90D. An owner told me he has around 400 km at 90% charged]
In fact destination charger (Tesla Wall Connector) and IEC 62196 are getting more common in hotels and shopping malls in HK, I manage to charge only once or not at all at supercharger nowadays by using these.
Superchargers are nice, cutting edge technology, but technology can't beat selfishness, there are more than enough Tesla owners parking their cars at supercharger slots in Hong Kong (staying for more than 2 hours). Although you will have to rely on supercharger, you should also plan something else (no matter you will be driving S60 or 90D)
Answer to all this is "depends". However, I think for 60kwh, I would probably suggest making sure you can charge at home.
Other thing is, if the 60kwh model is basically using a 70kwh battery, you could probably charge it to 100% which would mean that its range would not be too different to what a 70kwh battery would have charged at 90%.
Other thing is, if the 60kwh model is basically using a 70kwh battery, you could probably charge it to 100% which would mean that its range would not be too different to what a 70kwh battery would have charged at 90%.
The new S60 is a software limited S75. And the sharing from privater (post #22): Some exciting observations about the new Model S60 (software limited 75 kWh)
It appears they are using the whole 75 kWh as shown by the lack of tapering. 60/75 = 80%
This is capture from stage 2 final moment:
It's 98% charge, but still
Actual charging power 101a x 354v = 35.7 wh
Now let's think a little bit about the result:
The new S 60 charging speed doesn't dampen much around 80% mark, and still have high speed even with last 20% capacity.
The only reason it can do that, is because it's a 75 kWh battery in supercharger eye, when approaching software limited 60kWh mark, Supercharger still sees it as a 80% charge state of 75 kWh battery. So no huge charge speed penalty.
It appears they are using the whole 75 kWh as shown by the lack of tapering. 60/75 = 80%
Someone really needs to measure this. We need cell voltage at 0% and 100% SOC for 60kWh and 75kWh packs to tell us what Tesla are doing. Theoretically, they could slide the 60kWh range to the bottom (protect high SOC), top (protect low SOC), or middle (protect both, less). But without actual measured voltages it is all guesswork, and I'd rather not gamble the price of a battery pack on guesses.
I can do it once I receive my S60 in a few weeks. Any S75 volunteers?
Also, I need someone to tell me how to read the voltage..
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