Refreshed 2021+ Model X and Model X Plaid waiting room

[Cutch26]

We are like children and delivery day is our Christmas. Tesla are the stupid adults who keep pushing the date and making us miserable. And, as you might know, kids throw tantrums...

Lmao fair enough

 

[smetho]

Lmao fair enough

I'm not getting mine anytime soon so I'm totally calm, by the way. I'd like to see some progress though, some information, or a preliminary timeline. I think people respond better when told what's going on and how they plan to solve it. Even if that's a "we need to prioritize the S for now due to part shortage".

 

[sachcan9]

BMW has a revenue stream to divert, for instance, because they make approximately one gigaton of dollars per year on the South Carolina plant alone. They can afford to donate blood to the EV effort without betting the company on it. Which is how you build a sustainable new product line. The onyl reason Tesla was able to do it was because we had a regulatory structure designed to foster innovation in this space. That's fine for lighting a fire but you can't keep a fire going with tinder.

Now Tesla is struggling to get as big as even the smallest indy manufacturers like Mazda and Subaru while simultaneously launching new product and continuing to innovate. Because that's hard as hell, they are not going as fast as they've promised. If you pay even a little bit of attention to the industry, that's not surprising. It's possible to squander a seemingly insurmountable lead (cf GM). It's possible for shareholders to demand you cash out (cf the entire french and italian auto industries). All of this is on the table in the next 10 years for Tesla, as possible realities in addition to success and gaining an even larger lead.

Tesla doesn't have government motors backing. VW, Toyota, GM/Ford, et al. do. That's not to be ignored. I think Tesla will survive but I think its share of the pie is about to shrink a LOT.

Meanwhile, I just want a 40/20/40 second row in my X.

All of this is logically true except you are forgetting one thing: Tesla isn't a car company, they are a tech company who happens to make cars. Aside from their car lineup they have the solar and backup battery market completely cornered (not to mention all the other crazy stuff Musk is into). I am sure that if they needed to, they could go to a number of massive VCs and get a huge injection of funds at the blink of an eye. If anything, they could probably end up buying one of these small startup EV makers and consolidate them to eliminate any real competition. That being said, I think Tesla's biggest issue right now is that they are completely neglecting the fact that they are beholden to their stakeholders and those stakeholders are now seeing that this company has a MAJOR flaw when it comes to its servicing platform. This is why inventors are rarely successful on their own. They need a business savvy partner to help handle the things that they cannot deal with. My only concern for Tesla (being a longtime owner and hoping to continue to be in the long run) is that they continue down this path of being completely detached from their customer base and coasting only on their innovations. I hope this changes soon because, in a free market, customers can quickly change their loyalty if they continually feel neglected

 

[jbrowdy]

You can't just throw that out there without giving at least one reason...

- Ford, a well established car company, invested half a billion dollars in them
- Amazon threw about the same amount of cash them and ordered a massive number of trucks from them
- Their CEO and founder is an MIT grad and seems to understand engineering. He is in touch with customers and appears to be a mature leader
- They are wisely taking a number of things out of Tesla’s playbook with a growing charging network, an insurance product and a great warrantee
- Their two launch vehicles promise 300+ range and impressive 0-60 times on par with the MX
- The R1S and R1T have four motors, allowing the vehicles to do some very unique off road maneuvers
- As of now, they are not competing directly with anyone for their target audience (off road enthusiasts/adventure seekers who want a high performance vehicle that can be a daily driver as easily as it can off road)
- They are about to launch their first vehicles in September
- The vehicle will charge your house like the F-150 if in need of backup power
- The cars look awesome

 

[Richbot]

All of this is logically true except you are forgetting one thing: Tesla isn't a car company, they are a tech company who happens to make cars. Aside from their car lineup they have the solar and backup battery market completely cornered (not to mention all the other crazy stuff Musk is into). I am sure that if they needed to, they could go to a number of massive VCs and get a huge injection of funds at the blink of an eye. If anything, they could probably end up buying one of these small startup EV makers and consolidate them to eliminate any real competition. That being said, I think Tesla's biggest issue right now is that they are completely neglecting the fact that they are beholden to their stakeholders and those stakeholders are now seeing that this company has a MAJOR flaw when it comes to its servicing platform. This is why inventors are rarely successful on their own. They need a business savvy partner to help handle the things that they cannot deal with. My only concern for Tesla (being a longtime owner and hoping to continue to be in the long run) is that they continue down this path of being completely detached from their customer base and coasting only on their innovations. I hope this changes soon because, in a free market, customers can quickly change their loyalty if they continually feel neglected

I keep hearing this "they're not a car company they're a tech company" line and yet

They spend almost all of their money on cars, and almost all of their revenue is from selling cars. It's almost like cars are tech

 

[newtnyc]

- Ford, a well established car company, invested half a billion dollars in them
- Amazon threw about the same amount of cash them and ordered a massive number of trucks from them
- Their CEO and founder is an MIT grad and seems to understand engineering. He is in touch with customers and appears to be a mature leader
- They are wisely taking a number of things out of Tesla’s playbook with a growing charging network, an insurance product and a great warrantee
- Their two launch vehicles promise 300+ range and impressive 0-60 times on par with the MX
- The R1S and R1T have four motors, allowing the vehicles to do some very unique off road maneuvers
- As of now, they are not competing directly with anyone for their target audience (off road enthusiasts/adventure seekers who want a high performance vehicle that can be a daily driver as easily as it can off road)
- They are about to launch their first vehicles in September
- The vehicle will charge your house like the F-150 if in need of backup power
- The cars look awesome

This prompted me to take a look. The charging network looks promising. In fact, if they can do everything their website says they will do, and improve on what they build then we may finally have a choice albeit a slow grind based one. But, if they can deliver that SuV for 81K with the ability to take it long distance then game on. As of today, they get to earn interest on 1000 dollars of my money until I decide to either get their car or the 1K refund. Tesla is I'm control - there is no competition and none in sight. I'll support Rivian if they give me a reason to.

 

[newtnyc]

I keep hearing this "they're not a car company they're a tech company" line and yet

They spend almost all of their money on cars, and almost all of their revenue is from selling cars. It's almost like cars are tech

Yup. That line worked when the M3 was laden with build quality problems. Was often repeated when the model Y came out. It is kind of a moot point now since they will cease to exist unless they sold cars. They are now selling cars for 130K+. That makes them a car company.

 

[jbrowdy]

This prompted me to take a look. The charging network looks promising. In fact, if they can do everything their website says they will do, and improve on what they build then we may finally have a choice albeit a slow grind based one. But, if they can deliver that SuV for 81K with the ability to take it long distance then game on. As of today, they get to earn interest on 1000 dollars of my money until I decide to either get their car or the 1K refund. Tesla is I'm control - there is no competition and none in sight. I'll support Rivian if they give me a reason to.

Excellent point. I forgot to add that all of the above for less money than a MX

 

[Richbot]

- Ford, a well established car company, invested half a billion dollars in them
- Amazon threw about the same amount of cash them and ordered a massive number of trucks from them
- Their CEO and founder is an MIT grad and seems to understand engineering. He is in touch with customers and appears to be a mature leader
- They are wisely taking a number of things out of Tesla’s playbook with a growing charging network, an insurance product and a great warrantee
- Their two launch vehicles promise 300+ range and impressive 0-60 times on par with the MX
- The R1S and R1T have four motors, allowing the vehicles to do some very unique off road maneuvers
- As of now, they are not competing directly with anyone for their target audience (off road enthusiasts/adventure seekers who want a high performance vehicle that can be a daily driver as easily as it can off road)
- They are about to launch their first vehicles in September
- The vehicle will charge your house like the F-150 if in need of backup power
- The cars look awesome

Charge your house? heh

I think Tesla is about to face significant downward price pressure on the S and X. In 2024 when the competition has finally started making cars in significant volumes.

 

[TWENT2]

All of this is logically true except you are forgetting one thing: Tesla isn't a car company, they are a tech company who happens to make cars. Aside from their car lineup they have the solar and backup battery market completely cornered (not to mention all the other crazy stuff Musk is into). I am sure that if they needed to, they could go to a number of massive VCs and get a huge injection of funds at the blink of an eye. If anything, they could probably end up buying one of these small startup EV makers and consolidate them to eliminate any real competition. That being said, I think Tesla's biggest issue right now is that they are completely neglecting the fact that they are beholden to their stakeholders and those stakeholders are now seeing that this company has a MAJOR flaw when it comes to its servicing platform. This is why inventors are rarely successful on their own. They need a business savvy partner to help handle the things that they cannot deal with. My only concern for Tesla (being a longtime owner and hoping to continue to be in the long run) is that they continue down this path of being completely detached from their customer base and coasting only on their innovations. I hope this changes soon because, in a free market, customers can quickly change their loyalty if they continually feel neglected

Also, don't forget that Tesla could literally BUY Daimler (Mercedes) without even asking shareholders...

Breakingviews - Daimler could be Elon Musk's Time Warner

Electric-car maker Tesla is worth an eye-popping $540 billion despite a puny 0.8% global market share. It's an opportunity for boss Elon Musk to use the company's hyped-up stock to merge with an old-line business, just as AOL did with media titan Time Warner 20 years ago...

www.google.com

"Under U.S. stock-exchange rules, Tesla would only need shareholder approval if it increased its outstanding shares by 20%. At Tesla’s current equity value, Musk could theoretically snap up a target worth $100 billion or more. With a luxurious 40% premium, he could buy the Benz empire without even asking permission."

 

[TWENT2]

I keep hearing this "they're not a car company they're a tech company" line and yet

They spend almost all of their money on cars, and almost all of their revenue is from selling cars. It's almost like cars are tech

One thing that I've always been watching is how they're positioning themselves as a power company. They have beta tests in a couple of markets where their powerwall customers become a virtual power plant. Is it possible that they are positioning themselves to be more than a car company?

 

[jbrowdy]

Charge your house? heh

I think Tesla is about to face significant downward price pressure on the S and X. In 2024 when the competition has finally started making cars in significant volumes.

That was poorly worded and written in a hurry on my phone. According to RJ Scaringe, the CEO, there will be some type of device that you will be able to connect between the car and your home electricity to provide battery backup power in the event of an outage, similar to what the F-150 does. He mentioned this in a roundtable discussion with a bunch of customers he hosted at the factory. It’s somewhere on their website. It apparently will function with the current iteration of vehicles being launched.

This is actually a big deal for some, including me. I live in an area where outages are frequent and I have been looking into solar/battery backup options. I don’t expect any EV can power an entire home, let alone for a meaningful amount of time. But, if you could isolate a few critical circuits (fridge, freezer, maybe a small AC unit), some lights, you could avoid a lot of headaches.

 

[JER85]

This prompted me to take a look. The charging network looks promising. In fact, if they can do everything their website says they will do, and improve on what they build then we may finally have a choice albeit a slow grind based one. But, if they can deliver that SuV for 81K with the ability to take it long distance then game on. As of today, they get to earn interest on 1000 dollars of my money until I decide to either get their car or the 1K refund. Tesla is I'm control - there is no competition and none in sight. I'll support Rivian if they give me a reason to.

I would love to consider a Rivian as an option, but the damn things look so ugly to me. The exterior reminds me of a squared boxy sci-fi robot from the 90s…. It’s such a goofy looking front facade….. and before you guys jump me remember looks are subjective lol.

 

[ammulder]

I don’t expect any EV can power an entire home

Bear in mind that the model X, as well as certainly all the competitive truck offerings, will have a battery as big as 7+ powerwalls. I think that could power a house just fine.

So long as I’m speaking up here, though — you all are nuts. There is no competition. Even if the F150 Lightning is an outstanding EV, they just *doubled* their production plans to 80,000 vehicles — IN 2024! The doubled goal for *all of next year* is a whopping 15,000! Like, under two thousand a month! And as we all know, there are never any unexpected production problems when building EVs (cough, production hell, cough, all Bolts recalled, cough, ID3s parked for manual software updates, cough, Mach-e delays, cough). And that’s still neglecting FSD, the charging network, mobile service, fart mode, and all the rest. The competition is coming.

So, whatever, cancel your order or just grind your teeth. The model X will come when it comes. If you don’t want your spot in line I’ll be happy to move up one. Thanks in advance!

 

[jbrowdy]

Bear in mind that the model X, as well as certainly all the competitive truck offerings, will have a battery as big as 7+ powerwalls. I think that could power a house just fine.

So long as I’m speaking up here, though — you all are nuts. There is no competition. Even if the F150 Lightning is an outstanding EV, they just *doubled* their production plans to 80,000 vehicles — IN 2024! The doubled goal for *all of next year* is a whopping 15,000! Like, under two thousand a month! And as we all know, there are never any unexpected production problems when building EVs (cough, production hell, cough, all Bolts recalled, cough, ID3s parked for manual software updates, cough, Mach-e delays, cough). And that’s still neglecting FSD, the charging network, mobile service, fart mode, and all the rest. The competition is coming.

So, whatever, cancel your order or just grind your teeth. The model X will come when it comes. If you don’t want your spot in line I’ll be happy to move up one. Thanks in advance!

I am hedging. Have reservations on both vehicles. If they are close on date, I will have a tough decision.

 

[jbrowdy]

I would love to consider a Rivian as an option, but the damn things look so ugly to me. The exterior reminds me of a squared boxy sci-fi robot from the 90s…. It’s such a goofy looking front facade….. and before you guys jump me remember looks are subjective lol.

I do kind of agree. Rivian looks a bit funky, but I suspect it looks cooler in person (or, is my brain leading me on to ease the burden of the eternal waiting game on the MX….?). That said, I actually think the MX looks like a beached whale. Always have thought it’s a bit of an odd duck. That said, once inside the X, it’s the best damn driving experience, in my opinion.

One of my partners give me *sugar* about how my MX looks (the one I sold to buy a refreshed MX… ). Asks me how my minivan is doing. He has an Audi eTron that I remind him looks very much like a station wagon…

The MS Plaid as badass looking in my opinion, but was a pain to get in and out of. I had one and sold it in about ten days.

Hard to have it all!

 

[Stro]

I do kind of agree. Rivian looks a bit funky, but I suspect it looks cooler in person (or, is my brain leading me on to ease the burden of the eternal waiting game on the MX….?). That said, I actually think the MX looks like a beached whale. Always have thought it’s a bit of an odd duck. That said, once inside the X, it’s the best damn driving experience, in my opinion.

One of my partners give me *sugar* about how my MX looks (the one I sold to buy a refreshed MX… ). Asks me how my minivan is doing. He has an Audi eTron that I remind him looks very much like a station wagon…

The MS Plaid as badass looking in my opinion, but was a pain to get in and out of. I had one and sold it in about ten days.

Hard to have it all!

I've been inside of a Rivian and it is actually really nice in person. Very clean looking.

 

[Barneybussy]

EDD October (obv not gonna happen). Own 2 teslas. The other EVs out there cannot compete right now and will not for foreseeable future. We are gonna have to wait. Next spring it won't matter and we will all be happy. The new wheel color is amaze.
2/02/21 order white ext black interior 6 seat w FSD.
Good luck to Lucid and Rivian. Production of mass cars is not easy..

 

[Sheldor]

Maybe the delay will mean an option for an actual steering WHEEL.

Seriously though, will be reassuring once we at least see them start being delivered to anyone so we can see reviews about them.

 

[jbrowdy]

I've been inside of a Rivian and it is actually really nice in person. Very clean looking.

@Stro, wow! How did you swing that?