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Russia/Ukraine conflict
- Thread starter amolina
- Start date
Zhelko Dimic
Careful bull
Wow - not sure where you get your data, but all your data re Balkan and Russia is wrong. (*)
Russia did NOTHING other than receive Pristina airport as peacekeepers from Serbians, who requested it. This was at the time NATO was bombarding Serbia, and Serbia was about to surrender, so you can imagine that Serbs would rather surrender airport to Russians than Americans, right? That way they could withdraw orderly.
Further, relationships btw ex-Republics of Yu are mostly normalized, so I don't think anyone feels threatened, and AFAIK there is no Russian base in Serbia.
BTW, Kosovo is part of the Serbia the same way Krimea is part of Ukraine, but I don't see it ever coming back to Serbia.
Double standards are funny...
(*) If you're exposed to part of ex-Yu diaspora that escaped YU, that may be where you're being indoctrinated. Lots of people escaped to Austria - where you seem to be located. My suspicion is that better educated ones continued to countries that are considered rich: Switzerland, Germany, USA and Canada. No proof here, just incidental evidence from flying around that part of the world. Anyhow, my point is that I find old diasporas often carry old hatred and poison, even when situation on the ground changed and people living in ex Yu have moved on.
SwedishAdvocate
Active Member
Tip of Mainstream Media and NGOs and Activist Groups. Get the information out there. A couple of days after the war started the big newspapers here in Sweden informed the public that both IKEA and H&M still did business in Putin's Russia. H&M closed later that evening. IKEA closed the next day. I personally wrote e-mails and chatted with the representatives that I could get a hold of from both companies...
IKEA has however apparently had a rather significant 'presence' in Russia when it comes to supply of wood as a raw material (i think it was). And it appears a bit sketchy whether that side of their business is still ongoing or not. But all their retail buildings have closed.
Artful Dodger
"Neko no me"
Since several of my favorite places are in parts of the former Yugoslavia I find it strange that so many seemingly well-informed people are unaware of even superficial history. Generally it seems most difficult to understand how odd the Yugoslavia structure were and how much Serbians were the largest losers in the breakup, with pretty deep animosity. The amazing thing is that almost entirely the whole area is calm and prosperous. Clearly Slovenia and Croatia had geography, industry and tourist potential that made the transition less difficult for them, not to mention less ethnic stress. Of course BEV fans love Croatia for Rica and Slovenia for Pipistrel, both recently joined with global powerful firms.
SwedishAdvocate
Active Member
Rica?
Did you mean Rimac? Did they join with somebody? Who?
Edit:
This?
".../ In 2018, Volkswagen group subsidiary Porsche Engineering Group GmbH acquired a 10% stake in Rimac to form a development partnership, as part of its electrification process.[9][10][11] Mate Rimac commented: "This partnership now is an important step for Rimac on our way to become a component and system supplier of choice for the industry in electrification, connectivity and the exciting field of Advanced Driver Assistance Systems".[10]
In July 2021, VW Group's Porsche and Rimac announced that they have agreed to create a joint venture that will incorporate Volkswagen's high-performance Bugatti brand. The new venture will be called Bugatti Rimac. Rimac will have a 55% stake in the joint venture, while Porsche will hold a 45% stake in the company. /..."
Source: Rimac Automobili - Wikipedia
Obviously, my indolence made me miss the typo. I won't have a typo on his other major brand, Bugatti!
In order: The Pipistrel Alpha, the only one I have experienced; The Rica Never, the ideal BEV fro those with >$2.5 million in TSLA gains needing to be used, and the Bugatti Veyron 16 cylinders of VW gross engineering using the same piston measurements as the VW Fox and is in desperate need of the Nate Rica touch.
I definitely agree with you on disporas, I'm American-Irish, and been visiting in Dublin the last couple months, and can see that. Also part of it is I've been sighting seeing and going to history museums and such, none of which is flattering for the English.
But I think the major point you're missing about disporas, is that they were the ones that got the worst of the situation and were forced to flee their entire lives and homeland whereas the ones that stayed were more likely better off to begin with. So more hatred from them is completely understandable, especially with also not experiencing any of the reconciliation as well.
I don't know, when my ancestors left The Pale for America after their villages were destroyed in pogroms, I think it was a fairly heterogeneous mix on the ships. Doesn't seem to be much animosity amongst my relatives either, though it was about a century ago.
EVNow
Well-Known Member
bkp_duke
Well-Known Member
To those deep in this thread, this won't be "new", but I found the following video to be a great, in-depth analysis of why we are seeing this conflict play out the way it is.
EVNow
Well-Known Member
Interesting thread on Ruble and why it hasn’t completely collapsed.
We're not even a month into the latest sanctions. The pain has just begun for the Ruble and the Russian economy more largely. I feel badly for those Russians who don't support this war, but they aren't the ones whose homes are being bombed.
The protest slogan applies here: "If Russia stops fighting, there is no war; if Ukraine stops fighting there is no Ukraine."
I think there is a fair degree of just not caring. For the Russian military, life has always been cheap.
Al Jazeera is a fairly good at accurate news reporting. Nobody is 100%, but they are pretty good.
As far as I know the only base Russia has outside of Russia (and territory they claim as Russia such as Crimea) is in Syria. They have a naval base there and a base for their relatively small peace keeping unit.
Wow. I am speechless. Marx with the rest of that crappy group (Engels, etc) are responsible the philosophy that created the biggest massacre in human history. The biggest criminals in history were all followers of the "Communist manifesto". Mao, Lenin, Stalin, Idi Amin, Pol Pot, Ceausescu, Kim Il-sung were all their descendants. And no, we are not arguing about this except if you have first hand experience of what communism meant. I do. World would have been a MUCH better place if those two would have never been born. Period, f'king period. Without those 2 idiots (Marx and Engels), we'd never had Lenin or Stalin or guess what, no Putin either. Not that the Romanovs would have necessarily be better (they were ruthless criminals as well), but I doubt that would have been worse. Half of Europe, most of Asia and a good chunk of Africa suffered because of those two for half of a century at least. There is no hell tough enough for them. And their followers above.
Ayn Rand inspiring oligarchs around the world ??? Really? I guess people should actually read her stuff before commenting.
The russians used to have an insult: некультурный (nekulturny). Back in the Soviet era was a pretty strong one. Something on the lines that you are not smart enough to realize that you're not smart.
And just to make it crystal clear. This is regarding that guy Amir (AmirAminiMD) and not EVNow. He seems so far left (read communist) that'd like for him to have grown behind the Iron Curtain v1.0 to see what his wished for society is in reality. Orwell's books, 1984 and Animal Farm were our reality for God sake.
Especially in todays' situation when Putin tries to bring back the USSR by invading another country, comments like this are insulting to the people that actually experienced the Marxist "Utopia"
Read about 1956 and 1968 invasions. This is standard behavior for the USSR/Russia
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EVNow
Well-Known Member
For someone speechless you wrote a loong comment
Russia is not Marxist, if you haven’t heard and Marx wasn’t Russian.
The person you are looking for is Stalin.
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No Marx, no USSR, no Putin today. The fact that Marx was not russian means nothing. He's the political grandfather of the whole communist experiment. THAT matters. A lot. I had enough relatives in the communist prisons to hate marxism and his creator for the curse that brought to the world.For someone speechless you wrote a loong comment
Russia is not Marxist, if you haven’t heard and Marx wasn’t Russian.
I'm looking for the root cause of Stalin and the others. Namely Marx and Engels. Their pictures alongside with Lenin's and the current dictator's were on the walls of the schools I studied into (by the time I was born, Stalin was already cleansed from most of the history, my parents had to see that criminal's mug on the walls while growing up). Their books were the equivalent of the Holy Bible or Torah or Koran. Again I lived in that "paradise". Except if you did too, trust me on this; it was a living nightmare that no sane person wants to experience...
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Well deep subjects and no offense meant if you are Serbian. Perhaps my comment struck you as if someone had said to my family "weren't you slave owners?" In fact we were, my ancestors traded in slaves. My fathers closet (do you know this expression? A closet is where we keep our fears or secrets) is literally heartbreaking and he's the first person that I know of in his family to have made an effort to read much of it. One letter is simply "Dear Master, I hope you are well. I made it to Canada. May I buy my daughter?" The next could be a shipping loss reported to Lloyds. I am very proud of my father for opening the boxes. Painful, it took him 5 years to bring that letter to the dinner table, but I am blessed, I am used to discussing difficult topics in a fairly forthright manner. The Balkans are just so hard to discuss. Again apologies if I upset you.
I agree relations among the countries are normalized, certainly they are much better.
As to data sources... the coup attempt in Montenegro was widely reported, widely accredited to the GRU. I would expect any google search of the coup would discuss the same points.
GRU agents have been expelled from Kosovo for posing as police and blocking highways during demonstrations.
The airbase I am referring to is a new one for "humanitarian purposes" is maybe the one thing we may disagree about. Serbia say Potatoe Europe says Potato. It looks like a good way to try to put a Russian airbase inside an EU country so GRU agents can be inserted inside a border with no security checks. Serbia is not condemning the attack on the Ukraine and Serbian neighbors are making extraordinary efforts to aid the Ukraine. Today Serbia is Russia's sole friend in Europe, if Russia did nothing else by invading Ukraine it has unified Europe against such aggression. It's a start. So re the airbase. Serbia should shut it all down and post haste, nothing good can come of it and I'd be shocked if EU process moves forward with that base there. One or the other and what matters ? A "humanitarian airbase" staffed by a bunch of GRU agents or EU membership?
If I was counseling Serbia I might start by suggesting an examination of the benefits of being further integrated into Europe compared to being tied to Putins Russia. It's not that having strong ties to Russia are bad, it's that Russia led by Putin has been a disaster for the world. Tragedy after tragedy. Does Serbia need allies that cause tragedies? No, from my outsider view I would say they need economic assistance and opportunities and that is not going to come from Russia. It could come from the EU but Serbia would have to break off the far too close relations with Russia. It could even come from China. But even if from China it will most certainly need to come part and parcel with EU membership. Just my outsiders view.
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I agree.
The official word for Russia is that nuclear is an option if the territory of Russia is threatened.
It would be handy to determine if Crimea is considered part of Russia.
For now it seems like the forces that might remove Putin from power are weak. but opposition is slowly growing.
Just recently another general was placed under "house arrest", the FSB is divided.
Apart for civilian deaths and suffering, the war is progressing well from a Ukrainian point of view.
The longer it drags on in this mode with Russia slowly losing, the more chance of Putin being ousted before a Nuclear war starts.
Unfortunately civilian deaths and suffering are unavoidable, but perhaps they can be limited.
I also think Assad is likely to be toppled, because this kind of foreign war and adventure will become unpopular in Russia. With Russia weakened, Turkey may step up support for the forces fighting Assad.
In the case of Putin and Assad, it is hard to believe the next leader could be worse.
Yep... even if one of the anarchist groups had seized power it could hardly have ended up as badly. EVNOW has been posting some...odd things in this thread and I actually don't have any use for Rand but man...Marx and Engel, what gibberish.Wow. I am speechless. Marx with the rest of that crappy group (Engels, etc) are responsible the philosophy that created the biggest massacre in human history. The biggest criminals in history were all followers of the "Communist manifesto". Mao, Lenin, Stalin, Idi Amin, Pol Pot, Ceausescu, Kim Il-sung were all their descendants. And no, we are not arguing about this except if you have first hand experience of what communism meant. I do. World would have been a MUCH better place if those two would have never been born. Period, f'king period. Without those 2 idiots (Marx and Engels), we'd never had Lenin or Stalin or guess what, no Putin either. Not that the Romanovs would have necessarily be better (they were ruthless criminals as well), but I doubt that would have been worse. Half of Europe, most of Asia and a good chunk of Africa suffered because of those two for half of a century at least. There is no hell tough enough for them. And their followers above.
Ayn Rand inspiring oligarchs around the world ??? Really? I guess people should actually read her stuff before commenting.
The russians used to have an insult: некультурный (nekulturny). Back in the Soviet era was a pretty strong one. Something on the lines that you are not smart enough to realize that you're not smart.
And just to make it crystal clear. This is regarding that guy Amir (AmirAminiMD) and not EVNow. He seems so far left (read communist) that'd like for him to have grown behind the Iron Curtain v1.0 to see what his wished for society is in reality. Orwell's books, 1984 and Animal Farm were our reality for God sake.
Especially in todays' situation when Putin tries to bring back the USSR by invading another country, comments like this are insulting to the people that actually experienced the Marxist "Utopia"
