SpaceX Starship - Integrated Flight Test #2 - Starbase TX - Including Post Launch Dissection

[Grendal]

Update: Launch now scheduled for 7AM CST Saturday November 18, 2023.

Launch Date: November 18
Launch Window: 7:00am CST, 8:00am EST, 5:00am PST (20 minute window)
Launch site: LC-1 - Starbase, Boca Chica Beach, Texas
Core Booster Recovery: Expended in Gulf
Starship Recovery: Water landing near Hawaii
Booster: Super Heavy Booster 9
Starship: Starship 25
Mass: No mass simulator mentioned
Orbit: LEO-ish
Yearly Launch Number: 85

A SpaceX Super Heavy and Starship launch vehicle will launch on its second not quite orbital test flight. The mission will attempt to travel around the world for nearly one full orbit, resulting in a re-entry and splashdown of the Starship near Hawaii. The Super Heavy booster will be expended in the the Gulf of Mexico. This is a test of Stage 0, the booster, full power ascent, Max-Q, stage separation using new hot staging, MECO, A booster stage test of boostback, Boost of Starship to LEO-ish, booster will likely attempt a landing burn into the Gulf, Starship will do one orbit for the re-entry, flip, and landing in water near Hawaii.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1720523323212492904

 

[Bobfitz1]

Launch Date: TBD
Launch Window: TBD
Launch site: LC-1? - Starbase, Boca Chica Beach, Texas
Core Booster Recovery: Expended in Gulf
Starship Recovery: Water landing near Hawaii
Booster: Super Heavy Booster 9
Starship: Starship 25
Mass: No mass simulator mentioned
Orbit: LEO-ish
Yearly Launch Number: TBD

A SpaceX Super Heavy and Starship launch vehicle will launch on its first orbital test flight. The mission will attempt to travel around the world for nearly one full orbit, resulting in a re-entry and splashdown of the Starship near Hawaii. The Super Heavy booster will likely be expended in the the Gulf of Mexico.

Launch pad, booster and Starship all seem to be nearing readiness for the next test flight. Perhaps September/October. Where do things stand with the FAA investigation of issues raised by first test flight? Will all recommendations from the investigation have to be addressed by SpaceX before FAA grants 2nd test launch license?

 

[JB47394]

Will all recommendations from the investigation have to be addressed by SpaceX before FAA grants 2nd test launch license?

I can't find anything on the web, so I'm just kibitzing here, but there are only two problems that are new: the inability of the launch mount foundation to tolerate the thrust, and the failure of the flight termination system to function in a timely manner. Both are being addressed by SpaceX in an overkill fashion. The drama of thrown concrete and a big dust cloud were picked up by the media as a nice dramatic thing to talk about, but the FAA folks know that the changes being made should eliminate that entirely.

As SpaceX represents a certain amount of national prestige, I'm sure the folks at the FAA are of a more collaborative outlook rather than an adversarial one. They want to see Starship fly as much as the next guy. Assuming the next guy is even aware that Starship is a thing...

 

[scaesare]

Was there anything SpaceX publicly discussed as a root cause for the FTS failure to respond promptly?

Comms issue, systems trigger issue, or ship damage preventing correct operation? Or did it fire, but it took the ship too long to succumb to the effect of the explosives?

 

[JB47394]

Or did it fire, but it took the ship too long to succumb to the effect of the explosives?

This is my understanding. In the flight test video, you can see two plumes form when the explosives are set off (3:10 on Starship and 3:12 on the booster). The rocket begins breaking up at 3:59. Elon originally said that they just needed a longer run of detonation cord to unzip the propellant tanks, but they have to work that out with the FAA.

I find that video amazing from the standpoint of structural integrity. The darned thing is tumbling at speed and the interior view of the Starship engine bay doesn't show any flexing at all. Then they detonate explosives on the skin of each vehicle and it still hangs together.

 

[scaesare]

Ah ok... I do remember the "unzipping the tanks" comment.

Elon's companies do engineer some robust hardware...

 

[Grendal]

This is my understanding. In the flight test video, you can see two plumes form when the explosives are set off (3:10 on Starship and 3:12 on the booster). The rocket begins breaking up at 3:59. Elon originally said that they just needed a longer run of detonation cord to unzip the propellant tanks, but they have to work that out with the FAA.

That makes me wonder whether Elon was accurate when he said they activated the system when he said they did. He said it happened at something like 42 seconds. 3 minutes in makes more sense. It was just a matter of adding more explosives in that case. Then the rocket is more robust than they anticipated - which is really good. I expect the FAA will give the go ahead before SpaceX is ready to launch.

 

[TarmacSurfer]

So still no real information. What’s the over / under on this flying before Thanksgiving?

 

[Cosmacelf]

So still no real information. What’s the over / under on this flying before Thanksgiving?

Don’t know, but there’s a charity bet running, and people can pick September, October, November, etc. as their target month. Im sitting on August, but that is a low probability right now I think.

Charity bet #3: first Starship in orbit (redux)

This is a re-run of the Charity bet #2 which is/was to predict when the first time Starship will orbit the earth. All participants must pinky swear they will donate $50 to the winner's chosen charity (to be chosen at time of winning). I am slightly modifying this bet rerun. The upcoming...

teslamotorsclub.com

 

[mongo]

August 31?

https://twitter.com/x/status/1691826072378298850

 

[Electroman]

me thinks.. more like October.. or even November

 

[ecarfan]

What evidence is Marcus House drawing on to support his claim? I don’t understand.

 

[Grendal]

What evidence is Marcus House drawing on to support his claim? I don’t understand.

More than likely, some SpaceX employees working on Starship giving their guesses. So third to fourth hand info... And very early speculation. It's something, but not much more than that.

 

[mongo]

What evidence is Marcus House drawing on to support his claim? I don’t understand.

Tweet->link->link->pdf
District 08 (Gulf of Mexico) Week 33 LNM Available on Navigation Center Website
https://www.navcen.uscg.gov/sites/default/files/pdf/lnms/LNM0833g2023.pdf
Marine warning August 31st east of Brownsville for rocket activities

 

[Electroman]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1691906424891388005

 

[JB47394]

I despise people who start this stuff without supplying their source, and nobody tweeting this has named their source. I guess it's supposed to be obvious to those who follow this more closely than I do.

Coast Guard Notice to Mariners list (pdf) for August 16, 2023. See page 4.

This is a Local Notice to Mariners (LNM), not a launch announcement. It's a great sign of life, but it's not a launch announcement. Separately, the FAA Temporary Flight Restriction hasn't shown up yet, and I'm going on faith that they don't have a launch license.

 

[ecarfan]

Tweet->link->link->pdf
District 08 (Gulf of Mexico) Week 33 LNM Available on Navigation Center Website
https://www.navcen.uscg.gov/sites/default/files/pdf/lnms/LNM0833g2023.pdf
Marine warning August 31st east of Brownsville for rocket activities

Thank you!

I love the language: “Navigational hazards from rocket launching activity may include… descending vehicles or vehicle components, under various means of control.”

Or a complete lack of control.

It’s hard to believe the FAA can move so quickly and approve the next flight right after SpaceX submitted their report.

 

[mongo]

Thank you!

I love the language: “Navigational hazards from rocket launching activity may include… descending vehicles or vehicle components, under various means of control.”

Or a complete lack of control.

It’s hard to believe the FAA can move so quickly and approve the next flight right after SpaceX submitted their report.

FAA hasn't moved (all the way) yet.
SpaceX gave a heads up that something might happen that day.
For OFT-1, FAA approval was granted April 14th and they tried launching the 17th.

 

[JB47394]

FAA hasn't moved (all the way) yet.

They haven't moved at all yet. This is a Local Notice to Mariners (Coast Guard), not a Notice to Airmen (FAA). Certainly there's no launch license. As you say, the license for the first launch came just a few days before the first planned launch date and I assume that timing will hold for the second. The NOTAMs/TFRs started as early as April 5, so that is probably the next thing to watch for.

 

[mongo]

They haven't moved at all yet. This is a Local Notice to Mariners (Coast Guard), not a Notice to Airmen (FAA). Certainly there's no launch license. As you say, the license for the first launch came just a few days before the first planned launch date and I assume that timing will hold for the second. The NOTAMs/TFRs started as early as April 5, so that is probably the next thing to watch for.

NOTAMs are also due to SpaceX submissions. Those tend to need less lead time since ships are slower and stay out longer than planes. Previously, they were 2-4 days ahead of time. I think road closures need earlier approval.

FAA is moving because SpaceX submitted their mishap report, it's just not movement we can see.