Why is the CCS being adopted as the standard?

[Whoze]

Excuse my ignorance, and not to sound like a fanboy, why is the CCS being adopted as the standard? It's bulky and thus waste more precious petrochemical material to manufacture.

 

[E90alex]

Because Tesla initially wanted to keep it to themselves and didn’t open up the design to other manufacturers without massive strings attached for using their patents until recently and it’s too late now for other manufacturers to switch plug designs.

If they were truly open and collaborative to the plug design 10-15 years ago we may be in a different world now.

 

[jeremymc7]

To add CCS is so prevalent world wide now it just seems to becoming the standard.

As with BETA vs VHS, DVD HD vs Blu-Ray or any number of other competing electronic standard the best one is not always the one that wins out in the end.

As I recall Beta was smaller and had better spec. But, and I could be wrong, the associated fees killed it vs VHS.

 

[ATPMSD]

Everyone uses CCS, except Tesla. So if you want the system that supports most cars, you go with CCS.

 

[ATPMSD]

As I recall Beta was smaller and had better spec. But, and I could be wrong, the associated fees killed it vs VHS.

If you are interested

VHS Vs BETA: The Story of the Original Format War

How failure to listen to the market led to the demise of Betamax

medium.com

 

[E90alex]

Everyone uses CCS, except Tesla. So if you want the system that supports most cars, you go with CCS.

Yep. It’s a bit confusing here in North America since Tesla dominates in EV by volume.

But in terms of the actual number of different models of EVs, there’s way more models with CCS than the 4 models with a Tesla plug.

It’s kind of like the Lighting port on the iPhone. Apple wanted to keep it for themselves even though it was much better than the micro USB standard used by other phones at the time.

Maybe Tesla will collaborate with everyone else to develop a next generation universal replacement for both CCS and Tesla. A la the USB-C of the EV world.

 

[gtluke]

Don't forget that European CCS and north American CCS are not compatible. they have a different plug entirely.

 

[ATPMSD]

Don't forget that European CCS and north American CCS are not compatible. they have a different plug entirely.

Well at least CHAdeMO died.

 

[E90alex]

Well at least CHAdeMO died.

Unfortunately it still lives on in the new Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV

 

[henderrj]

Everyone uses CCS, except Tesla. So if you want the system that supports most cars, you go with CCS.

The most models of car yes, the most cars, no. Tesla makes more EVs to this day than any other manufacturer and all other manufacturers combined. In the US at least. And that's really all we're talking about here.

It became a standard because gm, and everybody else involved in the society of automotive engineers decided to call it a standard. They've got the political backing and the monetary backing to pull it off. That, is why it's a standard. However it'll only take one decent size manufacturer to jump ship to nacs, and I think you'll see a mass defection. In spite of what people are saying about them being caught into the old adapter, they don't have that many cars sold yet. So changing wouldn't be that big a deal. Even if they had to go back and change all those cars to the nacs. Probably be simpler to make an adapter though. Similar to what Tesla uses in the magic dock. In fact, Tesla may make that available to anyone who wants to switch to their standard.

 

[E90alex]

The most models of car yes, the most cars, no. Tesla makes more EVs to this day than any other manufacturer and all other manufacturers combined. In the US at least. And that's really all we're talking about here.

It became a standard because gm, and everybody else involved in the society of automotive engineers decided to call it a standard. They've got the political backing and the monetary backing to pull it off. That, is why it's a standard. However it'll only take one decent size manufacturer to jump ship to nacs, and I think you'll see a mass defection. In spite of what people are saying about them being caught into the old adapter, they don't have that many cars sold yet. So changing wouldn't be that big a deal. Even if they had to go back and change all those cars to the nacs. Probably be simpler to make an adapter though. Similar to what Tesla uses in the magic dock. In fact, Tesla may make that available to anyone who wants to switch to their standard.

With Tesla opening up Superchargers to CCS, there is no reason for other manufacturers to switch to the Tesla connector anymore. Other than for aesthetics/packaging. But they will more than likely stick with CCS than admit defeat and use a “competitors” design.

Tesla market share of about 2/3 of the market is shrinking by the day as competitors release new models and ramp production, so we will probably see the rest of the competition combined overtake Tesla in market share in a few years time, at which point the Tesla connector will no longer be the most common.

 

[Cosmacelf]

With Tesla opening up Superchargers to CCS, there is no reason for other manufacturers to switch to the Tesla connector anymore. Other than for aesthetics/packaging. But they will more than likely stick with CCS than admit defeat and use a “competitors” design.

Tesla market share of about 2/3 of the market is shrinking by the day as competitors release new models and ramp production, so we will probably see the rest of the competition combined overtake Tesla in market share in a few years time, at which point the Tesla connector will no longer be the most common.

Tesla is only opening up a small percentage of their Superchargers to CCS. Tesla will maintain an advantage for fast charging.

Based on what I saw today, Tesla market share will remain quite healthy going forward.

 

[RayK]

Well at least CHAdeMO died.

Hey, don't say that! Cheap ChargePoint station near my house, coupled with a desire to recoup my money's worth from the $500 adapter and no home charging, means I use a CHAdeMO station 95% of the time I charge my 3.

Unfortunately it still lives on in the new Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV

Yay!

 

[Whoze]

Because Tesla initially wanted to keep it to themselves and didn’t open up the design to other manufacturers without massive strings attached for using their patents until recently and it’s too late now for other manufacturers to switch plug designs.

If they were truly open and collaborative to the plug design 10-15 years ago we may be in a different world now.

Is that really a fair comment? Tesla was the only US EV maker at the time which would make the CSS a minor player. @gtluke also mentioned that European CSS is not compatible with the US CSS. It still makes sense that the Tesla plug should set the standard going forward, and Musk has indicated his willingness to make Tesla the standard. Since Europe is so conscious about ecology, they should accept the wasted valuable petrochemical material that goes into making the bulky-ass CSS plugs and receptors, and move to a less resource-intense design.

 

[Whoze]

Unfortunately it still lives on in the new Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV

The only two times when Mitsubishi was relevant were making the Zero in WW2 and when Jackie Chan was their promoter (at least in Asia). Haha!

 

[Whoze]

With Tesla opening up Superchargers to CCS, there is no reason for other manufacturers to switch to the Tesla connector anymore. Other than for aesthetics/packaging. But they will more than likely stick with CCS than admit defeat and use a “competitors” design.

Tesla market share of about 2/3 of the market is shrinking by the day as competitors release new models and ramp production, so we will probably see the rest of the competition combined overtake Tesla in market share in a few years time, at which point the Tesla connector will no longer be the most common.

Everyone else should just get Tesla adapters. The F150 EV is already in recall for battery problems, and its sales will take an even further major hit when/if the Cybertruck comes online. With Ford dealers asking $100k for the F150 EV, the Cybertruck will be an able competitor. I don't see Tesla losing substantial market share for at least another decade.

 

[Whoze]

The most models of car yes, the most cars, no. Tesla makes more EVs to this day than any other manufacturer and all other manufacturers combined. In the US at least. And that's really all we're talking about here.

It became a standard because gm, and everybody else involved in the society of automotive engineers decided to call it a standard. They've got the political backing and the monetary backing to pull it off. That, is why it's a standard. However it'll only take one decent size manufacturer to jump ship to nacs, and I think you'll see a mass defection. In spite of what people are saying about them being caught into the old adapter, they don't have that many cars sold yet. So changing wouldn't be that big a deal. Even if they had to go back and change all those cars to the nacs. Probably be simpler to make an adapter though. Similar to what Tesla uses in the magic dock. In fact, Tesla may make that available to anyone who wants to switch to their standard.

Tesla should "open" its Superchargers by saying, "Sure, we can sell you an adapter for your car!"

 

[Whoze]

Hey, don't say that! Cheap ChargePoint station near my house, coupled with a desire to recoup my money's worth from the $500 adapter and no home charging, means I use a CHAdeMO station 95% of the time I charge my 3.

Yay!

I have been using my Tesla Mobile charger on a 120V outlet and so far it works out great. I use a long 12-gauge extension such that the actual "charger" unit remains inside the garage. I'm getting about 40-50 miles every night.

 

[Cosmacelf]

Tesla is not going to allow third party adapters, nor sell standalone adapters for CCS to Supercharger. They are going install Magic Docks on a small subset of Supercharger locations (like 15% tp 20%) that are lightly used. This way they will gain incremental revenue. Allowing CCS access to heavily loaded Superchargers would net them zero additional revenue. Tesla is not that stupid.

 

[Whoze]

So what % does everyone charge their T3 to? I recall Musk saying 80-90%, and the new owner videos say it should be charged to 100% once a month. But my T-app tells me to charge it to 100% every time I set it to 80 or 90%. I am a bit confused here.