19 vs 20 in wheels on model 3 non-performance version...

[TANGO SUKKA]

The aeros with the covers removed and the tesla cap kit look better than the 19s or 20s IMHO. YMMV of course.

It's a downgrade from a performance perspective because the 20s are much larger and heavier than the 18s, while providing 0 performance upside of any kind in exchange for all that useless weight and shorter sidewall.

Throw the same sport tires on the 18s and you should be better off in every measurable way compared to the 20s.

disagree. the 18 inch wheels with or without aeros are the worst part of the car. i don't even know how elon allowed them.

 

[Knightshade]

disagree. the 18 inch wheels with or without aeros are the worst part of the car. i don't even know how elon allowed them.

whereas everyone I've shown pics of both the non-covered 18s with cap kit and the 19s/20s asks some variation of "Why do they make you pay more for the uglier wheels?"

So, like my original post said, YMMV.

 

[Shizzrock]

Yup

The 19/20s look like a junk knockoff in the wrong shade of the much nicer Tsportline wheels.

The 18s without caps just look like decent dark split spokes.

Exactly backward. The 18s without the hubcap look like a junk knockoff of a split spoke. With the hubcap they look like a 90s Caprice
Tsportlines are nice, but they're actually heavier than stock 19s or 20s. The 20s are flow-forged, so I don't know where this junk knockoff angle came from.

Heavier, uglier, wheels with more unsprung weight and no extra width. That's a 3 time loser wheel

And that's from 18s->19s... from 18s->20s is 7 lbs per wheel.... 28 lbs more unspring weight.

They're not uglier, clearly we are at a subjective difference. But once again, it's a 3.5 pound delta between wheel/tire combo from 18 to 20. I wouldn't be surprised if the 19s weighed less than the 18s. You keep talking about wider tires, that will make the 18s heavier, with the most weight at the edges, which is worse for rotational mass. So if you're concerned with weight (which at these numbers is insignificant), you wouldn't use wider tires.

But more weight on each wheel... I'd be pretty surprised if there'd be a measurable difference in net performance between the two though.

There's a measurable difference in cost to replace the tires when the time comes though, plus the cost paid for the uglier wheels up front...

If you look at youtube videos, it seems the 20s are actually faster than the 18s.
So weird you think they're ugly, but nothing I can do about that.

Exactly backward. The 18s will still be more efficient from less spinning mass and look better...and I can easily swap the aero covers back on for road trips too.

If you put wider tires on them they won't. And more of the rotational mass is at the edge, so I wouldn't be surprised if 18s with PS4S are actually less efficient than the 20s. Who cares about the aero covers, I wouldn't be caught dead driving with those things.

 

[Knightshade]

Exactly backward. The 18s without the hubcap look like a junk knockoff of a split spoke. With the hubcap they look like a 90s Caprice

Funny enough- I used to own a 90s caprice... a 1995 Impala SS specifically... after mods it was quicker than most cars Tesla makes (though not all of em) and the stock wheels were quite lovely.

https://www.cruisinclassicsinc.com/galleria_images/414/414_main_l.jpg

Tsportlines are nice, but they're actually heavier than stock 19s or 20s.

Sure but at least you get better looks for the cost/weight.

With the Tesla 19/20s you just get heavier and more expensive for a less attractive wheel compared to the uncovered aeros.

They're not uglier, clearly we are at a subjective difference.

Then, subjectively, they are in fact uglier.

But again- I said YMMV from the start about looks- you started in on the flat no to that

But once again, it's a 3.5 pound delta between wheel/tire combo from 18 to 20. I wouldn't be surprised if the 19s weighed less than the 18s.

Now, see, that's a flat no.

The 19s are 3.5 pounds heavier per wheel than the 18s.

The 20s are heavier again.


The Tesla Model 3 Wheel and Tire Guide

3.5 per wheel from 18s to 19s... 7 lbs per wheel from 18s to 20s... that's 28 lbs of added unsprung weight.

And you don't even get a wider tire for your trouble or $4000 cost.

18s without aero covers are 21.6 lbs per Tsportline...the 19s are 25 lbs... so 3.4 lbs more, per wheel, of unsprung weight.

The 20s are 28.75 lbs... another 3.75 pounds each of unspring weight. So over 7 lbs per wheel added going from 18s to 20s. Plus the much higher cost of the wheels themselves, and eventual replacement tires... plus, uglier
You keep talking about wider tires, that will make the 18s heavier, with the most weight at the edges, which is worse for rotational mass. So if you're concerned with weight (which at these numbers is insignificant), you wouldn't use wider tires.

If you look at youtube videos, it seems the 20s are actually faster than the 18s.

Which videos, specifically, compared them on the same car, same conditions, and most importantly same tires?

So weird you think they're ugly, but nothing I can do about that.

Ditto with you thinking the 19s/20s aren't of course.

 

[timk225]

disagree. the 18 inch wheels with or without aeros are the worst part of the car. i don't even know how elon allowed them.

The answer is very simple. MORE PROFIT. The 18 inch wheels were made to look like they do so you would prefer the 19 inch wheels and PAY MORE MONEY to get them. Tesla uses the same trick to MAKE MORE MONEY by only offering an ugly black color for free, and every other color costs $1000 or more.

But I showed them! I stuck with the 18 inch wheels, and I will only buy the 19s if I can get them cheap (like $50 per wheel) from someone who took them off for aftermarket wheels.

 

[Shizzrock]

Now, see, that's a flat no.

The 19s are 3.5 pounds heavier per wheel than the 18s.

The 20s are heavier again.


The Tesla Model 3 Wheel and Tire Guide

3.5 per wheel from 18s to 19s... 7 lbs per wheel from 18s to 20s... that's 28 lbs of added unsprung weight.

And you don't even get a wider tire for your trouble or $4000 cost.

18s without aero covers are 21.6 lbs per Tsportline...the 19s are 25 lbs... so 3.4 lbs more, per wheel, of unsprung weight.

The 20s are 28.75 lbs... another 3.75 pounds each of unspring weight. So over 7 lbs per wheel added going from 18s to 20s. Plus the much higher cost of the wheels themselves, and eventual replacement tires... plus, uglier

You keep purposely ignoring what I actually said. The wheel AND tire together are a 3.5 pound difference. The 20s weigh 52.5 pounds and the 18s weigh 49 pounds. I think the 19s may actually weigh the same as the 18s when you count the tire. And, a heavier tire adds more rotational mass on the edge, which is worse. So the 19s may actually require less rotational force than the 18s, and they won't look ugly.

 

[Knightshade]

You keep purposely ignoring what I actually said. The wheel AND tire together are a 3.5 pound difference. The 20s weigh 52.5 pounds and the 18s weigh 49 pounds. I think the 19s may actually weigh the same as the 18s when you count the tire. And, a heavier tire adds more rotational mass on the edge, which is worse. So the 19s may actually require less rotational force than the 18s, and they won't look ugly.

Mainly "ignoring" it because it's not really true.

Comparing apples to apples-(that is, with the SAME TIRE in the stock sizes- because if you're caring about performance you're not leaving the crap all seasons on)

https://www.michelinman.com/upload/michelin_us/specifications/specs-pilot-sport-4s.pdf

The PS4 in stock 18 size is 24.82 lbs

In stock 19 size? It's 24.82 lbs

So again, the 19s are 3.5 lbs PER WHEEL heavier than the 18s without aero caps.

In stock 20 size? 23.1 lbs (don't get tricked by the lighter, lower load rated, non-tesla version)

So while the 20s, unlike the 19s, are lighter tires than the 18s, it's only by 1.7 lbs. While each actual wheel is about 7 lbs heavier. Meaning that combo remains the heaviest of all Tesla offers by over 5 lbs per wheel compared to the aeros with PS4s on em.

 

[rdunniii]

Uh...you just verified what I told you

None of those cars with those features are actually for sale to the public

Teslas are.

Beta only. The other do not sell beta software.

/quote]
Here's one from a couple years ago.

Watch A Fully-Autonomous Tesla Drive Itself Around Town And Parallel Park Itself

[/quote]

Thanks!

Aesthetics is a completely subjective thing and I think the Tesla Sport wheels are nicer than the Tsportlines. But I would appreciate staggered wheels to help reduce understeer.

Don't get me wrong, I've been a Tesla shareholder since day 2.and I eagerly await a fully autonomous car because my wife is legally blind and disabled and is therefore dependent on others to get her around. I look forward to buying her a fully autonomous car that can take her where she wants too go when she wants to go. But I'm not a Tesla shill or fanboy and if GM or some other BEV maker comes out with one first that is what she will probably get.

 

[Knightshade]

Aesthetics is a completely subjective thing and I think the Tesla Sport wheels are nicer than the Tsportlines. But I would appreciate staggered wheels to help reduce understeer.

This confuses me a bit, because staggered wheels increase under-steer.... on a RWD car where you desperately need straight-line traction and can put much bigger meats on the back they might still have value...but there's no good reason to put staggered wheels on an AWD Model 3 unless you want more understeer or prefer looks to handling.

 

[rdunniii]

Reading the manual might come in handy right here. Just saying...

I have and it's irrelevant. All the caveats mean is the software should not be available for sale to the public yet.

 

[Knightshade]

I have and it's irrelevant. All the caveats mean is the software should not be available for sale to the public yet.

well, certainly not to people who can't be bothered to learn how to use it correctly.

For the rest of us though it's phenomenally good

It's literally the reason I bought the car.

It improves the drive to/from work by roughly 900,000 percent.

 

[rdunniii]

Ya know, f Tesla had said put down a $500 deposit now and you can beta test the software to your heart's content, with all the caveats. When the real software is out you can pay the remainder and keep the software or you can opt out and get your deposit back and the software will be disabled, participation would probably be more than 95%.

 

[Knightshade]

Ya know, f Tesla had said put down a $500 deposit now and you can beta test the software to your heart's content, with all the caveats. When the real software is out you can pay the remainder and keep the software or you can opt out and get your deposit back and the software will be disabled, participation would probably be more than 95%.

Instead, they charge $5000 that they keep...meaning they only need 9.6% participation to be making more money their way than yours...and they're way above 9.6% take rate on EAP

 

[Msjulie]

well I'm sure you got more opinions then maybe you wanted!

I would go with 19s at time of purchase over 20s afterwards every time. The subtle appearance change is not worth the cost.

I have a Performance 3 but I elected (quite strongly in my mind especially) to not pay for the 20" because of increased curb-ing potential and the weight and the ride. That said, I also strongly did not want the aero rims (I seem to need a brightly colored rim) so I ended up swapping OEM 19" rims onto the car (long story). <- why Tesla doesn't let Performance buyers order OEM 19 (like they do AWD) rims is annoying but I'm sure is a tactic to push the extra upgrades there as well...

For ME, it's the best look with some compromise on weight. The tire is also a compromise, a little more performance a little less range but since I will never track the car, the added performance w/accompanying loss of range was beyond what I wanted to give up there..

YMMV

Good luck

 

[JeffK]

I have and it's irrelevant. All the caveats mean is the software should not be available for sale to the public yet.

This is not the thread for autopilot related stuff, but let me ask you a single question. It is better to have arguably the best software and call it "beta" or to have sub par software and call it production ready even though it's not foolproof.

Now back to wheels/tires. I love my 20s, they look so good!

 

[Sg911]

Best way forward in this is simply to purchase 20 in from those who have shelled out for the P3D+ package, but want aftermarket rims. I did this on mine. My rationale for this was 1) I wanted to fill the wheel well more so the gap is minimized 2) the 19" that I had provided for a pretty rough ride. The rubber on the 20's actually proved to be a softer ride than the 19's. In combination with the MPP coilovers, the handling has been superb.

Many people would question my modifications, but having had many performance vehicles (BMW M3/5 and Audi R8) has taught me that the thrill of the 3-4 seconds to 60 mph is awesome, but after a few months what I value most is the ride and the handling. This is why I prefer to put my extra money on the ride/handling, not to mention the aesthetics of the vehicle.

Maybe I’ll sell him Mine lol

 

[Mjezzi]

Best way forward in this is simply to purchase 20 in from those who have shelled out for the P3D+ package, but want aftermarket rims. I did this on mine. My rationale for this was 1) I wanted to fill the wheel well more so the gap is minimized 2) the 19" that I had provided for a pretty rough ride. The rubber on the 20's actually proved to be a softer ride than the 19's. In combination with the MPP coilovers, the handling has been superb.

Many people would question my modifications, but having had many performance vehicles (BMW M3/5 and Audi R8) has taught me that the thrill of the 3-4 seconds to 60 mph is awesome, but after a few months what I value most is the ride and the handling. This is why I prefer to put my extra money on the ride/handling, not to mention the aesthetics of the vehicle.

I also got the 20” sport rims for my AWD and am considering the MPP sport coilovers. Please tell me more about how the coilovers feel compared to the standard setup!

 

[Mjezzi]

Knightshade, I actually really like the look of the Aero wheels with the covers on. I think they look sharp. Uncovered, I think they look out of place with the rest of the car’s aesthetics. Tesla’s are smooth and curvy like the sport rims. If you would poll 100 people on which looks better, sport rims would be the majority, no doubt. Tesl didn’t make uglier rims for $1,500 more. That would be dumb. And they sell a *sugar* ton of those “ugly” sport rims. Your taste is in the minority. But hey, beautiy is in the eye of the beholder, so to each their own.

The 20” sport rims look fantastic, and the thinner sidewalls of the tire add to the aethetics. Lots of rubber just does not look good. It just doesn’t. I have the 19” sport rims and think they have too much rubber. It just looks a little frumpy to me. 18” wheels are in no way trying to impress. It’s function over form. And if you put summer tires on it, you start to lose the function. Might as well get 19s. I got a set of 20” sport rims and am looking forward to the aesthetics and slight increase in responsiveness when I put them on for summer. I am a little concerned about how the smaller brakes will look.

I actually considered pick up a pair of aeros for touring if I think the range hit of 20s with tires will actually make road trips and weekend ski trips less desirable, but my guess is that I’ll just fine with the one extra stop I need to take. Hopefully I don’t need the Aeros and I can throw winter tires on my 19s. But I may get rid of the 19s and get some Aeros instead.

 

[aspec818]

well I'm sure you got more opinions then maybe you wanted!



I have a Performance 3 but I elected (quite strongly in my mind especially) to not pay for the 20" because of increased curb-ing potential and the weight and the ride. That said, I also strongly did not want the aero rims (I seem to need a brightly colored rim) so I ended up swapping OEM 19" rims onto the car (long story). <- why Tesla doesn't let Performance buyers order OEM 19 (like they do AWD) rims is annoying but I'm sure is a tactic to push the extra upgrades there as well...

For ME, it's the best look with some compromise on weight. The tire is also a compromise, a little more performance a little less range but since I will never track the car, the added performance w/accompanying loss of range was beyond what I wanted to give up there..

YMMV

Good luck

i thought oem 19" wheels don't fit on the Performance 3?

 

[aspec818]

I also got the 20” sport rims for my AWD and am considering the MPP sport coilovers. Please tell me more about how the coilovers feel compared to the standard setup!

have any pics of your current setup? I'm looking at the oem 20" wheels as well. I don't like any of the aftermarket 20's.