Carrera
Member
I don’t have the numbers but I suspect the % of fires per 1,000 cars is similar. The issue in the video is they can’t put the fire out on the Tesla.
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A gearhead buys a Telsa
- Thread starter adaptabl
- Start date
A number of posts ago I spoke about the carrot (EV incentives) or the stick (penalizing ICE vehicles) and said I thought the carrot was a better way to go. Seeing what's happened this last month in Paris (definitely don't think it's all about the gas tax though), the stick didn't work out too well. Whether or not you believe in climate change, people can't deny air quality is the result of vehicle and plant (not the vegetative kind) emissions and for me approaching it in that fashion helps change thinking. What kind of life do you have if you have to wear N95 masks around while outside and who wants to live like that? Granted the VOCs that get in your lungs and don't ever leave are invisible to us and we just see the smog, but we all know the VOCs are there in the air and detrimental to one's healthy lungs.
Carrera
Member
Do you produce enough energy to cover the energy used in the production of your food, clothes, household belongings, the server at the restaurant that drove to work to wait on you, etc, etc? I'm not trying to be difficult but the problem is way beyond what you do.
nwdiver
Well-Known Member
Statistically the ~8MWh/yr I produce in excess of what I use directly is more than enough to offset indirect consumption. The point is that we each make individual choice. If you choose fools fuel over solar/wind you're wrong. If you chose fools fuel over electric you're wrong. If you chose fools fuel for heat over a heat pump you're wrong. We need collective action AND personal accountability.
I also don't understand this nihilism BS. Sure... it's fun and cheeky to say 'nothing you think matters matters'... but at the end of the day put down the pathetic fools fuel nozzle and drive a car with a plug. To say.... what can I do? So why try?.... that's not helpful. Go Solar. Drive electric. Do everything you can.
Carrera
Member
Wow, sure glad that I'm wrong you have all the answers. 
The reality is what you're doing isn't going to make any difference. Why? Because using fossil fuels is part of the problem but not the main problem. Population growth is the main problem. Everything you do is being offset by someone else that was just born or is going to be born. Do some research on population growth especially where the vast majority of the growth will come from over the next 80 years and report back.
And solar power at homes is not cost effective and the wrong direction. We should be doing more large scale projects like Ivanpah.
The reality is what you're doing isn't going to make any difference. Why? Because using fossil fuels is part of the problem but not the main problem. Population growth is the main problem. Everything you do is being offset by someone else that was just born or is going to be born. Do some research on population growth especially where the vast majority of the growth will come from over the next 80 years and report back. And solar power at homes is not cost effective and the wrong direction. We should be doing more large scale projects like Ivanpah.
Pop
Although population can drive greenhouse gases, it can be mitigated from the CO2 perspective. Other types of pollution have to be addressed different ways. Realistically though, population control is the easiest out. The "experts" think a survivable human population is around 1 billion. That's 1/8 of the current population. I guess history will tell us if our technology managed to rescue us in the long run or Mother Nature did the job in a more brutal way. The Earth will go on with or without humans. And there will always be some type of life here until the Sun expands.Wow, sure glad that I'm wrong you have all the answers.
And solar power at homes is not cost effective and the wrong direction. We should be doing more large scale projects like Ivanpah.
nwdiver
Well-Known Member
Wow, sure glad that I'm wrong you have all the answers.
And solar power at homes is not cost effective and the wrong direction. We should be doing more large scale projects like Ivanpah.
.... The LCOE of my rooftop system is ~$0.05/kWh. Ivanpah is ~$0.09/kWh and they have a PPA for $0.135. PV is better than thermal and there are advantages to distributed generation.
Population is not the problem. We can support 50B people living sustainably but not 50M living like Americans. Even we slashed the population our fools fuel addiction will still cause significant hardship.
50 billion?? I don't think so, not without MASSIVE changes to our lives. Even then, I doubt it. I hope it never gets that crowded.
nwdiver
Well-Known Member
Point is that population isn't the problem. It's that most of us are too ignorant, arrogant or selfish to use our most abundant energy source as their primary source of energy.
Anyway, as far as the interview goes, the guy was OK, but I think he was wrong about EVs being "hard to live with". I also don't like some of the slop in the facts that various people in the interview talked about. The one that really bugged me was him saying his display of the distance to objects wasn't working after a software update then a while later saying he thinks it was because he took through a car wash. The software update was not the problem. They also mixed some price and acceleration numbers together. Same thing(s) happened in the 60 minutes interview with Elon Musk.
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I'd like to, but where I live it's dark and cloudy almost all winter, so when I needed to generate solar power the most (for heating) I wouldn't be. I checked out wind power, but realistically with my location the cost is just prohibitive. I did buy a super efficient heat pump though and quit using my natural gas heater. It uses 60% renewable electricity. That along with replacing every light with LEDS and, of course, the Tesla are some things I've done.
voip-ninja
Give me some sugar baby
You also forgot that switching to sustainable energy is out of reach for the typical working class American let alone the other 90% of the planet that can’t afford it.
1 billion people still get heat from burning animal dung for Christ sake.
nwdiver
Well-Known Member
.... how are they getting their energy now? Solar and wind are cheaper than fools fuel. A large chuck is due to pure ignorance. Dung is fine but Kerosene is not. There's still an absurd number of people that use Kerosene lamps when a solar panel, LED and battery would pay for itself in 1 month.
The problem with Americans is they're largely short-sighted and make piss poor financial choices. The average 'Mercan would rather spend $40k on a 2019 Ferd Mustang than $15k on a 6kW solar array... it's pathetic. Why do the right thing for tomorrow when you can do the fun thing for today? It's pathetic.
.... then you have the apologists who dial the Nihilism to 11 with 'Nothing matters anyway so do what makes you feel good and EFF everyone/thing else...... '
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I'd have to agree with this. There is a large percentage of the population that doesn't know how/won't even pencil out the cost/benefit analysis of anything. I don't know if it's our education system or just stupidity. Probably a combination of both. Just one example: I know several people that pay well over $200 per month for cable and cell service, WTF?? I'm constantly working to lower the long term expense on every recurring bill because my retirement "level" is riding on it.
voip-ninja
Give me some sugar baby
Many of those people you disparage rent property and don’t own it., springing for renewables isn’t even an option. Drive around poor blue collar parts of the US and see how many delipidated trailers sitting on a rural lot have solar AND a big diesel truck. Next I suppose you will blame them for bad life choices that left them doing support jobs for white collar types. Jobs like plumber, factory worker, cable company technician, food processor, delivery drivers delivering all of your online purchases, etc..
You know, jobs that make having a middle class white collar life possible.
Clearly though you’ve got it all sorted out and if you were calling the shots this stuff would be sorted. When egalitarian attitudes such as you’ve expressed try to impose their will on working people you get a situation like we see in Paris... “progressive” “smart” French burning their own city down because they are enraged about fuel taxes trying to drive them to punish them for trying to get by.
Having lived in abject poverty and now being relatively well off I find it’s a really bad idea to throw rocks at those who make different choices than I do.
