"Acceleration Boost" option, discussion as to which models and how much quicker

[tvad]

Yeah I think there is no question that Telsa is controlling via software exactly how much power the car is getting and the AWD is still capable of more...
Maybe they purposely want to have this exact difference to separate the Performance models and will always try and maintain it.

There is no question that a Model 3 Dual Motor will always be purposely slower than a Model 3 Performance, exactly as Porsche does with its 911 variants and Cayman vs 911. A Cayman can easily be as fast as an equivalent 911 (Cayman S vs 911 S for example), but Porsche always limits the Cayman so the 911 is faster 0-60.

 

[PACEMD]

I notice keep citing facts and sources and you keep incorrectly calling them asusmptions, while presenting zero sources or facts of your own that in any way disagree with my statements.

So the only assumptions in this entire debate appears to be that you're effectively making... whatever point it is you think you're trying to make.


A 980 is a 980.

If your Tesla with a 980 dies, you order the same replacement part regardless of if your car is a P, AWD, or even RWD.

This would not be the case if there were "special" 980s that were certified for P use versus "regular" 980s.

So no, we know for a fact there's no "special" 980 for Ps.

No assumptions there at all.


Likewise we know for a fact the 990 is a different part because the efficiency testing done by EPA proves that compared to the 980 results.

No assumptions there at all.

Ordering a replacement part with the number 980 does not make it the same part as your original part numberd 980. The number is the same, the part is a replacement and may or may not be the same. And you have no way of knowing if that 980 replacement is specified further by vin or are all the same. Unless you have actually ordered the parts. Play around with online catalogs, parts and parts numbers a bit and tell me how straight forward it is. It ain't. Many other parts of the argument fall out from there, go back through the many discussions on this over time. But let's stop this, seriously.......

 

[Knightshade]

Ordering a replacement part with the number 980 does not make it the same part as your original part numberd 980.

... what?

It makes it sure that it's functionally just as capable as the part it's replacing.

Certainly they might have changed, say, the supplier they use for a component inside... but you won't, ever, get a less capable replacement or one that is not functionally compatible.

And since a 980 is what goes in a P, you know for a fact your replacement 980 will be capable of handling the output a P requires.

And since there's only one 980 part you know for a fact that the 980 in a P and in every other version of the 3 that has a 980 they are all capable of P output since there's no such thing as a special high output 980.

The 990 on the other hand we know for a fact is an actual different part because the EPA has actually tested and measured both parts and found different results between them.

That's on top of the previous explanation of why we know the 990 has to be both of:

Cheaper than a 980 to make
Less capable than a 980 in service.

Because if it wasn't cheaper it wouldn't exist, and if it wasn't less capable it'd be in the P and it's not.

And you have no way of knowing if that 980 replacement is specified further by vin or are all the same.

Yes, I do.

I even told you how we know this exact thing for a fact like 20 posts ago.

It's clear you're not interested in actual facts though so you appear to have ignored yet another one that directly contradicts you to keep pretending any of this is other than a fact

It's not a good look.

 

[voucher2002]

take my money, Tesla. offer "something" for us RWD owners too!

 

[dave999z]

Bought the update this morning, went out to my car and it showed "sport" instead of "standard" acceleration. Launched it a few times on the way to work. Being totally honest - the car was so damn quick already that this doesn't feel all THAT different. But I did feel it. And I noticed that I felt legit nauseous after the second or third launch. (That said, I don't usually do that three times in a row.) I think I felt it pull harder most noticeably in the 15-35 mph window. I'm glad I got it. It's an obnoxious thing to spend $2k on. It's not a steal for what you get; it's not a total ripoff either. I wish they had priced it at $1500, but don't regret buying it. YOLO. YMMV. YOKO ONO.

 

[datoda]

I don't see any technical barriers in why Tesla can't offer performance-on-demand: There's a toggle in the UI to let you opt-in and out of better performance at any time. That way, I can toggle that on and get <my stock 0-60 time - .5 sec> when I go to a track (or when I wanna show the <insert the make/model you despise the most here> next to me who's the boss), and toggle that off when I drive my kids to school. Tesla can charge per-day or per-trip. $10 a day is a fair price, IMHO. Heck, they can even provide multiple performance tiers/durations with different pricing. I'd pay $50 a day for sub-3s 0-60 just to experience what it feels like.

 

[dgo3]

Try this. If you have an iPhone, go to the App Store, search for the Tesla app, and hit the update button (I don't know why it doesn't update the way other apps do). Then launch the Tesla app and you should see the upgrade option there. If not, log out of the app, quit it, restart your phone, and try again.

Thanks. I had already updated the app before posting, but tried a log out and phone reboot. Nada. The app shows the right version, but no upgrade link.

 

[mreynolds767]

Bought the update this morning, went out to my car and it showed "sport" instead of "standard" acceleration. Launched it a few times on the way to work. Being totally honest - the car was so damn quick already that this doesn't feel all THAT different. But I did feel it. And I noticed that I felt legit nauseous after the second or third launch. (That said, I don't usually do that three times in a row.) I think I felt it pull harder most noticeably in the 15-35 mph window. I'm glad I got it. It's an obnoxious thing to spend $2k on. It's not a steal for what you get; it's not a total ripoff either. I wish they had priced it at $1500, but don't regret buying it. YMMV. YOLO. YOKO ONO.

Yeah I agree with that assessment.
You notice it but it is not mind blowing.

Wish it was more power for the $2K or cost less than it did to provide more value.
I do not regret the decision and happy with the purchase ; I also think it is not for everyone given what you actually get for the price.

 

[Star Platinum]

Wish we would stop talking about 980 vs 990. This is stupid. Can someone comment if the boost gives the nauseating feeling that’s felt on the performance models? I know it’s subjective but I like to hear people’s thoughts and stop with the 980 vs 990 and bin motor crap. I heard enough.

 

[dave999z]

Thanks. I had already updated the app before posting, but tried a log out and phone reboot. Nada. The app shows the right version, but no upgrade link.

Perhaps try deleting the Tesla app from your phone and reinstalling it.

 

[dgo3]

Perhaps try deleting the Tesla app from your phone and reinstalling it.

No change. Just emailed support. Weirdly, I had satellite and traffic disappear a couple days ago even though the PC trial is good through 12/31 and I bought the subscription. Support is having IT reinstate. So maybe there's a more general software issue with my account.

 

[EfficientWatts]

Wish we would stop talking about 980 vs 990. This is stupid. Can someone comment if the boost gives the nauseating feeling that’s felt on the performance models? I know it’s subjective but I like to hear people’s thoughts and stop with the 980 vs 990 and bin motor crap. I heard enough.

I do disagree in that it is very possible (and likely) the 980 motors could provide more power than the upgrade gave us. Could be possible (but probably unlikely) a special package could be made for 980 owners.

I think some discussion about 980/990 is ok here. Just need to cut back on some of the snippiness in this thread (wouldn't be surprised if mods come through here).

As for the feeling seems some people in this thread have mentioned it.

 

[PACEMD]

... what?

It makes it sure that it's functionally just as capable as the part it's replacing.

Certainly they might have changed, say, the supplier they use for a component inside... but you won't, ever, get a less capable replacement or one that is not functionally compatible.

And since a 980 is what goes in a P, you know for a fact your replacement 980 will be capable of handling the output a P requires.

And since there's only one 980 part you know for a fact that the 980 in a P and in every other version of the 3 that has a 980 they are all capable of P output since there's no such thing as a special high output 980.

The 990 on the other hand we know for a fact is an actual different part because the EPA has actually tested and measured both parts and found different results between them.

That's on top of the previous explanation of why we know the 990 has to be both of:

Cheaper than a 980 to make
Less capable than a 980 in service.

Because if it wasn't cheaper it wouldn't exist, and if it wasn't less capable it'd be in the P and it's not.





Yes, I do.

I even told you how we know this exact thing for a fact like 20 posts ago.

It's clear you're not interested in actual facts though so you appear to have ignored yet another one that directly contradicts you to keep pretending any of this is other than a fact

It's not a good look.

Yeah, you need to do a bit more research. Seriously.......I'm not trying to fight or be unkind but you are making assumptions. Take a deep breath and consider what we actually know and what is unproven. And beyond that, really, just stop, please......

 

[arghx7]

Does anyone have all the numbers in terms of canbus or other outputs that would help show the actual differences between P cars and AWD+ cars? From what I could gather, the identical front motors still are held back at the AWD+ level by 10kw. The rear motors are held back by at least 10kw as evidenced by the decrease in max power output from the pre-"boosted" numbers. Therefore, the delta in current AWD+ vs P cars should be between 0-15KW (or 0-20HP) entirely coming from the rear motor, instead of the 25+ we see now. In my humble opinion, Tesla is using software to play with the numbers to put a firm half second in between the P and AWD+ cars, even though hardware and existing numbers show the delta is probably about 0.0 to 0.2 seconds tops.

Power P3D AWD+ AWD
Front 186KW 176KW 140KW
Rear 246KW 221KW 231KW
Total 416KW 371KW 332KW
Tot(HP) 558hp 497hp 447hp

Look up threads on Reddit by user Wugz, he's measuring the CANbus data.

 

[Garlan Garner]

If anyone wants to check and see which motor you have....remove your tire and look at this plate.

This is from a P3D+ from Oct 2018.

 

[Star Platinum]

I do disagree in that it is very possible (and likely) the 980 motors could provide more power than the upgrade gave us. Could be possible (but probably unlikely) a special package could be made for 980 owners.

I think some discussion about 980/990 is ok here. Just need to cut back on some of the snippiness in this thread (wouldn't be surprised if mods come through here).

As for the feeling seems some people in this thread have mentioned it.

My opinion is 990 is just a revision motor. Doesn’t mean it’s cheaper to produce or produce less power. I’ve read somewhere either on this thread or the other thread “awd owners who want a p3d-“ that one customer has his 980 replaced with a 990 so that tells me it might not be much difference between the two. And secondly, a lot of UK customer got their M3 awd upgraded to p3d- due to delivery issues (should be 990 motors). So honestly my opinion is that either motors are capable of getting down to 3.2 seconds. But I do get people want to argue with the whole 980 vs 990 because p3d continues to use 980 motor and ELON said it’s bin motors blah blah. He also said p3d will get ludicrous mode, what happen? And one tester already said the p3d motor already exhausted all power and possibly can’t be upgraded any further.

 

[Garlan Garner]

My opinion is 990 is just a revision motor. Doesn’t mean it’s cheaper to produce or produce less power. I’ve read somewhere either on this thread or the other thread “awd owners who want a p3d-“ that one customer has his 980 replaced with a 990 so that tells me it might not be much difference between the two. And secondly, a lot of UK customer got their M3 awd upgraded to p3d- due to delivery issues (should be 990 motors). So honestly my opinion is that either motors are capable of getting down to 3.2 seconds. But I do get people want to argue with the whole 980 vs 990 because p3d continues to use 980 motor and ELON said it’s bin motors blah blah. He also said p3d will get ludicrous mode, what happen? And one tester already said the p3d motor already exhausted all power and possibly can’t be upgraded any further.

Oh boy....there are even more motors.

 

[CMoZ]

The 990 on the other hand we know for a fact is an actual different part because the EPA has actually tested and measured both parts and found different results between them.

That's on top of the previous explanation of why we know the 990 has to be both of:

Cheaper than a 980 to make
Less capable than a 980 in service.

Because if it wasn't cheaper it wouldn't exist, and if it wasn't less capable it'd be in the P and it's not.

You're 100% right on everything about the 980 but re the 990 it wasn't tested by the EPA all the info submitted to the EPA is self reported by Tesla. And Just because it's a different part number doesn't mean the part is different. Parts often get bucketed and labeled for accounting or other business reasons. eg the ROI on the 980 is 10% vs the ROI on 990 is 5% but the parts are functionally identical.

I've seen this first hand with ICE parts and computer parts plenty of times

 

[Garlan Garner]

My opinion is 990 is just a revision motor. Doesn’t mean it’s cheaper to produce or produce less power. I’ve read somewhere either on this thread or the other thread “awd owners who want a p3d-“ that one customer has his 980 replaced with a 990 so that tells me it might not be much difference between the two. And secondly, a lot of UK customer got their M3 awd upgraded to p3d- due to delivery issues (should be 990 motors). So honestly my opinion is that either motors are capable of getting down to 3.2 seconds. But I do get people want to argue with the whole 980 vs 990 because p3d continues to use 980 motor and ELON said it’s bin motors blah blah. He also said p3d will get ludicrous mode, what happen? And one tester already said the p3d motor already exhausted all power and possibly can’t be upgraded any further.

And 2 front motors

 

[Knightshade]

You're 100% right on everything about the 980 but re the 990 it wasn't tested by the EPA all the info submitted to the EPA is self reported by Tesla.

And must be correct under penalty of perjury.

Why would Tesla submit faked data to make the 2 parts "appear" different if they're not different in an obscure government database which they'd face civil and criminal penalties for lying about?

And Just because it's a different part number doesn't mean the part is different. Parts often get bucketed and labeled for accounting or other business reasons. eg the ROI on the 980 is 10% vs the ROI on 990 is 5% but the parts are functionally identical.

I've seen this first hand with ICE parts and computer parts plenty of times

And if the two parts actually measured identically in testing I might find that persuasive. They don't though.

(significantly more in depth discussion of that available in some of the "range" related threads)